Mount & Blade: Warband

Mount & Blade: Warband

A World of Ice and Fire
=) Jun 27, 2017 @ 9:08am
my thoughts/feedback
K have given it a damn good go but this has some serious issues.

Ambushes and sneaking exist on the wiki and in game concepts info but do NOT exist as options in the camp menu and the only people who get to ambush are the enemies.

The wiki describes injuries as something different from what you get here.

Sieges are obscene with attrition through the roof on the player but not on the npc lords and takes weeks to set up if your engineer is around 5ish so you can kiss goodbye most of your army

oversights on things like how you cannot speak to clegane which means you cannot rescue him from captivity

Loot sharing is taking the piss. I already pay the troops and have to spend a fortune upgrading them and the retinue but for some reason when I have obliterated a dozen robber knights single handed I am considered taking a liberty if I want more than the measly poor quality pair of boots it offers?! At the least tie it to your performance in the battle since it does track kills per named character

Baristan Selmy is level 27 with a rookies skill points.. 27strength and power attack of only a couple of points if even. 8 athlete.. woo he can run quickly up to his enemies before tickling them?

The injury system is excessive and should have a check against your own parties surgery and wound healing skills. It also needs deactivating when you are in a lords army because some lords NEVER go to maester towns and you arent allowed to take leave.

Bandit camps always rewarded garbage vs effort but the uber knights ones are just not ever worth it when you end up facing off against 40+ of the toughest units in the game (white walkers are big softies in comparison)

Ranged weapons are largely worthless with it taking multiple javlins to even kill a low level unit with 5 in power throw and archery is just weak with a poor selection of bows

Expect fanboys to tell me you guys owe me nothing and that is very true but this is my honest critique of where this mod is really falling down which is a shame because other elements and the detail are great and otherwise it is enjoyable... but in the end the cumulative effect of all the little thigns just spoils it for me.
It reminds me very much of the worst elements of bytenwalda and Viking Conquest... that its buggy, has broken content and gets incredibly frustrating because it is so close to being awesome but misses the mark.
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Showing 1-9 of 9 comments
I tweaked my character file's CHR a bit to test things out. Seems siege attrition (at least when setting up equipment to scale the walls) can be heavily reduced by having alot of archers as compared to the enemy. Also having a significantly larger army causes enemies to take more casualties from raids than you do. Thing is i don't think enemy lords have to go through raids and losses from setting up siege equipment. In addition for whatever reason it doesn't seem that my allied lords' numbers are counted during setting up siege equipment and raid defense. great mod concepts and all but the system can get broken.
=) Jun 27, 2017 @ 10:45am 
The attrition is them dying in droves as timed events during the siege construction periods saying sickness. Even with the latrines dug which you would think would reduce it I was seeing about 15 die a day or more frequently and when its killing off top tier troops that take forever to get a hold of.... that is infuriating.... in the week it woulda taken to build the actual siege equipment, enemy lords woulda come to the rescue and Id have like 50 men to actually storm the place if I was lucky.
Really stupid 1 sided mechanic which should be binned.

Anyways have removed the mod and said my piece. if they want to take any of it on board or not, thats their business.
Last edited by =); Jun 27, 2017 @ 10:47am
Produno  [developer] Jun 27, 2017 @ 12:31pm 
It seems most of what you have posted are either because you have not fully understood the mechanics or you are a little upset the mod is too difficult for you, which happens alot. Though for alot of people the mod is not that hard.

The ambushes i may need to look at, it may have got lost while merging some of the VC stuff.

NPC's like Clegane should not be capturable, at least according to the inbuilt operations provided by Taleworlds, though they do not work. It's not a fault of the mod, but of the code we are able to modify.

Barristans stats are similar to that of the ai's stats (of the same level). Why should the players troops get advantages? Hes already invincible lol.

The injury system is fine. Your just wading in like a hero... bad mistake in Westeros ;).

Bandit camos rewards and loot choices are as they are so they are not OP. If you want it realistic then maybe i should make it so your person can only carry what he has on his back? It then makes no difference what loot the enemy drops. I think its fine how it is.

Ranged weapons i may tweak for 2.0. I'm waiting for general feedback. Though you get some people complain they are too powerfull and they hurt too much, then get some like you who say they are not powerfull enough... so which is it?? It seems i will never be right no matter i do in that respect.
Erebus Jun 27, 2017 @ 10:35pm 
I was going to make a similar post, but I'll just piggyback off of this one.

I selected Static Wars on my first character because I wanted to play out the war from the series. However, after the Westerlands were completely eliminated (I was playing as a Northman), there wasn't a whole lot going on. All the factions pretty much seemed to only be at war with the Westerlands, so things pretty much ground to a halt. Perhaps there could be some trigger at either a faction elimination or a certain number of days reached where diplomacy could be unlocked. As an addendum, this may exist already and I just haven't reached it yet.

After the Westerlands were defeated, I tried to call a campaign (I was Marshal) to finish off the Iron Islands, but I had a lot of trouble getting the other lords to join me. I'm not yet at the point where I can siege Pyke single handed, so I rely on the other lords to make up my numbers. But, when I sailed to the Iron Islands and called the campaign from there, only 2 lords ever showed up. When I tried to call a campaign on the mainland and take off for the Iron Islands from there, Robb immediately revoked the marshalship. I'm wondering if there is a better way to get the lords onto ships. It's really boring trading back Flint's Finger and Greywater Watch for a hundred days.

Another thing that I noticed was that when the Westerlands were defeated, there was a really odd distribution of lord defections. Not a single lord joined the North, and over half joined the Riverlands. I at first chalked this up to the North actually striking the killing blow on the faction, but it seems odd that so many of them joined the Riverlands, which did the vast majority of the work in the war. I would say at least half of the lords that didn't join the Riverlands also joined the same faction, but I can't remember if that faction was Dragonstone or the Stormlands.

I don't have a problem with most of what was mentioned above, but I would suggest that if possible the system should take your accompanying lords' men into account when determining if you can build defenses around your camp during a siege.

It kind of makes sense that whoever owns King's Landing is declared King, but it would make more sense if it was the faction leader of the faction that owns it. I doubt Stannis would crown some random vassal King if he managed to capture KL. If it's not possible to dissociate the owner of the city from the title, maybe you could just force the faction leaders to always choose themselves as the new owners.

The other thing I kind of agree with is the wounds system. I know you said to just not be a hero, but I think it happens just a bit too frequently. I've actually been wounded twice in the same battle a couple times, usually from those damn throwing axes. One time I got wounded 4 battles in a row. I think a decent balance would be about 30-40% less wounds. That way they would still happen, but not be so frustrating.

One thing I don't understand at all is the income from towns/villages. It seems to me that the first week or two I own a province I get a ridiculous amount of income, then it falls way down. The first week I owned Lannisport, I got over 10k from rents/tariffs. The next week, it was 5k. The next, 2k. It's since built back up to around 3.5-4k, but it seems odd that it was so high at the beginning. The same thing happened with my initial village and another town. Maybe there's a reason for this, maybe not.

I kind of hate myself for mentioning this, but there is a glitched interaction between building the mantelets and the siege equipment. If you start building the mantelets and then click away to bring the siege menu back up, you can immediately start construction of the siege equipment, and the mantelets will keep building in the background. Saves a lot of time.

Under the description of the Intelligence attribute, it mentions that it contributes to the Weapon Maintenance skill, which does not exist.

About ranged weapons, I'm not sure. I understand both sides of the issue. If I remember correctly, I have archery proficiency in the low-mid 200s, am using a Masterwork Short Bow, and have Horse Archery of 5. It takes me usually 2 shots to the body to kill anyone in leather/cloth armor, and hugely varying amounts to kill anyone in metal. Anywhere from 4 to about 10, unless I get a headshot. While I admit that 10 seems extreme, other than that it doesn't seem that unreasonable. I do, however, feel the frustration of just riding along at what seems to be a safe distance from the fight and getting one shotted. Maybe the headshot multiplier is a bit too high? I'm not sure. Maybe you could change the damage type of short bows to pierce and then cut down the damage to compensate. That way it could be a tad more effective vs armor, but still about the same for most troops. I'm just spitballing here though.

About Barriston. Most of his stats are on par with that of high-level troops, but I think his health is a bit low in comparison. His is I think in the mid 50s when you recruit him but most top tier troops have health in the 70s. He seems fine though, that's not a huge issue in my book.

Most of these are minor gripes, overall the mod is fantastic. I've played M&B for hundreds if not thousands of hours over the past few years, it's rare that a mod captivates me to the level that I think about it when I am not playing. This one absolutely does though. I think there's just not enough time to play all the different characters I want too, and that's a great thing. Keep up the good work!
its not just mantlets and siege equipment but also digging the latrines and constructing defenses as well (same thing in viking conquest). For fief income I vaguely recall something like that also happening in viking conquest, if i recall you're actually supposed to get the majority of your fief income ever other week as for the tarrifs maybe less caravans were visiting your town? For the weapon maintenance that's a leftover skill from yes again viking conquest. they probably just forgot to remove the description for it.
Erebus Jun 28, 2017 @ 9:57am 
I never played viking conquest, so I was unware of the overlap. My fief point still stands though, it's not like I'm getting 10k every other week. Actually my income is very stable at around 4k per week. It might have been caravans but in that case I don't think it would've happened to my villages as well.
Ementy Jun 28, 2017 @ 2:42pm 
it could be your troops wages too, it would make sense take the town...lose troops.. 1st week recoop 2nd week got a big army.

So my jests on the mod are with siege again...I powered to 10 engineering and I sieged Dragonstone as my first town and it did not recognize my level and said it was 0 but when I did a siege as a test on sisterton then it recognized it. I am playing as independant on normal wars.

Also, having the stark girls tied to rob stark would make sense after neds death.

I've played both ACOK and AWOIAF alot and I prefer AWOIAF for almost everything exept that ACOK feels more full with the extra towns castles and villages. even if they were cookie cutter it would improve my experience I guess more characters can come with that as well which would elevate you way beyond ACOK as it is always one of the knocks in the comparison threads. Because the stuff you have now is more in depth than ACOK (the wall, north of the wall, view from wall, quests, storyline, items)

I stated in another discussion but I doubt you saw it one suggestion I have. since it's a major part of the game for me and a lot of others. you do well with the goodmaster selling 50. but maybe in addition do something like where there is the travelling merchant in taverns who sells up to 12 unsullied. OR better yet a way to add astapor is by building it's scene and doing it's town icon as a image of a caravan so it makes sense lore wise and have it say "Travel to Astapor" and maybe have a % ambush on the way chance when loading the scene menu of Astapor or other eastern locations that add unique things but wouldn't fit due to resource limits of the map.

and if I can make one last suggestion I use addonay's elven weapons in with AWOIAF and modded the stats to be a bit higer tier. as none of the NPC's have them it works great for having the powerful bows without having people complain about the npcs again like you stated you can never win, but with that method you can, it make me really happy having that choice for personal use without affecting anything else. so WIN!

Thank you good sir for all your hard work and time!
Last edited by Ementy; Jun 28, 2017 @ 3:05pm
=) Jun 29, 2017 @ 2:11am 
AWOIAF looks nicer and has some good features, ACOK feels more complete and less frustrating on the balance side of things. More events, quests, locations companions and so on. Be good if they could be merged *shrug*. (also seems they wholesale copied word for word a number of random events from ACOK.. mushrooms on the ground, rabit in a snare, bard composes song about you, officer insults your ability to get a woman because you smell.. etc)

I suggested the same with the stark girls on another post as I was playing through because in the end I had to push even further on the relation score to get sansa to elope as the only way to actually marry her.. which incidentally gave me no extra right to rule or anything which isnt in-keeping with the books/series since several guys are vying for her hand as a doorway to power.

Nice that the dev responded but hand waiving me with essentially "git gud" is disappointing.

Clegane got captured by dragonstone and I couldnt free him because he essentially tells you to F off as a fixed dialog. Rather than blaming the game why not unfix his dialog so he's a regularl lord but one of the obnoxious agressive types if he needs stock text for that?

Baristan is a companion and a companion at lvl 27 you expect to be a lot more useful. an invincible roughly tier 2 soldier is still a bit crap whichever way you look at it and at that level they take eternity to level further to actually make him of any use.

To be honest all the followers apart from brienne felt a bit of a joke. They talk up how they are veterans or super skilled and they turn out to be utter newbs. their price is extortionate vs vanilla and other mods and though, ultimately you do want them because they eventually become really usefull, is a bit much somebody weaker and worse equipped than a levy telling you they want thousands just to hire them.
The companions like to dislike system also lacks the overall balance of vanilla or mods like floris where there are certain balanced combinations that allow you a celing of about 9-13... in this one there is only maybe 1 or 2 arrangements that are stable and all of them involve not having a couple of really unpopular follower like ♥♥♥♥ crab

The injury system results in countless wounds and fairly regularly multiple in the same battle. That feels excessive and you didnt address the issue of being in a lords army and getting them but not being able to seek healing because you cant take leave and retiring resets the counter to the next rank. Saying dont wade in like a hero is telling you to level up super slow sat at the back of the fight. Take in game years to get past lvl 30 just off quests and won battle experience. The wounds also didnt seem to factor armor.. so when you are wearing uber armor and can shrug off a lot of blows, you get more injuries because you can get hit a lot more.
Produno  [developer] Jun 29, 2017 @ 4:43am 
Those same events, all events in fact, were in AWoIaF well before they were in ACoK. They were actually in Brytenwalda (the module i used to create this mod). They were not in Floris (what ACoK is built upon). So they had to be added to ACoK, whereas they were in AWoIaF from the start (i Started this mod in 2013). Those same events have also been extended in AWoIaF having various efects on the game world, not just copy pasted with some text changes ;). I mean there are events where you can gain companions. Nothing like that exists in ACoK?

I originally had the Stark girls atached to Robb, but for some reason it kept causing red text errors. It didnt actually effect anything but people complained, so i put it back to how it were initially. I shall need more time to figure out why, but it's low priority tbh. A AAA game, sure, assign a dev to fix it. A mod, im on my own here.

Clegane cannot be given regular lord dialogue, that will lead to all kinds of wierd bugs unless i go through every single piece of dialogue and add various conditions, then add extra dialogue for such other conditions. That would take me weeks if not months. The operation that is meant to work, does not, so yeah thats an issue with the engine and something i have no control over. You are welcome to do your own research on this if you do not believe me.

The injury system works on damage taken, so armour IS counted. If you recieve over a certain amount of damage, it rolls a chance you recieve an injury depending on where you got hit. Once you get past a certain point in the game you will probably never recieve injuries, unless fighting a giant or something maybe.

You can also change how much exp you recieve in the module.ini. If you cannot be bothered to modify a module yourself to your own needs then why should you expect a modder to change his module to your exact needs?


As for companions, sure they may need some balance. But it seems your expecting me to play and test the mod sufficiently to do the balance checks. The information you have given me does not help me balance them at all. Suggestions instead of complaints would be nice.
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