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Hearts of Iron IV >  Workshop > csabadass's Workshop > Deo Vindice: A CSA in WWII Mod > Discussions
Deo Vindice: A CSA in WWII Mod
Description Discussions1 Comments1083 Change Notes
Hostile Alpaca Feb 3, 2017 @ 1:09pm
Suggestions
Hello, I hope CSA doesn't mind but I have decided to make a discussion thread so that me and others may put their suggestions for the mod here instead of filling up space in the comments section. I am here to post my suggestions relating to the flags and names of the Fascist and Communist versions of the CSA

Flags:

Regarding flags the biggest problem I have is the look of Commie!CSA's flag, which is similar to the traditional flag of the CSA except it replaces the battle flag with a hammer and sickle. In my opinion it just doesn't look all that great. The two proposals I have would be to replace the flag with the original "Stars and Banners" flag (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/da/Flag_of_the_Confederate_States_of_America_(1861-1863).svg/255px-Flag_of_the_Confederate_States_of_America_(1861-1863).svg.png) or to change it with this neat flag that resembles the battle flag but without stars and has a gear and a hammer in the center, the symbol for Communism in America (http://img07.deviantart.net/768a/i/2013/191/5/2/communist_confederate__by_rlackdoesflags-d6cvuqc.png). However, it's also made by an artist that you likely need to get permission from in order to use it.

Regarding Fascist!CSA's flag I am rather okay with. One suggestion though would be to add the symbol of the Ku Klux Klan into the center of the flag (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ef/KKK.svg/150px-KKK.svg.png)

Names:

Regarding names, the Fascist name needs changing the most, considering it's unlikely that anti-monarchist CSA would rename itself to the Confederate Empire. A proposal I have would be to change it to the Confederation of Dixie or the Confederation of Dixieland.

The Communist name could also change though the People's Confederacy of America is not bad. A proposal I have would be to change it to something like the Southron Social Republic or the Social Republic of Southron America.

These are just my two cents. If anyone else has any more suggestions, feel free to post them here!
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csabadass  [developer] Feb 3, 2017 @ 2:30pm 
Thank you for the suggestions!

The extremist flags are copied straight from Victoria II, and I keep them for continuity's sake for people using the converter.

I must disagree about the fascist CSA name, as I find it more than plausible the Invisible Empire would rename the country the Confederate Empire if it seized power.

Your suggested communist renames are far more radical than anything that happened in history, save for the USSR itself. I think keeping the commie moniker close to the original is more plausible.

I'll certainly keep the other ideas in mind as I update things. Thank you very much for your support of DV!
#1
Hostile Alpaca Feb 3, 2017 @ 2:51pm 
Originally posted by csabadass:
Thank you for the suggestions!

The extremist flags are copied straight from Victoria II, and I keep them for continuity's sake for people using the converter.

I must disagree about the fascist CSA name, as I find it more than plausible the Invisible Empire would rename the country the Confederate Empire if it seized power.

Your suggested communist renames are far more radical than anything that happened in history, save for the USSR itself. I think keeping the commie moniker close to the original is more plausible.

I'll certainly keep the other ideas in mind as I update things. Thank you very much for your support of DV!

Fair points on everything I suppose, minus one thing.

The Invisible Empire was a term used to describe the KKK but only occasionally and was never offically used by the KKK from what I last recall. The term Confederate refers to a Confederation or Confederacy which is a form of government used to describe a loose form of government, reason why the CSA used the term Confederate was because it was pro-State Rights. Essentially the name is an oxymoron, much like something like the Imperial Republic or the Capitalist Commune. If the KKK in this universe seeks to promote southern identity, the Confederation of Dixie seems to be a good name. Just putting up my defense.

Also, how are my Communist renames radical?
#2
csabadass  [developer] Feb 3, 2017 @ 8:09pm 
Names evolve. "Confederate" is as much an identity in a free Dixie (hence the initial capital) as it is a general descriptor of government type.

They are radical in the sense that when Poland, Germany, Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Romania, Bulgaria, Cuba, Korea, Vietnam, and China went communist, they retained those names. Only Russia and Cambodia changed drastically (to my cold-fogged memory). Much as "Confederate" remains the descriptor of Southron identity, I think it would be retained in a communist renaming.
#3
Hostile Alpaca Feb 3, 2017 @ 8:19pm 
Originally posted by csabadass:
Names evolve. "Confederate" is as much an identity in a free Dixie (hence the initial capital) as it is a general descriptor of government type.

They are radical in the sense that when Poland, Germany, Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Romania, Bulgaria, Cuba, Korea, Vietnam, and China went communist, they retained those names. Only Russia and Cambodia changed drastically (to my cold-fogged memory). Much as "Confederate" remains the descriptor of Southron identity, I think it would be retained in a communist renaming.

True, but I still don't think those living in the CSA would not consider themselves Confederate instead of Dixie or Southron, much like those in the USA consider themselves Americans instead of Unionists. The word Empire is still a Monarchical term and rarely has Nationalist/Fascist nations used such titles unless they had a Monarch, sure Nazi German's offical name during those times was the German Reich but Reich can also mean Realm.

But it's your mod so I'll drop the subject. Still, thank you for discussing this with me and I ask you to consider it.
#4
csabadass  [developer] Feb 3, 2017 @ 11:14pm 
Thank you! And I am ever considering suggestions, even as I share my thought processes as they develop and progress.

Your support and interest in DV is much appreciated!!
#5
Hostile Alpaca Feb 10, 2017 @ 3:33pm 
Another suggestion for Socialist CSA would be to rename it as the Confederacy/Confederation of Socialist States.
#6
csabadass  [developer] Feb 10, 2017 @ 6:09pm 
That's not bad.
#7
Hostile Alpaca Feb 10, 2017 @ 6:26pm 
Originally posted by csabadass:
That's not bad.

On completely off-topic subject (kinda) I'm a little curious what made you decide to chose the Fascist and Communist Leaders to be said roles. Reading up on the two they seem rather interesting.
#8
csabadass  [developer] Feb 10, 2017 @ 10:12pm 
Both came to my attention when I was working on expanding/revising CSA ministers for the HoI2 version of the mod, and have pretty much filled those roles ever since. Bilbo...I mean, wow...what a piece of work he was! He was a natural for fascist president. I seem to recall another, long dead, ministers mod tipped me off to Harry L. Mitchell (and the rest of the far-left Southern political figures I wound up using).
#9
Hostile Alpaca Feb 12, 2017 @ 12:04pm 
Another suggestion I had would be taking out one of CSA's generals and using them as the leader of Occupied Senora and perhaps also a Field Marshal for said nation. I am assuming Senora is currently under military control so it would make more sense than a generic mexican governor.
#10
csabadass  [developer] Feb 12, 2017 @ 12:51pm 
Will take that under consideration--TY!
#11
MacComie Apr 5, 2017 @ 3:05pm 
Would you consider adding a "neutral fascist" option to the focus tree? In my alternate timeline, once the Klan siezes power they decide to go a-conquering in Liberia to get lebensraum for the Southern blacks, but that's a bit difficult to do since the fascist branch pushes you towards an alliance with Germany or war with the USA.
#12
csabadass  [developer] Apr 6, 2017 @ 2:39pm 
MacComie: The problem with your suggestion is one of plausibility within the altered timeline, as the CSA only survive thorugh 1936 because of the UK. If the CSA forego the UK's protection to adopt a regime inherently hostile to the USA's interests, their only hope of survival is to secure another protective alliance, as they are essentially begging the US to invade and "reunite" the country. Once the Confederate government is completely in the hands of the Klan's racist inbred morons, there's really nowhere else for them to go but Hitler.
Last edited by csabadass; Apr 6, 2017 @ 2:49pm
#13
MacComie Apr 6, 2017 @ 11:21pm 
Got it.
#14
Firelord Derpy Aug 16, 2017 @ 9:28am 
So I've been playing and the Tech Tree seems to be a generic one, and that's fine but I was thinking something you could do, especially since you're really good at writing Lore, would just be to add a few CSA themed descriptions to the Tech Tree.
#15
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