Originally posted by El_Harmakhis:

Originally posted by danielmak:

Dreadnought class for Federation please .

There is no canon Dreadnought-Class, so I guess rather not. And the Constitution-Class and its Refit-Version (aka 1701 and 1701-A) are already in the game.

No matter what the devs say, Dreadnoughts ARE cannon. That's what the whole Into Darkness thing was about. The devs just choose to ignore cannon, at their discretion.

I commend this mod's devs for sticking to TOS rather than the Apple Store look of Kelvin ships. However, the Vengeance/Dreadnought from Into Darkness is a pretty neat ship.

Ahem. No developer said that dreadnoughts are, or are not, canon.

Originally posted by bulabajones:

I commend this mod's devs for sticking to TOS rather than the Apple Store look of Kelvin ships. However, the Vengeance/Dreadnought from Into Darkness is a pretty neat ship.

Well, The Vengeance as well as every other ship in the Kelvin timeline are, even though they are canon...they are in their own seperate timeline or universe or whatever.

Which is something I like about Trek, when they want to do new things they usually put them in their own universe, so it won't upset the existing timeline, but also so they don't feel meaningless.

Most other franchises either say "Well, we didn't mean it, it doesn't exist" or "Well, you'll have to deal with it"...ironically both kind of apply to Star Wars ;)

Originally posted by itchy01ca01:

Originally posted by El_Harmakhis:

There is no canon Dreadnought-Class, so I guess rather not. And the Constitution-Class and its Refit-Version (aka 1701 and 1701-A) are already in the game.

No matter what the devs say, Dreadnoughts ARE cannon. That's what the whole Into Darkness thing was about. The devs just choose to ignore cannon, at their discretion.

New Trek is not Old Trek. Watch all the shows and movies before you try to claim that the newer ones in the alternate timeline are definitive on a particular issue.

Originally posted by jdblue:

Originally posted by itchy01ca01:

No matter what the devs say, Dreadnoughts ARE cannon. That's what the whole Into Darkness thing was about. The devs just choose to ignore cannon, at their discretion.

New Trek is not Old Trek. Watch all the shows and movies before you try to claim that the newer ones in the alternate timeline are definitive on a particular issue.

At best the movies just say that an over militaried Starfleet in an alternate universe built big ships to combat the Klingons or The Romulans.

Originally posted by jdblue:

Originally posted by itchy01ca01:

No matter what the devs say, Dreadnoughts ARE cannon. That's what the whole Into Darkness thing was about. The devs just choose to ignore cannon, at their discretion.

New Trek is not Old Trek. Watch all the shows and movies before you try to claim that the newer ones in the alternate timeline are definitive on a particular issue.

Still cannon, according to the creators. You can try to say "oh this and that" but.. it's cannon. You're not going to stop me from saying "it's cannon". It's like law. There is, or there isn't, and this is. The devs are in their own rights to include what they want though, of course. But.. it's still cannon :)

Originally posted by God-Emperor Hellriser623:

Originally posted by jdblue:

New Trek is not Old Trek. Watch all the shows and movies before you try to claim that the newer ones in the alternate timeline are definitive on a particular issue.

At best the movies just say that an over militaried Starfleet in an alternate universe built big ships to combat the Klingons or The Romulans.

Nope. Dreadnought-class is an in-movie ship. Also, if you examine the ORINGIAL movies very closely, you'll find ties to.. well any ship you want, because the star trek technical manual was used as a source for the movies and it appeared in the movies themselves. Technically making them... cannon.

I really hope that the devs of the mod DO NOT limit themselves creatively just because this and that was just an alternate timeline or because of the restrictive mentality some fans have.
It's ironic. The Star Trek universe is potentially rich and large and unrestrictive. Including all the canons that exist now is really just enriching everything. Yet "fans" neglect it because it's different.


In comparison, Star Wars truly HAS a small, very limited universe that only works because everything is rehashed everytime and the fans really just want more of that and if they expand on the lore through fanfic, it's basically lightsabers, black and white, sith and jedi. And if all else fails: X-wings and Tie fighters.


IMO, a good mod for a game should offer some customization. If it's not possible to choose some sort of path (like Player A wants his federation in-line with TOS and build from there, player B would rather have a Kelvin-timeline federation and so on), may be there could be alternate factions then.

i guess we prooved, that we havnt limited ourself.
but like every ST-nerd also we have our own preferences.
the new jjverse gives a lot of assets and storys, but the 3 movies cannot have the same weight like the old movies or the 750 episodes.
one of the 3 movies was a remake of a older one, the left 2 movies have storys for 2 events.
the new species is implemented. the starbase from the 3th movie i declined because logical contradictions.

the ship models are nice, i didnt declined these, but its not easy to bring in 2 different models for the same ship. maybe i will make a submod as era update for the tos from the jjverse. or a complete another solution... ;)

the scenario start like in hoi/eu/ck is currently not possible because the lack of options from the base game. i said this to wiz a long time ago, i hope anytime it will be added in the future.


thx for your all ideas

Again, no one argued whatever the Kelvin timeline, or the ship it includes, are cannon or not. No one said they will never be included in the mod. No one, as grinsel said, declined including them.

What was ACTUALLY said that right now we made a decision to follow the prime timelin but that in the future we might have more options.

That's it.

Originally posted by Harel (suncrash):

Again, no one argued whatever the Kelvin timeline, or the ship it includes, are cannon or not. No one said they will never be included in the mod. No one, as grinsel said, declined including them.

What was ACTUALLY said that right now we made a decision to follow the prime timelin but that in the future we might have more options.

That's it.

I must have mistaken the nomenclature used. No disrespect meant to anyone here. You guys are doing great work!

Originally posted by itchy01ca01:

Originally posted by Harel (suncrash):

Again, no one argued whatever the Kelvin timeline, or the ship it includes, are cannon or not. No one said they will never be included in the mod. No one, as grinsel said, declined including them.

What was ACTUALLY said that right now we made a decision to follow the prime timelin but that in the future we might have more options.

That's it.

I must have mistaken the nomenclature used. No disrespect meant to anyone here. You guys are doing great work!

I think the problem is that the Vengeance is a Dreadnought class, instead of simply being classed as a Dreadnought.

It makes conversation confusing.

Originally posted by God-Emperor Hellriser623:

I think the problem is that the Vengeance is a Dreadnought class, instead of simply being classed as a Dreadnought.

It makes conversation confusing.

The most confusing thing is the use of the term Dreadnought in the first place.

In STID it was used smart. It's the class-name, not the "type". Dreadnought as a shiptype doesn't truly exist. The way fiction is using the word is hogwash, frankly.


Now, historically, one HMS Dreadnought in the early 20th century was the first "all big gun one caliber battleship". Previously, the "ship of the line" was still a thing.

So it was basically the modernization of naval warfare that gave birth to the term. Eventually though, the terms 'capital ship' and 'battleship' officially replaced the term 'dreadnought'.


Fiction nowadays simply makes creative, yet historically inaccurate use of that term.

Originally posted by redeyedraven:

The most confusing thing is the use of the term Dreadnought in the first place.

In STID it was used smart. It's the class-name, not the "type". Dreadnought as a shiptype doesn't truly exist. The way fiction is using the word is hogwash, frankly.


Now, historically, one HMS Dreadnought in the early 20th century was the first "all big gun one caliber battleship". Previously, the "ship of the line" was still a thing.

So it was basically the modernization of naval warfare that gave birth to the term. Eventually though, the terms 'capital ship' and 'battleship' officially replaced the term 'dreadnought'.


Fiction nowadays simply makes creative, yet historically inaccurate use of that term.

I entirely disagree. In terms of naval warfare, "Dreadnought" was not just the british capital ship, it is the era of the battleship class and the building practises that followed. The era that made all Battleships before it essentially worthless, nowadays dubbed the "Pre-Dreadnought" era.

Think of the Stellaris Battleship as something like Pre-Dread era, the Dreadnought class in Stellaris as the Dreadnought era, and Super-Dread's/Flagships (if we are going into New Ship Classes and More terminology) as the newest most modern of Fast Battleships.

It's not about using the terms that made sense back in the days of the early 1900's, it's about how to effectivly describe a large warship that is mightier than all that came before in terms that people will understand.