Shotguns! You wanna run that by me one more time?

[Maxwell Sinclair]

So I'm genuinely curious because I've never really explored shotguns. I talked my friend into getting the dinner bell in his vanilla playthrough, because I know everyone lords it as the best shotgun in the game. Ultimately it only seems to be slightly better than a regular shotgun.

So I was wondering, could someone who has put far more hours into shotguns than I, please explain the order of "Goodness" for shotguns and why they're in that order? What makes the dinner bell the best shotgun?

[Marceline "Marchy"]

I am able to kill cazadors in 3 to 4 hits
with a hunting shotgun loaded with MAG bullets without any shotgun related perks.

[Maxwell Sinclair]

Originally posted by Oktober "Tiny Tobes" Blitz.:

shotguns are kinda meh. most human enemies have armor so shotguns don't do as much damage as they say and most of the truly threatening mutants also have armor.

shotguns (imho) only really work at lower levels agasint lightly armored targets

Mutants have a natural DT of 5 Nightkin have no DT, most human enemies have a max of 4 - 6 unless you're hunting the legion or the NCR.

The special ammo system is interesting though I choose to not overdo it. I like to take one or two types of ammo, thanks to it weighing in hardcore mode, the shotguns have a LOT of ammo types which is a bit OTT.

[Bansheebutt]

Shotguns have a lot of different ammo, but they still fill the same roles of AP and HP types for other weapons.

Dragon Breath, Flechette, and Slugs for Armor; Buckshot for everything else.

Of course they still have their individual advantages:

Dragon Breath is great for Human targets, Flechette acts as though your shotgun is supressed, and 4/0 Buck is better against lightly armoured targets than standard buckshot.

If you know where to get all the ammo, you'd really never need any other weapon.

Originally posted by Oktober "Tiny Tobes" Blitz.:

never liked the special ammo system very much.
and I'm also kinda aposed to the idea of a perk just to make one type of weapon worth while

So your problem with shotguns is you don't want to use the options that are available.

[red255]

you forgot pulse slug.

[Seasick Crocodile]

as long as you have the "and stay back" perk you'll be good with anything

[Brick]

Originally posted by Roadhouse:

as long as you have the "and stay back" perk you'll be good with anything

even an almost broken single shotgun with surplus rounds?

[Maxwell Sinclair]

Originally posted by ded by brick:

Originally posted by Roadhouse:

as long as you have the "and stay back" perk you'll be good with anything

even an almost broken single shotgun with surplus rounds?

Yes. Considering the "And Stay Back" knockback chance is applied per pellet. Thereby meaning that surplus rounds have a higher chance of getting the knockdown than 4/0 magnum hand load. You will plink them to death slowly, but the knockback will ensure they can't harm you.

[Janus Vesta]

Originally posted by The One True Duckson Of War:

There are 6 different shotguns ingame not counting unique ones and including energy weapons that shoot more than one beam.

Caravan shotgun. Single shotgun. Hunting shotgun. Riot shotgun. Multiplas rifle. Tribeam laser rifle.

You forgot the Lever-action Shotgun. The first one you can use without reloading every second. Awful range though.

[Raven Frostborn]

Single Shotgun<Caravan shotgun<Lever-action Shotgun<Riot shotgun<Dinner Bell<Hunting shotgun with all mods.

The Riot Shotgun is great but honestly you rarely if ever need the rapid fire rate and it burns through ammo really fast. The Hunting Shotgun with all mods has fantastic range (mid and arguably long), a fast fire rate (the pumps don't take long at all), decent ammo capacity and more damage than the Riot Shotgun. With shotgun perks it can destroy almost anything, and AP rounds make it even better. Without the weapon mods the Riot Shotgun is probably better though.

[NIKFS]

I always had the caravan shotgun with pulse slugs against robot enemies, quite nice

[Obus UA]

Originally posted by Oktober "Tiny Tobes" Blitz.:

shotguns are kinda meh. most human enemies have armor so shotguns don't do as much damage as they say and most of the truly threatening mutants also have armor.
shotguns (imho) only really work at lower levels agasint lightly armored targets

You just do not know how to cook them. Most NPC in game have DT up to 10: all regular factional armor and vanila leather, not so many have 15 or better (CA), very few >20. "Shotgun Surgeon" -10 DT, you can use standard shells vs 90% gangs members, or switch on slug if they have CA class or better armor.
"Where can I find so many 12 gauge?" 12 gauge standard shell - 40% chance get empty casing, x2 with "Hand Loader" perk. 20 gauge shotgun standart shell cost 1 caps each, disassemble 100 pcs and you can hand-load 60 pcs buckshot/slug 12 gauge.

Originally posted by Duskwalker68:

The Riot Shotgun is great but honestly you rarely if ever need the rapid fire rate and it burns through ammo really fast. The Hunting Shotgun with all mods has fantastic range (mid and arguably long), a fast fire rate (the pumps don't take long at all), decent ammo capacity and more damage than the Riot Shotgun.

Dinner Bell: slow, relatively small magazine, if met more than 3 enemies - you have a problem. For medium-long range there are better weapons. Riot Shotgun beast at CC.

Originally posted by Janus Vesta:

You forgot the Lever-action Shotgun. The first one you can use without reloading every second. Awful range though.

Not a bad weapon at low levels with "Cowboy" perk. Cowboy repeater, revolvers, knifes. Then wear duster and cowboy hat.

[barfbag69fartmachine]

They suck aganist armoured targets since every pellet gets their damage cut. That's why shotgun surgeon is pretty much manditory if you're going to use them long term.
But shotguns themselves are made for animal control, if you use shotguns for animals the perk ''AND STAY AWAY'' is pretty good, if you have a riot shotgun you're likely keep your enemy stunlocked forever.... or till they die

[Vassago Rain]

Shotguns do X damage, where X is spread across Y pellets. You think you're doing a mighty 89 damage, or something, and sure enough, you indeed are, but it's spread across typically 7 or 8 individual pellets, that each invoke DT. So fat damage buck...better used on light armor enemies and animals.

Slugs do 'less' damage, (say 71, rather than 89), which more often than not ends up working out to be vastly more actual damage. Slugs only ever fire a single pellet, with better accuracy than the buck.

With handloading, a ton of special ammo becomes available, and if you have the GRA DLC, even more are added, but it's primarily store bought.

The 'best' shotgun is the riot shotgun. With the proper perks, it's easy to empty the 12 shot mags quickly, and swap a new one in in about 0.3 seconds.

Certain perks exist that make shotguns so strong it's barely fun to use it.

[Maxwell Sinclair]

Originally posted by Daedric Brick:

Deathclaws are really easy to kill with a riot shotgun and the perk stay back, especially as you'll do max dmg as they have little to no armor and will be at close range as they run at you

Little to no armor? Deathclaws have a natural DT of 15, one of the highest Natural DTs in the game especially for a non human enemy. To get through their armor would require Shotgun Surgeon and either slugs or Flechette rounds. Slugs won't trigger "And Stay Back" nearly as much as buckshot will.