STAR WARS™ Empire at War: Gold Pack

STAR WARS™ Empire at War: Gold Pack

EaWX: Thrawn's Revenge 3.4 (Updated April 2nd)
Northstar May 6, 2019 @ 1:30pm
My opinions on From the Ground Up
This GC needs a serious rework.
First of all, the random starts for "neutral" planets soundes like a good idea on paper, but in reality it really isn't. In 2.1 there was a pattern to how units spawned: weak forces near the starting planet, increasingly powerful forces the farther you pushed and at shipyards, as well as a Dreadnought or two hidden somewhere for some extra epic battles. Now, Most early battles just end up feeling really dull because there's no real variety to the units you face. On top of this, it is very disapointing to have a strategically important planet guarded by only a few light frigates, almost as disapointing as it is frustrating to have a Syndic AND a Phalanx spawn right next to your starting planet.
Then there's starting positions. Starting positions for different factions are very different in terms of income and population cap. The New Republic has a realy rough start, while the Alignment has a much easier start. AI starting points are also really unbalanced, and more often than not one faction ends up taking the entire galaxy. For example, starting as the Empire, the New Republic has a lot more planets to start with than the Empire of the Hand and the player's faction. On higher difficultios, this just ends up with the New Republic claiming the entire galaxy in the time it takes the player to block off the Empire of the Hand. After that, it's just a massive brawl for the Depp Core and Hapes Cluster. Well, once the player is finally able to get out one full assault fleet at least.
If I wanted to try capturing 75% of the galaxy from era 5 NR I'd just play Caamas Crisis.
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Showing 1-5 of 5 comments
Corey Loses  [developer] May 7, 2019 @ 8:42am 
1. Even with random starts, there's a pattern to how the combat power and random spawns are assigned, so that there are always a couple easier targets near starting points.

2. Especially within the different Imperial factions, there's *meant* to be varying levels of difficulty. With the NR, there's only one NR faction, so it gets what would typically be the point of the GC (harder start), but with 6 Imperial factions, when you remove the starting territory since it's all one planet for everyone, and the heroes, then there's not much room for variation, which means having some Imperial starts be harder and some be easier allows for at least some level of variety there.

3. There's only two other factions per map, so yeah, just like it's always more likely for some factions to gain a stronger foothold in other GCs, that'll be true in FTGU as well. There's a wide variety of GCs in the mod, if you don't like one of them, there's about 19 others you may enjoy more. If you did enjoy Caamas more than FTGU, then you can play that one.
Northstar May 7, 2019 @ 11:05am 
Originally posted by Corey:
1. Even with random starts, there's a pattern to how the combat power and random spawns are assigned, so that there are always a couple easier targets near starting points.

2. Especially within the different Imperial factions, there's *meant* to be varying levels of difficulty. With the NR, there's only one NR faction, so it gets what would typically be the point of the GC (harder start), but with 6 Imperial factions, when you remove the starting territory since it's all one planet for everyone, and the heroes, then there's not much room for variation, which means having some Imperial starts be harder and some be easier allows for at least some level of variety there.

3. There's only two other factions per map, so yeah, just like it's always more likely for some factions to gain a stronger foothold in other GCs, that'll be true in FTGU as well. There's a wide variety of GCs in the mod, if you don't like one of them, there's about 19 others you may enjoy more. If you did enjoy Caamas more than FTGU, then you can play that one.

Yes, I understand what you're getting at, but I think you're missing a few points. There may be some pattern to how random spawns are assigned, but FTGU in 2.1 felt like it had a narrative. With a Phalanx and a Syndic both spawning at a light shipyard planet with +40 income right next to my starting planet, while Kuat is guarded by a few light frigates it becomes a little difficult to get that same feeling.

Furhtermore, the I have nothing against spawns being a little different or difficult, but when it gets to the point of the NR barely being able to expand from their starting planet due to low unit cap, low eco, and captial ships spawning next to their starting planet, it gets a little frustrating.

Finally, there's nothing wrong with one faction gaining a stronger foothold, but I do not support the idea of factions being so immensely unevenly balanced from the start as they are in the Remnant start for FTGU. I don't know if I enjoy Cammas or Remnant FTGU more, it's pretty difficult to tell when they turn into pretty much the same GC after and hour or two, just without the much-needed Tector, Venator and Executor/Bellators.

Edit: Just for reference, here's all the starting positions for FTGU:
NR
Unit cap: 15
Eco: +40
AI planets: IR 8, EotH 3
(Note: 1 planet between player and nearest AI)
IR
Unit cap: 39
Eco: +85
AI planets: NR 8, EotH 1
(Note: EotH and NR effectively cut off from each other)
EotH
Unit cap: 30
Eco: +85
AI planets: IR 5, NR 4
PA
Unit cap: 33
Eco: +120
AI planets: IR 7, NR 5, EotH 1
GM
Unit cap: 30
Eco: +85
AI planets: IR 6, NR 5
ZE
Unit cap: 30
Eco: +50
AI planets: IR 8, NR 5
EA
Unit cap: 15
Eco: +30
AI planets: IR 7, NR 5
(Note: 3 planets between player and nearest AI)
DL
Unit cap: 20
Eco: +35
AI planets: IR 5, NR 4, EotH 1
(Note: 3 planets between player and nearest AI)

For example of NR barely able to expand, see my screenshot library.
For example of Phalanx and Syndic next to starting planet, see my screenshot library

I don't want to be the one beating a dead horse, but I started FTGU as NR. Guess what, Syndic at Tangrene, Majestic at Telos, Syndic and Peltast at Ossus, 2 Syndics and 1 Peltast at Hast, Syndic at New Alderaan. That's 8 capital ships in the general starting area, leaving Mon Calamari and Bimmisaari as the only viable targets and blocking off just about all of the high income planets.
Last edited by Northstar; May 7, 2019 @ 1:20pm
JediLordNathan May 8, 2019 @ 4:52pm 
Personally I'd like for the option to build heroes in this start
Northstar Jun 1, 2019 @ 2:15pm 
Originally posted by OmegusTheSecond:
Isn't it fun when you're attacking Coruscant, thinking you've got this in the bag, and then TWO STAR DESTROYER 2S APPEAR OUT OF NOWHERE WITH A MASSIVE SUPPORT FLEET
How to avoid that: Jump in with a ship that has the hyperspace retreat ability and see if a raid fleet will appear or not. If one will appear, just retreat that one unit and try again.
Alternatively just roll with it and have a more challenging battle
chrisma Jan 18, 2020 @ 3:34am 
"(...) I'd like for the option to build heroes in this start"

Me too. The 'Pentastar Alignment' can build two ground units and an SSD hero, if I remember correctly. 'Building' heroes would also resemble the skirmish mechanic which this campaign would the represent on a strategic level.

Generally, I agree with 'Northstar' that 'From the Ground Up' is mostly 'waiting' for fleet construction and then 'grinding' down a galaxy of a single 'AI' opponent. It didn't felt that way in 2.2. when most worlds were still neutral when the player shifted into territorial expansion.

An option for starting eras could also suit this campaign.
On paper it is the most 'interesting' 'galactic conquest', offering a 'what if' experience.
I'm glad that it is in development at all, just wish it would be given more attention in regard to it's 'game flow'.
Last edited by chrisma; Jan 18, 2020 @ 3:35am
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