Why do people refuse to upgrade their PCs?

[Ken10]

Before anyone whines about it I get the game isn't the best optimized, I've been lucky and had no issues with it and no I know has had major issues with it but I get people with high end rigs are having issues (mostly just with running it at max settings and/or while trying to record/stream but still), but why are there so many people who seem to have just thrown a graphics card in a PC that was already a couple years old when they got it at the start of the pandemic and expect it to run new games flawlessly? It seems to be an issue in the community of every game that comes out

[Ottomic]

Publicado originalmente por bradams:

snip

The problem at the moment with "medium" and below is on big textures, particularly on rocks. Such as:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3457167986

Or:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3461145105

Or:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3461145394

(those are all 2k medium on high res texture pack, rest of settings on mostly medium-low)

You are showing pictures with a lot of smaller detail which don't seem to cause problems. Which is honestly bizarre, but true. You can see it on the mosaic work in the top left here:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3454601410

and here:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3461143242

Or the otherwise impeccable sacks of grain next to the hitching post straight out of a ps2 launch title:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3436691590

Again, I've insisted so much that there must be something wrong with my rig that the people on the official discord have complained that I'm using the troubleshooting channel for non-troubleshooting matters. But, as far as I've been told, it's how it looks to other people as well.

Feel free to set medium preset and go check out those hitching posts in Kunafa, last time I checked after TU1 dropped they still looked as disgusting as it does in that printscreen.

[Leelareso]

are u dum? Optimisation in this game is garbage. no matter on what rig.

[Nobody watches your TTV]

crapcom optimization is crap even when you have top end parts

you're poor so you couldn't afford it but those of us who paid for our own don't like getting half the expected performance.

maybe you don't notice framegen lag because you're on a controller and button combo / iai spirit slash inherently has lag(otherwise button combo wouldn't be consistently activated, and iai spirit slash was just crapcom bringing back a bug they fixed in rise). But it's really there.

[SvegetaX]

Publicado originalmente por IL FENOMENO aka Briliantu:

how can u guys defend this type of behaviour and this relases the game looks ugly as fff gameplay its good but even on highest setting looks ♥♥♥♥ I HAVE 4080 S RYZEN 7 7800 X3D and i can barely have 60 fps on 2k for smooth gameplay i need to use frame gen ffs i dont try to play it on 4k 4080 s its for 2k and still the game runs like ♥♥♥♥ and looks like ♥♥♥♥

You may have other issues that needs it's own post. Here is the same setup as you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QjcS0WxFAxU
It's what you should be getting. And this is a non super.

[LD Montana]

Yeah why don't people stop being poor? The audacity.

[SlyCoop]

Publicado originalmente por Ottomic:

Publicado originalmente por bradams:

snip

The problem at the moment with "medium" and below is on big textures, particularly on rocks. Such as:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3457167986

Or:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3461145105

Or:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3461145394

(those are all 2k medium on high res texture pack, rest of settings on mostly medium-low)

You are showing pictures with a lot of smaller detail which don't seem to cause problems. Which is honestly bizarre, but true. You can see it on the mosaic work in the top left here:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3454601410

and here:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3461143242

Or the otherwise impeccable sacks of grain next to the hitching post straight out of a ps2 launch title:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3436691590

Again, I've insisted so much that there must be something wrong with my rig that the people on the official discord have complained that I'm using the troubleshooting channel for non-troubleshooting matters. But, as far as I've been told, it's how it looks to other people as well.

Feel free to set medium preset and go check out those hitching posts in Kunafa, last time I checked after TU1 dropped they still looked as disgusting as it does in that printscreen.

Laughable the computational power you still need to load those marvellous looking rocks there on medium too.

looks like a PS2 game and runs like a game that the devs forgot to build a console for.

Monster hunter world on high not only looks better than this you can run monster hunter world on hardware that's more than 8 years old on high still with better looking ROCKS!!!.

Hmmm odd that.....

[Gamefever]

Publicado originalmente por Nobody watches your TTV:

crapcom optimization is crap even when you have top end parts

you're poor so you couldn't afford it but those of us who paid for our own don't like getting half the expected performance.

maybe you don't notice framegen lag because you're on a controller and button combo / iai spirit slash inherently has lag(otherwise button combo wouldn't be consistently activated, and iai spirit slash was just crapcom bringing back a bug they fixed in rise). But it's really there.

See this over an over again.

Alright so you want optimization?

Capcom could make this game work on a Potatoe is that it?

Well it certainly could and this game certainly could work on a Potatoe PC.

How?

Well, for one I would remove all the physics simulations and I mean all of them.
So no more foliage moving, that tree swaying in the wind that alternates direction?
GONE!
Grass swaying according to wind direction and responding to dragon induced wind?
GONE
Heck while we are thinking about foliage, ALL enviromental destruction of any kind, GONE!

Remove all cloth physics.
That skirt, that cape, those strings tying your shoes/cape/breeches/etc all GONE!

Remove all forms of bodily physics.
ALL Boobie, butt, legs, arms....ya all of that stuff costs a sh#t Ton of metric FPS.
GONE!

While we are removing bodily physics,
ALL Monster bodily physics that respond to weapon collision is also a physics based calculation against the CPU so all of that stuff has to go!
GONE!

An I promise you after I am done removing all the unneeded physics from this game that a lot of people's 30 FPS in 1080p will actually shoot up ~30-60 FPS!

No BS!

Physics calculations of those types have to be all rendered through the CPU.
Graphics cards dont have universal libraries for those calculations.

All the CPU's allowed in the suggested spec those are all AVX, AVX2 instruction set CPU's.
You know what would be faster?
A better CPU, obviously a better CPU would handle the physics calculations faster. In fact latter models do handle those instruction sets faster.
It'd be faster if say Nvidia's PhysX was being used but support was dropped on that years ago in favor of CPU instruction sets!
Later CPU's can use newer instruction sets such as AVX512 oh wow even more fasta.

So the question is how long would it take to remove all the physics from 20-40 gigs worth of meshes and then ensure that the game still runs properly?
An bear in mind if we do it my way, I mean opening every mesh and removing all the weight paint bones from the meshes and then of course you gotta double check an make sure all the vertices are still weight painted as a result of removing other paints.
This could take realistically no life 6 months working every waking hour, before we get to testing it.

The physics calculations are everywhere in this game, like all over the place and those are your hardest hitting offenders for your FPS loss.
6 months maybe 11 months of work for a few people working 6 days a week min 80 hour work week.
_______________________________________________________

Remove all life cycle load.
All the critters have a life and rot cycle.
ALL critters in the world zone you occupy are accounted for the entire time you are in that zone.
That means the entire zone is tracked and each of those critters an what they are up to as well.
All that has to go.
Might save single digit FPS in the low 1-3.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Create or Create more Occlusion Planes.
An occlusion plane is literally a method to tell the computer do not compute or minimally compute everything beyond this plane.
So these are placed in area's that the camera/player cannot see.
There is a wall in front of you, and you have to go through say a corridor to get to other side, good spot for Occlusion Planes.

No idea if those are in the game or not.
Expected FPS return?
No idea.
_________________________________________________________

The famous "Use more LOD"
Uh an I expect to get low single digit uptick in FPS from using better LOD.
Oh sure that effort was so worth getting 3 FPS in 1080p well done.
BUT I will run game faster in 4K!
By 0.03% FPS, but more better.

The biggest offender for people having an issue is the physics calculations for stuff such as the cloth/hair/body/monster body/all greenery.
Next biggest offender is all the tracking of all simulated life.

[SlyCoop]

Publicado originalmente por Gamefever:

Publicado originalmente por Nobody watches your TTV:

crapcom optimization is crap even when you have top end parts

you're poor so you couldn't afford it but those of us who paid for our own don't like getting half the expected performance.

maybe you don't notice framegen lag because you're on a controller and button combo / iai spirit slash inherently has lag(otherwise button combo wouldn't be consistently activated, and iai spirit slash was just crapcom bringing back a bug they fixed in rise). But it's really there.

See this over an over again.

Alright so you want optimization?

Capcom could make this game work on a Potatoe is that it?

Well it certainly could and this game certainly could work on a Potatoe PC.

How?

Well, for one I would remove all the physics simulations and I mean all of them.
So no more foliage moving, that tree swaying in the wind that alternates direction?
GONE!
Grass swaying according to wind direction and responding to dragon induced wind?
GONE
Heck while we are thinking about foliage, ALL enviromental destruction of any kind, GONE!

Remove all cloth physics.
That skirt, that cape, those strings tying your shoes/cape/breeches/etc all GONE!

Remove all forms of bodily physics.
ALL Boobie, butt, legs, arms....ya all of that stuff costs a sh#t Ton of metric FPS.
GONE!

While we are removing bodily physics,
ALL Monster bodily physics that respond to weapon collision is also a physics based calculation against the CPU so all of that stuff has to go!
GONE!

An I promise you after I am done removing all the unneeded physics from this game that a lot of people's 30 FPS in 1080p will actually shoot up ~30-60 FPS!

No BS!

Physics calculations of those types have to be all rendered through the CPU.
Graphics cards dont have universal libraries for those calculations.

All the CPU's allowed in the suggested spec those are all AVX, AVX2 instruction set CPU's.
You know what would be faster?
A better CPU, obviously a better CPU would handle the physics calculations faster. In fact latter models do handle those instruction sets faster.
It'd be faster if say Nvidia's PhysX was being used but support was dropped on that years ago in favor of CPU instruction sets!
Later CPU's can use newer instruction sets such as AVX512 oh wow even more fasta.

So the question is how long would it take to remove all the physics from 20-40 gigs worth of meshes and then ensure that the game still runs properly?
An bear in mind if we do it my way, I mean opening every mesh and removing all the weight paint bones from the meshes and then of course you gotta double check an make sure all the vertices are still weight painted as a result of removing other paints.
This could take realistically no life 6 months working every waking hour, before we get to testing it.

The physics calculations are everywhere in this game, like all over the place and those are your hardest hitting offenders for your FPS loss.
6 months maybe 11 months of work for a few people working 6 days a week min 80 hour work week.
_______________________________________________________

Remove all life cycle load.
All the critters have a life and rot cycle.
ALL critters in the world zone you occupy are accounted for the entire time you are in that zone.
That means the entire zone is tracked and each of those critters an what they are up to as well.
All that has to go.
Might save single digit FPS in the low 1-3.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Create or Create more Occlusion Planes.
An occlusion plane is literally a method to tell the computer do not compute or minimally compute everything beyond this plane.
So these are placed in area's that the camera/player cannot see.
There is a wall in front of you, and you have to go through say a corridor to get to other side, good spot for Occlusion Planes.

No idea if those are in the game or not.
Expected FPS return?
No idea.
_________________________________________________________

The famous "Use more LOD"
Uh an I expect to get low single digit uptick in FPS from using better LOD.
Oh sure that effort was so worth getting 3 FPS in 1080p well done.
BUT I will run game faster in 4K!
By 0.03% FPS, but more better.

The biggest offender for people having an issue is the physics calculations for stuff such as the cloth/hair/body/monster body/all greenery.
Next biggest offender is all the tracking of all simulated life.

Did we forget about a game called world?

World has pyhsical calculations. Yeah not as complex as wilds but lets not undermine that it was none existant in worlds either but end of day, the sacrifice equals:

- You can only run wilds on high end systems

- You can run world on hardware thats completley inferior to the computational power needed for wilds and is more than 7 years old.

You throw alot of words with evidence sure. But its petty nonsense when you sit back and reflect at the previous 2 entries that came out.

Trying to justify poor decisions is not a hill you want to die on.

Wilds is not a impressive leap from world at all. Anyone who believes that is in denial

[Gamefever]

Publicado originalmente por SlyCoop:

Publicado originalmente por Gamefever:

See this over an over again.

Alright so you want optimization?

Capcom could make this game work on a Potatoe is that it?

Well it certainly could and this game certainly could work on a Potatoe PC.

How?

Well, for one I would remove all the physics simulations and I mean all of them.
So no more foliage moving, that tree swaying in the wind that alternates direction?
GONE!
Grass swaying according to wind direction and responding to dragon induced wind?
GONE
Heck while we are thinking about foliage, ALL enviromental destruction of any kind, GONE!

Remove all cloth physics.
That skirt, that cape, those strings tying your shoes/cape/breeches/etc all GONE!

Remove all forms of bodily physics.
ALL Boobie, butt, legs, arms....ya all of that stuff costs a sh#t Ton of metric FPS.
GONE!

While we are removing bodily physics,
ALL Monster bodily physics that respond to weapon collision is also a physics based calculation against the CPU so all of that stuff has to go!
GONE!

An I promise you after I am done removing all the unneeded physics from this game that a lot of people's 30 FPS in 1080p will actually shoot up ~30-60 FPS!

No BS!

Physics calculations of those types have to be all rendered through the CPU.
Graphics cards dont have universal libraries for those calculations.

All the CPU's allowed in the suggested spec those are all AVX, AVX2 instruction set CPU's.
You know what would be faster?
A better CPU, obviously a better CPU would handle the physics calculations faster. In fact latter models do handle those instruction sets faster.
It'd be faster if say Nvidia's PhysX was being used but support was dropped on that years ago in favor of CPU instruction sets!
Later CPU's can use newer instruction sets such as AVX512 oh wow even more fasta.

So the question is how long would it take to remove all the physics from 20-40 gigs worth of meshes and then ensure that the game still runs properly?
An bear in mind if we do it my way, I mean opening every mesh and removing all the weight paint bones from the meshes and then of course you gotta double check an make sure all the vertices are still weight painted as a result of removing other paints.
This could take realistically no life 6 months working every waking hour, before we get to testing it.

The physics calculations are everywhere in this game, like all over the place and those are your hardest hitting offenders for your FPS loss.
6 months maybe 11 months of work for a few people working 6 days a week min 80 hour work week.
_______________________________________________________

Remove all life cycle load.
All the critters have a life and rot cycle.
ALL critters in the world zone you occupy are accounted for the entire time you are in that zone.
That means the entire zone is tracked and each of those critters an what they are up to as well.
All that has to go.
Might save single digit FPS in the low 1-3.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Create or Create more Occlusion Planes.
An occlusion plane is literally a method to tell the computer do not compute or minimally compute everything beyond this plane.
So these are placed in area's that the camera/player cannot see.
There is a wall in front of you, and you have to go through say a corridor to get to other side, good spot for Occlusion Planes.

No idea if those are in the game or not.
Expected FPS return?
No idea.
_________________________________________________________

The famous "Use more LOD"
Uh an I expect to get low single digit uptick in FPS from using better LOD.
Oh sure that effort was so worth getting 3 FPS in 1080p well done.
BUT I will run game faster in 4K!
By 0.03% FPS, but more better.

The biggest offender for people having an issue is the physics calculations for stuff such as the cloth/hair/body/monster body/all greenery.
Next biggest offender is all the tracking of all simulated life.

Did we forget about a game called world?

World has pyhsical calculations. Yeah not as complex as wilds but lets not undermine that it was none existant in worlds either but end of day, the sacrifice equals:

- You can only run wilds on high end systems

- You can run world on hardware thats completley inferior to the computational power needed for wilds and is more than 7 years old.

You throw alot of words with evidence sure. But its petty nonsense when you sit back and reflect at the previous 2 entries that came out.

Trying to justify poor decisions is not a hill you want to die on.

Never played world.

Oh people are actually playing Wilds on 7+ year old hardware also.
I'm not justifying anything.

I am only saying what I would do if I had to make the game run better and its not too far out of my toolbox as a mod author to figure out how to make a game run better on old hardware I have years of experience doing it.

[SlyCoop]

Publicado originalmente por Gamefever:

Publicado originalmente por SlyCoop:

Did we forget about a game called world?

World has pyhsical calculations. Yeah not as complex as wilds but lets not undermine that it was none existant in worlds either but end of day, the sacrifice equals:

- You can only run wilds on high end systems

- You can run world on hardware thats completley inferior to the computational power needed for wilds and is more than 7 years old.

You throw alot of words with evidence sure. But its petty nonsense when you sit back and reflect at the previous 2 entries that came out.

Trying to justify poor decisions is not a hill you want to die on.

Never played world.

Oh people are actually playing Wilds on 7+ year old hardware also.
I'm not justifying anything.

I am only saying what I would do if I had to make the game run better and its not too far out of my toolbox as a mod author to figure out how to make a game run better on old hardware I have years of experience doing it.

Np its where most the anger stems from. Little consideration was given to older hardware for this title and most of the newer AI technologies designed to try to help that old hardware has been utilised to make the game look less ugly instead.

Its been a huge sacrifice for anything considered mid range.

I think many peoples anger is justified considering how well worlds ran and rise was nice on PC because it was a switch port so it obviously ran great too.

having two very successful enjoyable and running great games to then go to something like wilds is well "wild" pun intended.

[Gamefever]

Shoot guys,
I been authoring mods for games for 20 years, Im an old hand at stuff like that.

IF I removed a lot of the physics based stuff I mentioned it would be night an day difference in how the game ran on machines.

Are there less aggressive ways that say a professional might do it?
Sure maybe.

But dang removing the physics calculations for dang sure give you your largest return in FPS gains no doubt about it.
Would the gains be felt by those with higher end hardware?
Not as much. Low end PC, YES much better.

[Gamefever]

Publicado originalmente por SlyCoop:

Publicado originalmente por Gamefever:

Never played world.

Oh people are actually playing Wilds on 7+ year old hardware also.
I'm not justifying anything.

I am only saying what I would do if I had to make the game run better and its not too far out of my toolbox as a mod author to figure out how to make a game run better on old hardware I have years of experience doing it.

Np its where most the anger stems from. Little consideration was given to older hardware for this title and most of the newer AI technologies designed to try to help that old hardware has been utilised to make the game look less ugly instead.

Its been a huge sacrifice for anything considered mid range.

I think many peoples anger is justified considering how well worlds ran and rise was nice on PC because it was a switch port so it obviously ran great too.

Oh dude, sure.
What I would do is butchery.
The professionals probably rolling their eyes at me, but we modders are well we dont do things professionally so we use a hammer those guys are likely better at it than us haha.

[Jewce86]

Publicado originalmente por Zahkrosis:

So, I run this game at max graphics (somehow) with a 2080ti, and the only lag I get is from their servers or if I forget to close some other application in the background when booting up the game.

I also own a 2080ti, you should look at dlssg-to-fsr3 mod, download the universal pack, and plop the "DLL version" into the main wilds directory. Get REframework from Nexusmods and place that into the main folder. Boot the game, Enable Dlss and enable framegen, exit, restart the game, cap the frame rate to half of what you'd normally achieve (so i cap it to 40) which means it boosts it to smooth 80 with literally everything on max except Ray tracing.

It should go without mentioning that also using Dlss updater and upgrading to the latest version is recommended.

[SlyCoop]

Publicado originalmente por Gamefever:

Shoot guys,
I been authoring mods for games for 20 years, Im an old hand at stuff like that.

IF I removed a lot of the physics based stuff I mentioned it would be night an day difference in how the game ran on machines.

Are there less aggressive ways that say a professional might do it?
Sure maybe.

But dang removing the physics calculations for dang sure give you your largest return in FPS gains no doubt about it.
Would the gains be felt by those with higher end hardware?
Not as much. Low end PC, YES much better.

The trade off is the lack of time devs are given to do more complex and good party tricks i.e Baked lighting over dynamic lighting to save on performance. So they stick it in the engine fast and then utilise AA and AI upscalers aggressively to do the heavy lifting.

Its driving gaming off a cliff and its caused the popularity of indie games to skyrocket as a result.

I guess they are just fine leaving in taxing calculations to the CPU because its too much time to go in a fine tune it as you say.

it would take a miracle of a modder to go in and strip this game down to something playable, but is it worth it? I dont think its worth your time as a modder either. Many people would feel the same.

Its just a big shame.....

[Heart]

Iunno, why can't a company worth more money than every commentator in this thread develop a PC port?