About the insect glaive controls (edit at the end kept original for anyone this might help)

[deanie666beanie]

So ive been playing monster hunter for a while now, usually my favorite class is the insect glaive but when i started wilds i was using the lance to switch it up a bit. Today I tried the glaive and wow... am I the only one that thinks they went a bit overboard with the controls here? I mean, for example you have 3 different things to aim (focus, kinsect, and hookshot). You gotta mix two of those up together to perform actions that were so simple and easy to do before and the way you jump midair is relative to the way you're facing which means if you arent locked on it can be difficult to go the direction you want to if a tree or monster is blocking your view which can happen a lot jumping around like that.

Im a long time fan of the series, not bashing on the game at all. Just wondering if anyone else noticed the change and did it bother you or am i just being stupid? Maybe there's something im doing wrong but idk. I love this weapon and it really does suck knowing i might just never get used to these new controls.

EDIT: So after some much needed advice from these absolute legends in the comments section I have come to realize this might be the best version of the Insect Glaive in any monster hunter yet, though this is my personal opinion. I am keeping the original post unedited so anyone that might be facing the same frustration as me might stumble upon this thread and hopefully it will help them as much as it has helped me.

In short the solution to my problem was changing some options in the controls that are easily overlooked because there's just so much to configure if you dont pay close attention to every option you wont see them. One of the biggest things that helped was changing the option to toggle focus mode instead of holding it. This was a game changer. Theres a lot of good advice here, just take a look and maybe itll help you if youre struggling with the controls for the IG.

Also remember it might be time consuming but fine tuning the controls to fit what feels the best for you is a must. If you just take the time you're experience with this class will be amazing

[Scipo0419]

Originally posted by Avstah:

IG is a disaster in this game.

Holding L2 for focus mode and doing 3 things on the right side of the controller at the same time is such an unfun nightmare - hold circle to charge while spamming Y combo while keeping aim with the right thumbstick.

You can change this to a toggle, it's a godsend for IG but also really good for other weapons.

Originally posted by Avstah:

All the power of the kit is focused in rising spiral, which means you get extracts and dump them at the first good hitzone opportunity, then ♥♥♥♥ around collecting essences, repeat.

If you're using RSS when there isn't a wound ready then you're gimping yourself. If there's a wound to capitalize on then go to town, but using RSS and then spending time to re-gather extracts is worse than just not using RSS and continuing your normal combos.

Originally posted by Avstah:

Descending thrust requiring a charge is just cumbersome and unnecessary. In world you just tap r2 in the air, in this game air-R2 does the most useless air melee swing for hitzone bug targeting.

I agree that it requiring a charge is unnecessary, they should have it only require a charge if you want it to chain into Descending Slash afterwards like it does now. But it doesn't break the weapon imo.

Originally posted by Avstah:

Strong thrust was removed, which was a really quick pinpoint 2-hit input that you could combo into strong wide sweep. Now if you open with triangle while moving it does this unbelievably sluggish walking poke.

No arguments here, I try to only gap close with Descending Slash or Aerial Attacks depending on the situation.

Originally posted by Avstah:

And to top it all off, we have to get all 3 extracts to make the weapon playable, instead of just getting red like World.

You should have always been trying to get all 3 extracts in World anyway, sure getting Red was fine, but we aren't in a playstyle where you want to get Red/White, hold off on Orange, grab orange to refresh Red/White with a Triple Up anymore. Especially with how easy it is to get and maintain Triple Up even without Focus Strikes there's really no reason to not have it.

[Avstah]

Originally posted by Scipo0419:

You can change this to a toggle, it's a godsend for IG but also really good for other weapons.

Toggling focus mode is not a fix for the right thumb doing 3 tasks at once. Why do people keep repeating this as if it is addressing the issue?

Originally posted by Scipo0419:

If you're using RSS when there isn't a wound ready then you're gimping yourself. If there's a wound to capitalize on then go to town, but using RSS and then spending time to re-gather extracts is worse than just not using RSS and continuing your normal combos.

Wrong, if you have a good opportunity to use RSS where most of the hits will land, you should be using it. You will net way more damage using it and kinsect charging your essences back than doing regular combos.

Originally posted by Scipo0419:

You should have always been trying to get all 3 extracts in World anyway, sure getting Red was fine, but we aren't in a playstyle where you want to get Red/White, hold off on Orange, grab orange to refresh Red/White with a Triple Up anymore. Especially with how easy it is to get and maintain Triple Up even without Focus Strikes there's really no reason to not have it.

If your buffs drop just as a monster gets toppled or put into any advantageous opening, collecting red and getting back into the fight immediately was fine. You could get white and orange soon after. Now you have to waste time collecting ♥♥♥♥, which just feels bad, and there's absolutely no reason for it. It's just a straight up downgrade to the glaive because why?

[deanie666beanie]

@Avstah I understand the frustration bro i do, but im using a mouse and keyboard so maybe there is a disconnect from our experience because of that. I always spend a good amount of time making sure the controls are just right for me in any game, but in this one i spent more time than usual and still managed to miss some things. I honestly dont know if you can so ill ask, is it possible to change the controls around so youre not using the right thumbstick for so much? Personally this is exactly why i use a m/kb and i made the switch when i first built a pc like 8 years ago. I cant even use a controller for any game anymore.

Hopefully someone here can help find a solution, because personally i felt the same exact way until some people pointed out a couple things i missed that changed everything and made this one of the smoothest IG experiences ive ever had in any monster hunter yet. I literally have full control on and off the ground. Can do all the different moves easily and can still utilize shooting the kinsect when i want to without any effort which is nice because even though some claim its not beneficial i have to disagree and say there are certainly circumstances where it comes in handy.

But again i have to say this experience might be different for you if youre using a controller and i completely understand where your frustration comes from. Its just so many different layers of controls to manage and expecting every player to fine tune the controls to make it smoother is a little ridiculous, like... why does it have to be so overly complicated. But i will say if you dont give up and find a way to make it work post it on here to maybe help anyone that might be struggling with the same issues. I really hope there is a solution because personally im now having the most fun with the class that ive ever had. I just wish there was more content to tackle now that ive got it down lol.

[Scipo0419]

Originally posted by Avstah:

Originally posted by Scipo0419:

You can change this to a toggle, it's a godsend for IG but also really good for other weapons.

Toggling focus mode is not a fix for the right thumb doing 3 tasks at once. Why do people keep repeating this as if it is addressing the issue?

I personally don't have any issue with how I hold my controller. I adjust the camera with the LB Target Cam like I did in 4th Gen games if I'm holding B and I can hold B and tap Y or A at the same time without any issues. But I understand that everyone holds their controller differently.

Originally posted by Avstah:

Originally posted by Scipo0419:

If you're using RSS when there isn't a wound ready then you're gimping yourself. If there's a wound to capitalize on then go to town, but using RSS and then spending time to re-gather extracts is worse than just not using RSS and continuing your normal combos.

Wrong, if you have a good opportunity to use RSS where most of the hits will land, you should be using it. You will net way more damage using it and kinsect charging your essences back than doing regular combos.

I personally think you're over valuing RSS, it's really strong but it's not so strong that spending 5-10s trying to get extracts back instead of continuing your combos is worth it if you get bad extract luck on the RSS itself. But to each their own.

Originally posted by Avstah:

Originally posted by Scipo0419:

You should have always been trying to get all 3 extracts in World anyway, sure getting Red was fine, but we aren't in a playstyle where you want to get Red/White, hold off on Orange, grab orange to refresh Red/White with a Triple Up anymore. Especially with how easy it is to get and maintain Triple Up even without Focus Strikes there's really no reason to not have it.

If your buffs drop just as a monster gets toppled or put into any advantageous opening, collecting red and getting back into the fight immediately was fine. You could get white and orange soon after. Now you have to waste time collecting ♥♥♥♥, which just feels bad, and there's absolutely no reason for it. It's just a straight up downgrade to the glaive because why?

See, this is where I'm struggling to understand how you play IG in Wilds. You mention using RSS at every possible opportunity, but now you're talking about a hypothetical situation where your buffs drop as the monster enters an opening. Are you using RSS or not lol. You should never be in a situation where you haven't used RSS in so long that your buffs drop, and if you see they're going to drop try to RSS first anyway.

[Avstah]

Originally posted by Scipo0419:

See, this is where I'm struggling to understand how you play IG in Wilds. You mention using RSS at every possible opportunity, but now you're talking about a hypothetical situation where your buffs drop as the monster enters an opening. Are you using RSS or not lol. You should never be in a situation where you haven't used RSS in so long that your buffs drop, and if you see they're going to drop try to RSS first anyway.

Same situation is true for buffs being spent, I think you're focusing too much on the specific usage of the words "buffs dropping". My example also works just fine for using RSS to generate a topple, then getting red and starting a regular combo on a specific hitzone. If I dunk a flying Rathalos with an RSS and want to go for a tail cut while its down, can send the bug to collect red and start work on the tail (or I might already have red due to the RSS). Since you have to collect all 3 buffs for your weapon to be usable, that dunk will be at least partially wasted.

With the proper moveset available with only red, you have a lot more flexibility in how you approach situations.

[archonsod]

Originally posted by Avstah:

If your buffs drop just as a monster gets toppled or put into any advantageous opening,

You should be able to charged kinsect shot right down it's spine, grabbing all three essences and dishing out a whole lot of damage in the process ...

[Avstah]

Not every bug is capable of getting all 3 on a charged collect, has to have kinsect bonus: harvest extract. And even if they all did, why should it be necessary? It's a straight up nerf from how the glaive was in World.

[StarExile]

I still couldn't play Glaive in this iteration
The controls are complicated to the max for no good reason.

With the freakin Great Sword, I press 1 button in Focus Mode, aim TCS as I please at any given moment in 360 degrees.

Why I need to hold buttons to attack with Glaive and collect all 3 extracts every time I just don't understand.

[xaneKCx]

ive always played recent MH game on MnK and i have no issues binding keys to whatever is comfy...i actually enjoy the Glaive and really don't think its a mess but thats just me and my exp

[archonsod]

Originally posted by Avstah:

Not every bug is capable of getting all 3 on a charged collect, has to have kinsect bonus: harvest extract. And even if they all did, why should it be necessary? It's a straight up nerf from how the glaive was in World.

Not really. The kinsect can attack a lot more (and collect essence while doing it), it's relatively easy to regain all three essences after using them, and being able to combo from the diving thrust into RSS is far more useful, not to mention effective, than World's diving thrust ever was.

[FusionPulse]

You get full extracts for breaking a weakpoint. So you can also play around that.

[Bram]

Originally posted by Dagný:

I've seen people say on YouTube that a controller with back buttons make the difference with IG in wilds.

I never tested it, the weapon finally lost me as a player.

I think this is true for me anyway. Having a back button set to Circle/B helps a lot with holding it while doing other things, like vaulting/dodging with Cross/A or attacking with Triangle/Y. Also, I have one set to R1/RB to be able to fire the Kinsect while holding R2/RT to aim easier since I tend to use R2 with my pointer rather than my middle finger.

[Reizie]

Can anyone holler and confirm that I'm not the only IG main that have no problem with Wilds' IG at all?

I've been using IG since base World pre Iceborne and developed my finger muscle memory using the claw grip. It took me 2-3 hours in the beta to learn all the new moves, potential combos and get used to the new charged moves as well as aiming with focus mode. I'm also still using the default controls and the only setting I changed is turn focus mode from hold to toggle, that's it.

I guess I just got used to pressing or holding both Y and B with my right index finger so my thumb is free on the right stick camera.

The only problem that I have is that sometimes if I'm auto piloting or if I'm distracted talking to a friend, I forget to turn off focus mode and my old muscle memory make me press L3 to sprint but I end up shooting my slinger pod instead.

But now I'm starting to wonder if I'm the only freak who plays the IG normally with "weird" finger movements instead of changing the controls.

(For this post I'm just wanted to ask cause I'm curious, I'll give my advice for IG users in my next comment.)

[Reizie]

I play with a Dual Blade friend who I allow to pop every wound as soon as he sees it (DB focus attack destroys multiple wounds during the entire body spin so there's barely any for me to get my Kinsect buffs)

Here's my tips for extracting buffs from monsters manually.

Method 1: charged Kinsect extract piercing body parts.

-Take the time to hold R2 and hover over each body part to figure out exactly where the 3 colors you need are.
-Find the angle where you can line up to pierce your charged Kinsect extract along a path that will guarantee the buff that you need. For example across the body can tag legs and wings while along the body can tag the tail and head.
(Having a little bit of distance away from the monster help avoid depth calculation jank that makes the Kinsect fly at a weird trajectory)
-Take into account Kinsect speed and monster movement, if it's enraged it may spazz all over so be careful. Sometimes it's better to mount the monster raw with no buffs to down a hyperactive monster and create both an easy opportunity and also wounds to get all 3 buffs from.
(It's better than trying to force a Kinsect to keep up with monsters that are jumping all over with every attack it is spamming, but with good leading you can kinda snipe body parts based on where it's going to be or where it will momentarily pause for an animation)

Method 2: focus mode Kinsect attacking alongside your moves.

-Take the time to learn the Kinsect animations and the flight path for each directional attack that you do in focus mode as well as the range/distance. For example forward and backward Y is generally a straight line towards the reticle, neutral Y is a vertical path from down to up, forward B is a vertical path from top to bottom, left and right Y sweeps the Kinsect left and right respectively etc. (Some of those moves can be mid range as well)
-Pick the right attack for the right occasion. Once you know how the Kinsect flies according to your moves, you can kinda control your Kinsect to touch the body part that you want if the conditions allow.
-The trick is to find the right spot to stand so that the body part that you want is unobstructed so you can actually get your Kinsect there without hitting something else along the way.

This method is less reliable cause there's a VERY high chance that the attack hitbox will get caught on another body part that you don't want due to either weird attack angles or the constant movement shifting body part position. Using charged Kinsect extraction negate getting caught on the wrong color buff and just go straight through to the one you need.

Edit: I forgot to mention that with the piercing extraction method - in my experience - the buff color that you need will never be overwritten by another color even if the Kinsect pierce through every color possible, you will always get the color that you don't have as long as the path hits the right body part.

[Koi]

Originally posted by Avstah:

That doesn't solve anything, the left side isn't the issue. Right side thumb has 3 tasks, hold circle, spam triangle, move thumbstick.

You're getting so many people trying to "fix" your complaints with all these workarounds that can "bypass" the issues without ever adressing why they're an issue in the first place.

gonna quote you here too and add that said 3 tasks is actually 4 as that thumb needs to also be ready to react dodge to stuff in tandem of them.
IG is by far in the most messed up state its ever been in and feels like it was made entirely for a new audience.

Which is actually pretty easy to observe aswell, in most discussions around the glaive, the people that tend to like it in wilds are new players or players giving it a go for the first time in wilds.