Mount & Blade: Warband

Mount & Blade: Warband

The Last Days of the Third Age
Oxiras Jan 19, 2017 @ 9:14pm
3 Campaigns done, general feedback and observations.
Hello,

First off I want to say a massive THANK YOU for this mod! It's impressive to see it is still being worked on (I wonder if this is the oldest mod that is actually still being supported?).
I've played a few mods, mainly a few big massive ones. I won't name any so there won't be any 'shamed'. While this mod dwarf in comparison to some of those mods this mod make it up for it by being very polished and much less bugs than any other mod I've played. Quality in textures, animations, sound and music is excellent all the way!

Now onto my feedback and observations. Mind you, I did my last campaign with the nightly build from september I think... I will start a fourth one later this weekend with the latest to see how sieges fare now (so I will leave that observation out... for now)..

The campaigns I played was with Rohan, Gondor and Imladris in that order.

Rohan

The first thing I noticed with Rohan was that they had the "khergit" AI.. Charging blindly into the fray with horses first and their infantry far behind. This certainly made them poor against Isengards and Dunlanders pikes. I'm not suggesting here to change their AI, but look into the formations of orcs and Uruks.
In the game notes, it say orcs and uruks send in their best troops first and weaker ones later. Is this true orc tactic? I thought the orcs sent their weak ones first, forcing them into the charge and if they tried to flee they would get slaughtered by the larger orcs.
Changing the order how orcs and uruks field their troops would give Rohan a better fighting chance in the field as this way their cavalry would be busy with weaker troops while their infantry get a chance to catch up and help against stronger foes later.
This change in tactics will however help the orcs against one of their enemies they desperately need more help againast.. Elves...
This will make the elves waste their precious arrows against weak targets and being forced to face stronger troops with less arrows.

Now onto Gondor, oh dear...
Okay, they're not bad and was an absolute blast to play with! I enjoy a challange and this campaign had me walking around in underwear for quite a while ;) They're just awesome in a bad position.

Imladris,
Okay, expensive troops as "¤&#% but well worth it. I found myself often to turn to other leaders to "deliver gift to allies" to Imladris so I could pay support. If possible, maybe increase the rewards in terms of resource points when completing quests for Imladris? Their traders run out of them very quick..
In this campaign Gondor fell and I faced the frustration with camps spawning.. After Isengard was destroyed the North free people stayed in the area close to Fangorn forest and king Theoden only patrolled between Hornburg and Edoras.
So when the free people decided to go on the attack and razed all four advanced camps of Mordor, Khand, Harad and Umbar the enemy rebuilt their camps before the allies had the chance to recouperate for another attack.. We kept razing their camps for months and nothing happend.
My suggestion to this is that a faction should only be allowed to make an advanced camp if their strength is strong or maybe avarage to avoid this situation.
I actually gave up this campaign, but I consider it a victory anyway since all that was left was a massive grind.
This situation also raised a question..

Will a general die if the player participate in the battle? I do not thing I've seen a general ever die after a battle I participated in, with allies or solo.. There was alot of host vs host battle in this campaign..... I did alot of solo battles too when grinding down Isengard but not once did their generals die on me.

Now onto quests in general

I enjoy the opening quest with the caravan unlike the "beat a robber and collect five men"-quest that the "not named" mega-mods insist on using.. It add alot of flavor and is an excellent presentation of the mod. Thumbs up!

I like most of the mod-specific quests, except one.. Troll hunting as free people.
I think this quest should be a pre-war quest only. During this time we have a small party enough to catch the thing AND it would certainly be an interesting battle to face one or two troll early on. OR, if we had the option when talking to our troops to returing to our own garrison instead of only sending them off for good for a few points.. This way we can adjust our party without losing troops for good if we ever desire to go troll hunting (got another idea about that, more further down). Please, do make them spawn only close to where the questgiver currently resides.. It's hard enough to catch them without having to travel half a day..

Another quest that annoy me is one Native quest that made into this mod.. Catch the spy and his master. How? Not a single troop use blunt weapon.. This leave us with one option, companions only armed with sticks! Make the spy and his master 'lords' so they would only be knocked out instead of killed.

If possible, I would also like that when you do turn down a quest offer it should go into a few days cooldown before they offer it again.. I was a bit annoyed when all lords of Imladris asked me to catch spies in the same day....

Deserters

The first thing I noticed with deserters is that not all types of deserters is having any type of relations with other factions. I was following the 'marshall' and I saw a band of deserters chasing me. I was quite weak and small at that point and they would certainly pose a great threat to me. I thought I was safe when I was following the host but when the deserters attacked me I had to fight that battle alone..
I think it is the deserters with no name that no other faction target. I've seen factions attacked named deserters e.i dunland outcasts.
I wonder, is there a quest to track down deserters that have robbed caravans? If so, it would be rare as most caravans pack enough troops to scare off most deserters..
I hope you can find time to review the deserters and their impact in the map!

Formations

This is something that work in it is own way sometime.. Most of the time when I tell a division to hold position (F1) they walk to another postion close by me if I happend to move around. The workaround for this I use when this happend is that I stand still, tell them to come to me and when they stand next to me I tell them to advance ten paces. After that they will stay put.
Reinforcements and cavalry behavior.. I noticed when you get reinforcements your own cavalry decies to run off to the edge of map when they should be following you. Telling them to follow again won't help, you have to break their formation and then tell to follow to make them follow again.
Special division for companions. I don't know if this effect all companions but I noticed on Dimborn is that he insist on standing with the infantry if the infantry is in formation despite me having put him as an archer.. Once the infantry formation breaks he will stand with the other archers.

Misc

Advanced camps.. I noticed with Beornings that they do not have their archers as recruits in their advanced camps! If one want their archers one would have to travel to woodsmen village. It's same regarding with the Iron hills infantry (but I think that's ok, they're quite speical imo).
More about that idea I mentioned earlier.. If possible, I would love if we could establish our own bases like in Viking Conquest where we can send our excess troops, such as when we need to be small to chase trolls and spies... ;) The base should be acting more than only a place where we can dump troops. When you have enough ranks and influence with a faction you could hire a drill-sergeant who you could recruit troops of that faction. Maybe more options too..

Victory/battle cries for women! Pressing space as a female character result in silence :(

Summing up

It might sound I'm only complaining here but it is far from it. I love this mod. It's easier for me to say where I find something missing, or where something could be adjusted than listing 98% of the mod that I absolutely love! Look it at that way.. What I've listed are things I find less than optimal but everything else I do love ;) As I opened with.. This mod beat the "not named ones" (if you are interested which ones I'm talking about PM me) :)

Once again, thank you for your work! And if you guys ever manage to find out or get in touch with Ancient♥♥♥♥♥♥, please thank him/her for starting all this!
Last edited by Oxiras; Jan 19, 2017 @ 10:16pm
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Showing 1-3 of 3 comments
Kham  [developer] Jan 24, 2017 @ 6:54am 
Thanks for this wonderful feedback. It is rare for us to hear from people who actually completed a few campaigns, so this is quite valuable.

Gondor, for the Good, is the most difficult campaign, as like you said, they are in a bad position and their lords are spread thin. What did you do in times where there is a massive host (Mordor, Khand, Corsairs)?


Looks like you didn't do an Evil playthrough? If you'd like to start one, I suggest Isengard, as they, in my opinion, is just amazingly strong. It's the playthrough that I enjoyed the most. If you want a analogue to Gondor in the Evil side, try Gundabad, as they are in the most challenging position (they are up against elves and dwarves!!)


I agree with you regarding certain quests (catch spymaster; catch runaway serfs). I'll see what I can do.


We've fixed up a few siege scenes, so hopefully those will reduce in frustrating experiences.


If you have more feedback, feel free to keep adding them here.
Aradan3 Jan 25, 2017 @ 8:33am 
I finished a run as lothlorien or something (elves next to moria) and the only bad thing i've seen is how you have to end Isengard.
When they are weak they wont go out as much: no more caravans, no more patrols; so you stay next to isengard alone (cause no one goes there, since they cant siege it) and kill generals as they get out.
I would change the amount of points for the big army spawn, and make the big army like a town or rather a "specified location" like Haneth annun or dead marshes (really bad at names), can be a plain deafault scenario, the point is that lords go there to fight it and not you having to fight that huge force alone (again, it wanders around Isengard and lords dont go near there, most go close to Gondor since there're mordor patrols and war parties).
And maybe make some reference to the ents? make the that army stronger but you get some ents in the fight?

And about an Isengard evil campaign, the only thing i find weird is that they dont have a super elite armor (i had to go get one from Mordor), their strongest i've found was like +20body, +10feet
Oxiras Jan 27, 2017 @ 9:46am 
Originally posted by Kham:

Gondor, for the Good, is the most difficult campaign, as like you said, they are in a bad position and their lords are spread thin. What did you do in times where there is a massive host (Mordor, Khand, Corsairs)?


Looks like you didn't do an Evil playthrough? If you'd like to start one, I suggest Isengard, as they, in my opinion, is just amazingly strong. It's the playthrough that I enjoyed the most. If you want a analogue to Gondor in the Evil side, try Gundabad, as they are in the most challenging position (they are up against elves and dwarves!!)

Hi,

To be true, I wasn't success full with Gondor campaign until my fourth try!
The strategy I used on my fourth try was during the first host summon by the Prince Imrahil was that I did NOT listen to him when he gave me the quest to go scouting when they laid siege to Cair Andros to take it back, I remained by the host at all time as I knew Mordor would come to break off the siege.
When Mordor finally showed up I had to take great care with timing to attack them (or let one host attack and jump into that battle before others showed up) so that as many of my allies would show up and as few of Mordor. This way we beat one host after another one by one. The first summon by Prince Imrahil is crucial to win as this will keep the other Gondor lords having close to full strength when everyone are dismissed.
Other things to keep in mind when playing as Gondor is all about pick your battles. I was seldom walking around with full troop count, trying to keep path-finding and spotting as high as possible to have as good advantaged on the map.
The quest escort refugees/caravans are useful for a Gondor player. I prolonged as long as possible to turn those in as refugees are excellent at attracting scouts and other small parties (and when 'saving' the refugees after they get attacked net you nice points!), caravans are useful to have around to flush out war/raider parties as the caravans actually pack alot of power!
Even if you fail those quests if the get beaten around to badly and you have to make a run for it you will have beaten so many enemy parties the points you get from that will make up for it and more..
Regarding how I handled the big hosts.. If there wasn't a lord (or strong patrol, such as Dol Amroth) close by I ran away. If there are friendly parties close I used same tactics as in the first summon.. Let them attack my allies, or time the attack right to face only one host at the time.
This actually created a very intense situation once which I will remember for a very long time!

During one campaign summoned by Prince Imrahil we were in the area between Minas Morgul and Orc Sentry Camp. We got trapped by Mordor and Harad. Our host got split up, most running away from Mordor and started to follow Harad.
I followed the few that was being attacked by Mordor and soon I was left alone together with Hirluin the Fair. He was a beast! He did not run despite there were four hosts left or Mordor (although, they were scattered), he attacked, I jumped in and we beat off four hosts one by one. In the end he was left with 10 troops, all wounded and a small raider party jumped on him when we were going home and he was instantly defeated and killed too!
Oh, all the emotions at that point.. Now I was stuck too on the wrong side of the river with most of my troops wounded and surrounded with enemies.
I had to send the wounded troops home, disbanded some others and dumped ALL scraps to have as good speed as possible to make a run for it.. I did of course as soon I had the chance return to Hirluins grave to swear vengence!
Good times :)

I will certainly try Gundabad next, or Dol Guldur!
Last edited by Oxiras; Jan 27, 2017 @ 9:46am
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