[Fallout: New Vegas] [Opinion] Caesar's Legion is a Failure

[HappyPapaya]

Before we start, I wanted to make clear a few things.
1. Caesar's Legion won't fall once Caesar (Edward Sallow) dies.
2. Caesar's Legion follows Mars, not Caesar.
3. Once Edward Sallow dies, Lanius takes over.
4. Thanks to dialogue and certain events in the game, we know Lanius cares for the Legion and believes in the Legion's ideals.
5. If the current Caesar dies, someone else (the most poweful one or the one the Legion looks up to the most) will replace him.
6. Slaves aren't seen as people, just slaves.
7. Women aren't warriors, but back in the most "civilized" areas of the Legion, where they aren't at war against other nations/factions, they are priestess or healers.
8. The Legion knows how to use guns and other kinds of technologies against it's enemies, they just consider certain items (technologies, healing items, etc) as honorless and thus they won't use them.
9. The Legion is way more competent than the New California Republic.
10. Without the Courier's intervention, it's most likely the Legion would win thanks to the NCR's incompetence.
11. Nothing lasts forever.
12. All hail Timothy.

With that out of the way, let's begin:

-What is the Legion?-
The Legion is a tribe founded on the year 2246 by Edward Sallow, member of the Followers of the Apocalypse, with the help of the Mormon missionary Joshua Graham, who would be Caesar's Legate until the 1st Battle of Hoover Dam came to an end, in which Joshua Graham was covered in pitch and burnt for his failures. By 2281, the tribe has already conquere 86 tribes and is a major force in the Post Nuclear USA.
This tribe originated from the Grand Canyon when young Edward Sallow, Bill Calhoun and Joshua Graham were kidnapped by the Blackfoots. Edward noticed how the tribe didn't know how to fight back the other tribes, so he used this to earn his freedom and obtain control over the tribe by teaching them the arts of war. Thanks to this, the tribe managed to defeat and assimilate the tribes that had been fighting it. Edward named himself Caesar, and with the unified tribes under the banner of Caesar's Legion, Sallow based the tribe's culture around the Romans. According to the Legion, their god Mars nuked the world so his child, the Caesar, would conquer the new savage world.
The Legion has got slaves and is pretty much a dictatorship. It has managed to turn the hostile lands of Arizona into peaceful areas under the faction's control.

-Why is it a failure?-
The Legion is a failure. Why?
1. They require a lot of their troops that are mantaining control and peace over the already conquered areas so they can keep control over the Mojave. If they were successful in conquering the Mojave, they would have a harder time fighting the NCR and keeping control over their conquered lands.
2. Instead of expanding East, where there's little opposition, they keep trying to go West, inhabited by the most developed factions in the Post Nuclear USA.
3. The NCR, being far more technologically advanced than the Legion, had a hard time mantaining the dam. The Legion, who rejects these technologies and have little knowledge of how they operate, would find it impossible to mantain it and for it to produce power and clean water. Sure, if you control the dam you control the electricity and the water, resources that people need. However, the NCR, with the dam, never managed to control the Mojave.
4. Supply lines. The NCR didn't have supply lines, and the Legion has got the same problem. Without supplies, the conquest of the Mojave becomes more tedious and tiring.
5. Their need to be on top makes them lose resources for no reason at all. For example, in one of the endings, Lanius will launch an attack against the Enclave Remnants who literally helped them in their mission of conquering the dam. This results in the Legion losing a lot of men. At the end, trying to chase the Enclave Remnants, they failed and got nothing in return.
6. As the Legion marches into NCR territory, the NCR gets more pissed off. Yes, the Mojave Campaign was built on incompetence, but as they reach New California, the NCR will see the actual threat the Legion is and will try to attack. Now, whether the NCR ends up losing all of New California to a bunch of tribals wearing skirts and football pads or they win and kick the Legion out of New California, that doesn't matter. What actually matters is the fact that both groups have wasted a lot of resources due to autism. It's most likely that since New California is at risk, the NCR would take it more seriously and they'd use their advanced technology and equipment against the Legion.
7. The Legion only use healing powder to heal themselves and their "doctors" have little to no knowledge of healing. Now, I know the already conquered lands might have actual doctors, but the Legion you see in the Mojave is small and weak. Once again, they are constantly sending reinforcements from their already conquered lands, which is a waste of troops and resources.
8. Their equipment is inferior to the NCR's. As I already mentioned, the Legion would win without the Courier's intervention, but I also mentioned how the NCR would start being more competent once they noticed how dangerous these brainlet tribals are actually masters of tactics and can easily buttf*ck the entire NCR.
9. The Legion makes troops by breeding and indoctrinating. Indoctrinating might take a few months, but you can't just send a bunch of kids to a war, they aren't trained at all... Just kidding, the children are literally inmortal and you should wrap dinamite under their clothings so whenever they get near the NCR they just go BOOM... But that's just something I would do, and canonically children aren't inmortal... And since people can easily get offended by the deaths of children that aren't even real, a lot of logic goes to waste and the Legion becomes pretty sh*tty due to the fact they lack morals yet they won't send children to war. Still, the Legion has been around for less time than the NCR and it would be foolish to attempt to fight an older faction with more troops and expendable soldiers. Once again, they should expand East, which has been only explored by bad storytelling and way too many retcons.
10. Did you know that time ED-E at half HP killed every single f*cking legionary at The Fort during my pacifist run while I just pressed right click getting hit by the power fists? I had to restart an older save (thank god I didn't lose any progress other than the EXP I obtained thanks to ED-E's random mass genocide) because that little son of a b*tch ♥♥♥♥♥♥ the entire run deep in the ass! Or did you know Timothy the bark scorpion that killed an entire squad of the spoopy NCR Rangers (I killed them all with my bare fists on my Legion run, btw, but the Courier is more than your average potato peeler) also killed way too many Legion assasins that came after my sexy booty? There have been way too many times I've seen these "tough" legionaries die to a random gecko or some other lil' b*tch from the Mojave.
11. Although they've got men to do their quests, they send the player to do everything. I mean, the Legion has got the frumentarii which are already in New Vegas (the place, duh)! I mean, if you check the Legion questline, every single quest that appears could be done by the Legion without your help. Maybe killing House would be trickier, but remember he only has got a few securitrons, the others lie under the Fort itself. Anyways, yeah, just like the NCR, they are way too dependant on the player character.
12. Killing the older people for being old is kinda dumb. You lose potential wise men with a lot of knowledge related to war, health, etc.

[TLDR/Summary]

1. F*ck the Legion with a fork.
2. I'm so f*cking tired. I haven't slept in so f*cking long. Dear Mormon Jesus.
3. All hail Timothy.

[Big Boss]

yeah but bald man funny

[HappyPapaya]

Originally posted by Eagle Watch:

yeah but bald man funny

You got me there, bald man funny indeed.

Gotta love those hegelian dialectics.

[RACHMANOVSKI]

"The Legion is way more competence than NCR"

So how come they lost the first battle of the Hoover Dam?

Also you play TF2 what the f do you know about anything lmao.

[HappyPapaya]

Originally posted by RACHMANOVSKI:

"The Legion is way more competence than NCR"

So how come they lost the first battle of the Hoover Dam?

Also you play TF2 what the f do you know about anything lmao.

How did they lose the 1st Battle of Hoover Dam if according to myself they are way more competent? To that I say that the Legion has managed to cripple the NCR multiple times although they New California Republic is far more technologically advanced. Basically, people has lost interest on the Mojave Campaign. That's part of the reason as to why the NCR Mojave troops aren't so well equipped. Instead of wearing NCR combat armor, they are equipped with an inferior leather armor. Their weapons are also kinda sh*tty when you compare them to those they used in Fallout 2. Back in New California, the NCR has got it's troops well equipped. The Mojave is really small and the only thing of interest to the NCR are the casinos and Hoover Dam. But as you can see, the NCR doesn't mantain Hoover Dam well. In Helios One, they rely on Fantastic because he was the only person that would take the job, and the NCR gave it to him. The Legion is being more competent. Just take a look at Camp Searchlight, Nipton or Nelson. The NCR can't bother sending a single soldier to check on NIpton, they instead send some brain damaged mailman to look what happened to the place. The Legion has allied different factions in the Mojave such as the Omertas or the Great Khans, all with their hatred against the NCR. So yeah, although the Legion lost the 1st Battle, they would end up winning the 2nd due to how the NCR has become so incompetent. Both are super incompetent, I won't lie, but the NCR is way more incompetent.

And yes, I play TF2. My favourite class is the Spy.

[Luis the Uma Loving Wizard]

This- Actually makes sense. Interesting read

[Akasaki]

"When your nerd friend read a right book and become hardcore."

[psychotron666420]

If you play any of the endings, it's true that the Legion one is where the courier is least needed.

Without courier's intervention:

- legion take nipton
- president Kimball gets assassinated
- monorail at McCarran gets blown up
- chief Hanlon cripples NCR supply lines
- ceasar dies and lanius takes over
- omertas blow up the strip
- Benny gets captured by legion and they seize the chip (Benny's plan is to sneak into the fort regardless of courier and he gets caught when he tries).
-helios one gets taken by the brotherhood
-boomers stay isolated and help no one
-white legs eliminate Zion valley
-ulysses nukes the NCR

Yeah. The NCR is ♥♥♥♥♥♥ without the courier's intervention.

[HappyPapaya]

Originally posted by psychotron666420:

If you play any of the endings, it's true that the Legion one is where the courier is least needed.

Without courier's intervention:

- legion take nipton
- president Kimball gets assassinated
- monorail at McCarran gets blown up
- chief Hanlon cripples NCR supply lines
- ceasar dies and lanius takes over
- omertas blow up the strip
- Benny gets captured by legion and they seize the chip (Benny's plan is to sneak into the fort regardless of courier and he gets caught when he tries).
-helios one gets taken by the brotherhood
-boomers stay isolated and help no one
-white legs eliminate Zion valley
-ulysses nukes the NCR

Yeah. The NCR is ♥♥♥♥♥♥ without the courier's intervention.

Yeah, the NCR is completely ♥♥♥♥♥♥ due to their incompetence and bad leadership. Quite literally, General Oliver would kill himself if the NCR were to lose the 2nd Battle of Hoover Dam. Does that seem like a brave, competent and heroic man? He lost to a bunch of dudes wearing football pads just because he was being a lazy bastard, hiding in his little office deep inside Hoover Dam. And once he loses? He cannot live with the shame and commits suicide.

[Mandrake42]

Originally posted by HappyPapaya:

Originally posted by psychotron666420:

If you play any of the endings, it's true that the Legion one is where the courier is least needed.

Without courier's intervention:

- legion take nipton
- president Kimball gets assassinated
- monorail at McCarran gets blown up
- chief Hanlon cripples NCR supply lines
- ceasar dies and lanius takes over
- omertas blow up the strip
- Benny gets captured by legion and they seize the chip (Benny's plan is to sneak into the fort regardless of courier and he gets caught when he tries).
-helios one gets taken by the brotherhood
-boomers stay isolated and help no one
-white legs eliminate Zion valley
-ulysses nukes the NCR

Yeah. The NCR is ♥♥♥♥♥♥ without the courier's intervention.

Yeah, the NCR is completely ♥♥♥♥♥♥ due to their incompetence and bad leadership. Quite literally, General Oliver would kill himself if the NCR were to lose the 2nd Battle of Hoover Dam. Does that seem like a brave, competent and heroic man? He lost to a bunch of dudes wearing football pads just because he was being a lazy bastard, hiding in his little office deep inside Hoover Dam. And once he loses? He cannot live with the shame and commits suicide.

Do one on the NCR next.

[Mandrake42]

Originally posted by RACHMANOVSKI:

"The Legion is way more competence than NCR"

So how come they lost the first battle of the Hoover Dam?

Also you play TF2 what the f do you know about anything lmao.

Why should whether he plays TF2 or not matter? It's not like that is the only game they have played.

Also the Legion lost at Hoover Dam because Joshua Graham was overconfident and relied or tactics that had worked before but on the confines of the Hoover Dam were actually a drawback. If he was not so hidebound by what had worked in the past he might have come up with different tactics rather than being defeated, covered in pitch, set on fire, and thrown into the canyon.

That said the NCR and the Legion can both suck a ♥♥♥♥. My robots and I run the Mojave now.

[HappyPapaya]

Originally posted by Mandrake42:

Originally posted by HappyPapaya:

Yeah, the NCR is completely ♥♥♥♥♥♥ due to their incompetence and bad leadership. Quite literally, General Oliver would kill himself if the NCR were to lose the 2nd Battle of Hoover Dam. Does that seem like a brave, competent and heroic man? He lost to a bunch of dudes wearing football pads just because he was being a lazy bastard, hiding in his little office deep inside Hoover Dam. And once he loses? He cannot live with the shame and commits suicide.

Do one on the NCR next.

Don't worry, I already did.