We're part of the problem

[NovaJuice]

Most of the Fallout content I see about New Vegas now is about the fans being insufferable rather than people playing and appreciating the game. I have to say, I agree.

The Fallout show is the perfect opportunity to get people into New Vegas. All we have to do is tell people if they liked the show, New Vegas has the most similar setting and is on Gamepass. But we're ruining this opportunity for ourselves.

I've loved New Vegas ever since I first played it back in the day on PS3, but the community surrounding this game can be extremely offputting at times. Most conversations about Fallout always have some guy busting in to let everyone know that Bethesda Fallout sucks, which is going to immediately alienate people whose first and only Fallout games are 3 or 4. Even conversations about NEW VEGAS always have someone coming in and being an elitist ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ about something. We can't even let people appreciate THE GAME WE LIKE in the "wrong" way.

I used to be this guy.
A lot of New Vegas fans are this guy.

Here's the thing, though. I think New Vegas is the best Fallout game, maybe the best game of all time. Because of that, I think it stands on its own and doesn't need keyboard warriors to defend it.
If New Vegas really is the best Fallout, then we shouldn't be telling people how much better it is than their favorite Fallout game, we should be getting them to play it.

Spoiler alert: being an ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ about how much better New Vegas is than the rest of the franchise won't get people to play the game.

But positivity will. Seriously, the next time someone says they love Fallout 4 just say "If you loved that one, check out New Vegas."

If someone says New Vegas has archaic gameplay, just admit that it's outdated but easy to get used to instead of recommending mods and fixes - most people don't want to fix a game in which they have no emotional investment.

Does it suck that Bethesda doesn't seem to care about the lore? Yes. Does it suck that the franchise seems to be shedding its RPG elements? Absolutely. Is it a little bit disappointing that the popular Fallout games don't fully represent what we see as Fallout? Of course.

But, is any of that going to change because of us arguing with strangers online? No. The only way for Fallout to move toward being more dialogue-driven again is by more people desiring that from Bethesda. The only way we're going to get that is by actually putting people onto New Vegas. And the only way we're going to do THAT is by being a friendly, welcoming, supportive community.

So just tell your friends to check out New Vegas on Gamepass the next time they're talking about the Fallout show, and be understanding if it's not for them - that's just how opinions work. Either way, they're not going to appreciate our Fallout unless we can appreciate their Fallout, and I personally don't want to see this fanbase poison itself.

[Tribe Reimanen]

Nah

[Thermal Lance]

Yes, dad.

[Ladez]

Originally posted by NovaJuice:

I used to be this guy.
A lot of New Vegas fans are this guy.

So are a lot of fans in general.

It's not that your point is not worth having a debate about, but for some reason you're singling out one portion of the fan base. Why?

There are some voices that I think go too far on this board. But I've been the recipient of no small amount of hate for daring to voice criticism of Bethesda Fallout games. I've had to block certain people in the past due to their persistent harrasment.

So if you want to talk about toxicity in the fandom, there is plenty to talk about, but there is self deception or bad faith at play here if you think one side is worse than the other.

[psychotron666]

Get off social media and you'll realize most of these fans online are a small minority, and your life will be more peaceful as well

[Vassago Rain]

>we.
>problem.

Get off the internet once in awhile.

[Gillman]

Originally posted by NovaJuice:

I personally don't want to see this fanbase poison itself.

The franchise has been poisoned for a long time, it's just coming to a head now that the show messing with the west coast fans. Gatekeeping is good, there should be standards that need to be met, in order for a group not to be subverted into something unrecognizable. We are not the problem, but instead the cure.

[Thermal Lance]

What I find funny here is how OP focuses on the New Vegas fandom. Like, pull your head out of the sand my dude, Bethesda meat riders are just as worse. But, no, it's the New Vegas crowd that is the problem...

[NovaJuice]

Originally posted by psychotron666:

Get off social media and you'll realize most of these fans online are a small minority, and your life will be more peaceful as well

I agree with all your points, but understand that those types of toxic fans don't bother me. But the fact of the matter, though, is that a large amount of fan interaction happens online. Few people are going to interact with Fallout fans solely in real life. In fact, I would dare to say that most people getting into Fallout now watched the show and are looking into the games online or are seeing Fallout content resurging, leading to interaction with this community regardless. Either way, this is just about how this fanbase treats new fans online, ergo I'm posting on the online discussion board.

[NovaJuice]

Originally posted by Thermal Lance:

What I find funny here is how OP focuses on the New Vegas fandom. Like, pull your head out of the sand my dude, Bethesda meat riders are just as worse. But, no, it's the New Vegas crowd that is the problem...

Why would I address Bethesda meatriders on the New Vegas forum, my guy? The whole community can be pretty toxic, but I don't think it's a stretch to say New Vegas fans can bring the toxicity even into discussions about the game we all love.

I want more people to enjoy New Vegas, and Bethesda meatriders aren't the ones putting them off...

[jomigaru]

Originally posted by NovaJuice:

Most of the Fallout content I see about New Vegas now is about the fans being insufferable rather than people playing and appreciating the game. I have to say, I agree.

The Fallout show is the perfect opportunity to get people into New Vegas. All we have to do is tell people if they liked the show, New Vegas has the most similar setting and is on Gamepass. But we're ruining this opportunity for ourselves.

I've loved New Vegas ever since I first played it back in the day on PS3, but the community surrounding this game can be extremely offputting at times. Most conversations about Fallout always have some guy busting in to let everyone know that Bethesda Fallout sucks, which is going to immediately alienate people whose first and only Fallout games are 3 or 4. Even conversations about NEW VEGAS always have someone coming in and being an elitist ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ about something. We can't even let people appreciate THE GAME WE LIKE in the "wrong" way.

I used to be this guy.
A lot of New Vegas fans are this guy.

Here's the thing, though. I think New Vegas is the best Fallout game, maybe the best game of all time. Because of that, I think it stands on its own and doesn't need keyboard warriors to defend it.
If New Vegas really is the best Fallout, then we shouldn't be telling people how much better it is than their favorite Fallout game, we should be getting them to play it.

Spoiler alert: being an ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ about how much better New Vegas is than the rest of the franchise won't get people to play the game.

But positivity will. Seriously, the next time someone says they love Fallout 4 just say "If you loved that one, check out New Vegas."

If someone says New Vegas has archaic gameplay, just admit that it's outdated but easy to get used to instead of recommending mods and fixes - most people don't want to fix a game in which they have no emotional investment.

Does it suck that Bethesda doesn't seem to care about the lore? Yes. Does it suck that the franchise seems to be shedding its RPG elements? Absolutely. Is it a little bit disappointing that the popular Fallout games don't fully represent what we see as Fallout? Of course.

But, is any of that going to change because of us arguing with strangers online? No. The only way for Fallout to move toward being more dialogue-driven again is by more people desiring that from Bethesda. The only way we're going to get that is by actually putting people onto New Vegas. And the only way we're going to do THAT is by being a friendly, welcoming, supportive community.

So just tell your friends to check out New Vegas on Gamepass the next time they're talking about the Fallout show, and be understanding if it's not for them - that's just how opinions work. Either way, they're not going to appreciate our Fallout unless we can appreciate their Fallout, and I personally don't want to see this fanbase poison itself.

Good thing I am not the only one thinking this.

"The Fallout show is the perfect opportunity to get people into New Vegas. All we have to do is tell people if they liked the show, New Vegas has the most similar setting and is on Gamepass. But we're ruining this opportunity for ourselves."

In the end it will be a lost cause if Bethesda really wants to put NV events into oblivion. But if the player numbers were high enough...maybe money would make them think twice and NV get a remake.

[NightmareGats]

You posted this on steam, not reddit.

[NovaJuice]

Originally posted by Ladez:

Originally posted by NovaJuice:

I used to be this guy.
A lot of New Vegas fans are this guy.

So are a lot of fans in general.

It's not that your point is not worth having a debate about, but for some reason you're singling out one portion of the fan base. Why?

Why would I address Bethesda Fallout fans on the New Vegas board? There also isn't a good portion of new Fallout fans talking about how toxic Fallout 3/4 fans are, unlike with New Vegas, and I think that's worthy of talking about.

Originally posted by Ladez:

So if you want to talk about toxicity in the fandom, there is plenty to talk about, but there is self deception or bad faith at play here if you think one side is worse than the other.

There absolutely is a discussion to be had about the tribal mindset surrounding each Fallout game, but I don't think it's right to call out Bethesda Fallout fans on a board that automatically won't include them.
Besides, I mainly care about new people experiencing New Vegas, and they're not going to want to engage with a community that's so negative about the Fallout thing they just got done enjoying. Most people aren't going to start with New Vegas, and that's okay. But, I do want them to play it so that the new community can see what New Vegas does well and hopefully vocalize that they want those elements included in a greater degree in Bethesda games.

[jomigaru]

Originally posted by NovaJuice:

Besides, I mainly care about new people experiencing New Vegas, and they're not going to want to engage with a community that's so negative about the Fallout thing they just got done enjoying. Most people aren't going to start with New Vegas, and that's okay. But, I do want them to play it so that the new community can see what New Vegas does well and hopefully vocalize that they want those elements included in a greater degree in Bethesda games.

Specially when New Vegas requires some minor modding to run smoothly. The thing is many potential players show up, take a peek and vanish because of the toxicity. Buuut the toxicity is not exclusive from this forum. Its as bad or worse in FO4 and F76. And that comes from someone who played and enjoyed both of them (and "suffered" those forums)...
...but there is no Fallout like NV.

[Ciaran Zagami]

No we don't need more people in the fandom.

Every day, I pray for the death of Fallout.
Because I don't want it to end up like CoD or GTA. Though I suppose it has already.

The series is slipping, every entry gets further and further from the themes and style of Fallout 1, 2 and New Vegas. About society recovering and people rebuilding in the face of horrible tragedy. Yes, war is cruel and unchanging. But the same human stubbornness that drives conflict also drives renewal and creates hope.

At it's heart, Fallout is a hopeful series.
Despite the nukes, despite Vault Tech, despite the mutants and the Enclave trying to start another genocide. People survive, someone will do right and save the day. Society will rebuild, the wasteland will be tamed and life will go on.

But under Bethesda, Fallout is little more than a cheap borderlands rip off. A single player looter shooter with "wacky" special items and flashy red text special affects. Tedious radiant quest design and one dimensional characters written more for laughter than for serious contemplation.

Never forget, that when 76 came out. Bethesda was genuinely shocked fans wanted to role play, not just kill and loot each other on sight PubG/Fornite style.
They do not understand us or what drew us to Fallout in the first place.

Better that they stop making games, stop making shows and stop making crappy merch and let a new series take the spot light of mainstream post apocalypse role playing game.

[Kianooshsh]

dude ♥♥♥♥ this game. I came from show and this game won't even ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ run