How does Karma work?

[random smile]

How does the karma system work in this game? Why did I just lose Karma for saving the weathers family from slavery at the hands of the legion? Why can't I steal things if there is no one around? Why if I kill all the raiders or people in a place, why can't I then steal the things without losing karma? I don't understand this Karma system at all.

[Ladez]

You only get bad karma from the Weathers family if you cause them to die. As for stealing, it doesn't matter if someone sees you, it's a source of bad karma. Unlike reputation, karma is a universal force.

That said, the karma system is absolutely stupid, and as a result I completely ignore it when I play. It's a left over mechanic from Fallout 3, where it carried more weight, but even then it was a stupid mechanic. The reputation system should have replaced it fully. It's much more meaningful.

[drunken.dx]

Originally posted by Ladez:

You only get bad karma from the Weathers family if you cause them to die. As for stealing, it doesn't matter if someone sees you, it's a source of bad karma. Unlike reputation, karma is a universal force.

That said, the karma system is absolutely stupid, and as a result I completely ignore it when I play. It's a left over mechanic from Fallout 3, where it carried more weight, but even then it was a stupid mechanic. The reputation system should have replaced it fully. It's much more meaningful.

Check 3 level 50 perks:
https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout:_New_Vegas_perks#Regular_perks_5

[RequiemsRose]

Karma isn't one you need to worry much about unless you are doing something specific, like the companion Cass doesn't like a courier with bad karma so it somewhat matters there. Only somewhat because it's also incredibly easy to manipulate your karma however you want regardless of what you do. I steal everything that isn't nailed down but as far as karma is concerned I'm practically Jesus because I'm nice on quests. Overall, it doesn't matter much unless you do have something related to karma in mind, like Cass or one of the karma related end-game perks.

As for negative karma for the Weathers family, that may have to do with HOW you released them. If it resulted in their death in any way it will lead to negative karma (which can also include freeing them and then releasing the radioactive barrels on cottonwood before they actually get out of range). It could be that you didn't deactivate their collars either so when they got far enough, their heads exploded. There's also the potential to gain negative karma depending on how you encourage Frank to handle the situation after they are freed as well, if Frank is how you started that questline to begin with.

Edit: if you aren't sure if they actually lived, you can check. If they made it out safely you can find them in the Old Mormon Fort for the rest of the game. If they aren't there after you released them, they are probably dead.

[random smile]

it was part of a quest? ohh i had no idea, I was just wondering around the waste lands and came across them and the legion. so i killed the legion and picked the lock on the gate and deactivated there collars, then let them go free.. also have no idea about radioactive barrels as i was just exploring around the southern part of the map when I came across them.. maybe that is why? maybe i have to be on the quest?

[PuttBlug]

Karma is inconsequential in FNV, all it does is give you different names for your save files and make a female companion called Cass to be mad at you if your karma is to the "very evil" level, but she's worthless anyway.

[RequiemsRose]

Originally posted by random smile:

it was part of a quest? ohh i had no idea, I was just wondering around the waste lands and came across them and the legion. so i killed the legion and picked the lock on the gate and deactivated there collars, then let them go free.. also have no idea about radioactive barrels as i was just exploring around the southern part of the map when I came across them.. maybe that is why? maybe i have to be on the quest?

You don't have to start the quest via Frank to get good karma. There's breadcrumbs all over the mojave that lead you to certain plot-important places. Cottonwood cove is one of them and off the top of my head I can think of 4 different quests that ask you to go there depending on how you explore, Frank included. Normally you'd find him pleading for someone to free his family if you got to the strip without already doing so. You miss out on a little more backstory for the family and another chance at karma if you skip Frank but that's about it. If you free his family before meeting him, however that turns out, he simply won't talk to you.

If you are curious what backstory you missed but don't feel like doing it all over again or looking it up:
His family was captured and enslaved while they tried to flee him, they want nothing to do with him because it turns out he's an abusive junkie that doesn't really want to get clean. He's not allowed at the Old Mormon Fort because of it, which is why they end up there. If you started the quest with his prompt, you get to finish it by helping him decide whether to clean up and be better for them (good karma), to leave them alone (nothing), or convince him to kill himself over it (bad karma).

[VAC BAN SECURE]

It means ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ nothing....




OH NO GUYS I LOST KARMA FROM STEALING SUNSET SARSAPARILLA

[PuttBlug]

Originally posted by jcv5000:

you loose 5 point of karma whenever you steal an item in Red. And it seem really hard to take that back al the bad karma, if you steal a lot to sell items. Even if you play the game really nice like a saint, and just do good action. Best way is to use console, give yourself 1000 good karma points, and after you can steal all you want.

Lose not loose and no game remains fun for more than a few seconds after you've cheated somehow.

[RequiemsRose]

You don't need commands to raise your karma when you happen to be a thief. Killing fiends or powder gangers is a +5 to karma so as long as one drops for each stolen item that alone is enough and as infinite as the items available to steal. Killing an exceptionally evil person such as vulpes inculta, cook-cook, or jackal gang leaders is a +100 to karma. Plus there are tons of opportunities for karma in quests. There's even some quests that are outright problematic to playing a neutral character because there is no way to resolve the quest without a massive shift in karma (usually a choice between positive or negative, some are purely positive though).

[lizardmang]

Originally posted by RequiemsRose:

Killing fiends or powder gangers is a +5 to karma so as long as one drops for each stolen item that alone is enough and as infinite as the items available to steal.

In my experience (vanilla), karma from killing isn't an infinitely available resource. I get karma the first time I kill them, but when returning to an area where they've respawned, killing them again doesn't reward karma. If one is a thorough explorer, it's not impossible to run out of positive karma sources outside of quests (which are also finite).

Granted, I don't know if negative karma from stealing is necessarily an infinite resource either, but in any case, I think one would find it much harder to completely run out of things to steal.

[drunken.dx]

Originally posted by drunken.dx:

Check 3 level 50 perks:
https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout:_New_Vegas_perks#Regular_perks_5

For the most part karma is without meaning, only place where it really matters is which perk you can take when hitting level 50.

[hussite gaming]

Originally posted by random smile:

How does the karma system work in this game? Why did I just lose Karma for saving the weathers family from slavery at the hands of the legion? Why can't I steal things if there is no one around? Why if I kill all the raiders or people in a place, why can't I then steal the things without losing karma? I don't understand this Karma system at all.

If make them to run without deactivating collars, shortly after they get out of cage they will be blown away. You killed them, you killed them and you didn't even notice.

[hussite gaming]

Originally posted by Ladez:

You only get bad karma from the Weathers family if you cause them to die. As for stealing, it doesn't matter if someone sees you, it's a source of bad karma. Unlike reputation, karma is a universal force.

That said, the karma system is absolutely stupid, and as a result I completely ignore it when I play. It's a left over mechanic from Fallout 3, where it carried more weight, but even then it was a stupid mechanic. The reputation system should have replaced it fully. It's much more meaningful.

karma was in OG fallout, and worked in the same way, but yeah, karma-mechanic in f3 was ♥♥♥♥

[Ladez]

Originally posted by wujt gminy żukowo:

karma was in OG fallout, and worked in the same way, but yeah, karma-mechanic in f3 was ♥♥♥♥

Fallout 1 had a basic general reputation system.

Fallout 2 made a distinction between karma and reputation. The concept of karma is garbage, but at least it provided some nuance, with reputation and perks which are awarded for specific actions.

Fallout 3 ditched all the good stuff and kept the binary good/evil nonsense. FNV brought back reputation and unfortunately kept karma. But at least it's severely neutered, so you can pretty much ignore its existence completely.

It was always stupid. I don't need a game to tell me that what I just did was good or evil, devoid of context and premeditation, and the idea that characters can judge you for things they have no idea you did is bonkers.

Originally posted by drunken.dx:

Check 3 level 50 perks:
https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout:_New_Vegas_perks#Regular_perks_5

The fact that these perks exist only encourages people to power play to get the perk that they want. They should not be tied to karma at all.

[MeGoodEnglish]

Karma in NV is almost meaningless, what really matters is Reputation system.

However, the most impact karma have in New Vegas is when you play with cass. If you have bad karma, she will leave you.