Concerning behaviour of certain developers - is this money laundering?

[crunchyfrog]

I'm not aware anyone has posted this, but SidAlpha has recently made a VERY intersting video about these games which could indeed be attempts to money launder.

Of course, you're not liable to find out clear empirical evidence, but it is HIGHLY suspicious for these Chinese developers to offer games for 200 dollars a pop with no apparent publicising to speak of (quite the opposite).

These are hallmarks of money laundering, and I bring it up to hopefully bring it to Steam's attention, if they haven't seen it already.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2wyY1s1PuA

[cinedine]

Messaggio originale di crunchyfrog:

Messaggio originale di cinedine:

So if I claim you are a serial killer that has merits because ... I claim it? Claim's merit stand on their evidence. Which, yes, can be logical deduction. But even that is lacking big times in the video and some statements can easily be refuted.

Again, I am NOT claiming they are, I am not clainming they aren't.
Did you bother reading what I wrote at all.

I take the DEFAULT position and am posting this merely to draw Valve's attention to it. Nothing more.

Now unless you actually have something to add, I'm not responding further as I've made the point clear several times.

By posting it you already took a position. By asking Valve to look into it you took a position. There is no "default". You already condemned them.

But anyway that has nothing to do with my posting. I don't ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ care what you claim. But saying that each claim merits an investigation and stands on its own merit - even if made by a serial liar - is asinine and wrong.
And pretty rich coming from Mr "Show me da evidence!!!".

[Nx Machina]

Messaggio originale di crunchyfrog:

Where have I said you can't respond? Yet more strawmanning.

I made it clear - you are NOT entitled to say what I have done, which is what you are trying to do.

That's enough.

Strawmanning as in > Prove it? Where is your evidence? Your go to response.

I do not require your permission to say anything. I am not your child, do not assume I am.

You posted a clickbait video which contains no evidence of money laundering then want to wash your hands of it.

You already are convinced it is money laundering or is that not your words?

Messaggio originale di crunchyfrog:

but it is HIGHLY suspicious for these Chinese developers to offer games for 200 dollars a pop with no apparent publicising to speak of (quite the opposite).

These are hallmarks of money laundering, and I bring it up to hopefully bring it to Steam's attention, if they haven't seen it already.

It is not money laundering, only speculation and that is not proof, "oh he who requires proof".

Open forum, open thread.

[Black Blade]

Messaggio originale di Kusa:

Open forum, open thread.

Well it's not an open forum, as it does require to remain on topic

Attacking the poster is not part of the topic

I don't know if I just see it differently but any type of statement that may be an idea I find interesting, regardless if it holds any water or not
Open horizon

A lot of the posts here seem to be more like attacking the poster then attacking the topic of the subject itself, or if it's possible or not

If someone comes and ask "I wonder if somewhere pigs can fly?" so the topic should be attacked, why a pig cant fly, and why is that relevant everywhere
Not why the one that asks it asked it, that is not relevant to the topic that does not point to the poster itself

I also point out this is not the first place I feel I see this way of the discussions, it may be me, but you guys can read your own posts and decide your self what is your view on it

So can we please leave the "claim, you claim" and just stick to the topic on theory and not stick it to actions? discussion for the merit of discussion

And just in case

Place rick and morty sense with the "I am not telling you what to do I am only sharing how I feel"

Source: was unable to find it :(

[Friends with Benedicts]

It COULD be a really stupid and inefficient laundry scheme, but it's way more likely simply a cheapshot at earning easy bucks. Seriously, I did a 3 year course on gaming design and I guarantee you anyone can make these asset flips. Just download unity, learn to program some ifs and updates, then do the proper object to script association. It could be done in less than a month if someone is used to doing this kind of ♥♥♥♥.

You should try Jim Sterling and Bellular News. They're much better YT on gaming industry.

EDIT: Also, @crunchy, you should try and read Sleepy's reply. You seem inclined to believe Valve would turn a blind eye to this situation whereas he claimed Valve has already looked into these problems in the past. Are you just inclined to believe Valve doesn't give a ♥♥♥♥ about anything other than making some bucks? It's not what their actions have showed in the past, so I'm seeing baseless claims vs evidence.

[Start_Running]

Messaggio originale di Black Blade:

A lot of the posts here seem to be more like attacking the poster then attacking the topic of the subject itself, or if it's possible or not.

Well thats kinda to be expected when the topic has so little actual substance to it. This is just shy of 'Chemtrails are Mind control gasses spread by lizard people!".

Thusly one must question the motive of the poster for putting up such a topic for discussion.

Doing such things even speculatively can be considered a form of slander.

Messaggio originale di CMDR Friends with Benedicts:

You should try Jim Sterling and Bellular News. They're much better YT on gaming industry.

And the joke is they're pretty bad at it as well. It's basically like saying you're the best Hentai Slider puzzle. developer.

As fr as money laundering goes. It COULD be . And a person COULD win the lottery 3 times in a row. But yeah...not very likely. So much so that aeven a speculative claim needs to be backed up with some solid evidence.

ALready been pointed out that no money launderer would actyually do this, as there are easier, more accessible, equally legal, but more covert methods of doing so, that have a waaaay lower overhead.

[Friends with Benedicts]

I've noticed that most people that think Jim has a poor content mainly don't like it because he's openly left wing. You may not like him, but he does a decent job specially compared to many clickbaits. Now Bellular fails to me why you would place him in the same boat as SidAlpha

[Nx Machina]

@Black Blade.

It is an open forum. Welcome to Steam discussions, all are welcome and the OP has thrown up a thread for discussion with little substance only speculation.

Odd how you mention on topic whilst been off topic but let's be honest moderators decide what is on topic.

Odd how you overlook the OP's use of the word claim/claims.

Attacking? Your way off base, yet have no problem with the OP taking a dig at others.

As an opinion is based from a personal viewpoint then holding water has no relevance from any viewpoint including your own.

Finally it is not for you to decide what may be included nor to steer the conversation in a set direction.

My opinion and points stand.

[Satoru]

Messaggio originale di CMDR Friends with Benedicts:

It COULD be a really stupid and inefficient laundry scheme, but it's way more likely simply a cheapshot at earning easy bucks.

This is again dumb because you can make MORE money, faster and easier for a 'cheap buck' selling those scam wallet cards on g2a. that site will GLADLY launder your money for you. If you need a cheap way to do it, scam wallet cards is faster, easier and better.

[Friends with Benedicts]

@Satoru well, selling asset flips is not actually a crime, and maybe the creators themselves feel more fulfilled that way. I surely do not have the answer as to why people would do this, but there are thousand of asset flips out there. It's not hard to believe some of these low effort games were made "just because".

[Radene]

Messaggio originale di Black Blade:

Messaggio originale di Start_Running:

No this is not money laundering. It'd be a rather ♥♥♥♥♥♥ way to do so given you lose 30% off the top., and that's before applicable taxes.

It's likely just some publisher doing it for the lols or simply hoping to find a few easy whales.

Nothing illegal there. You can sell anything for just about any price you want. Or more accurately you can ask anyprice you want for something you're selling. Thats the right of the retailer. Just like a worker may choose what wage or salary they will work for.

The better question is .. who the heck is buying the games.

To be completely honest 30% is not that bad for money laundering overall, I mean there doing something unlegal, so losing 30% is really not all that bad

30% is a lot.

[cinedine]

Messaggio originale di Radene:

Messaggio originale di Black Blade:

To be completely honest 30% is not that bad for money laundering overall, I mean there doing something unlegal, so losing 30% is really not all that bad

30% is a lot.

It's 30 % from the US sale price.
In countries with VAT included you are already losing the tax and then 30 % from whatever's left over. Which you than have to pay income tax on, as it's more than a bit stupid to expose your money laundrey with tax evasion.
And that's assuming no royalties from the game engine.

So yeah, it's a lot. And even more. If the numbers are against you, the loss can be up to 50 %.

[crunchyfrog]

Messaggio originale di CMDR Friends with Benedicts:

It COULD be a really stupid and inefficient laundry scheme, but it's way more likely simply a cheapshot at earning easy bucks. Seriously, I did a 3 year course on gaming design and I guarantee you anyone can make these asset flips. Just download unity, learn to program some ifs and updates, then do the proper object to script association. It could be done in less than a month if someone is used to doing this kind of ♥♥♥♥.

You should try Jim Sterling and Bellular News. They're much better YT on gaming industry.

EDIT: Also, @crunchy, you should try and read Sleepy's reply. You seem inclined to believe Valve would turn a blind eye to this situation whereas he claimed Valve has already looked into these problems in the past. Are you just inclined to believe Valve doesn't give a ♥♥♥♥ about anything other than making some bucks? It's not what their actions have showed in the past, so I'm seeing baseless claims vs evidence.

Erm, no I didn't. I never made any such claim that Valve would or wouldn't do anything.

I repeat yet again, ALL I've done is say "hey Valve, check this out" - no opinion, nothing. I don't know WHERE you got that idea from.

As for Jim Sterling, I already watch his stuff and many others. I am no fan of Sid Alpha nor anyone, frankly because again I have no opinion of anyone in particular. I take claims on their own merits.

But thank you for the suggestions nonetheless.

[crunchyfrog]

Messaggio originale di CMDR Friends with Benedicts:

I've noticed that most people that think Jim has a poor content mainly don't like it because he's openly left wing. You may not like him, but he does a decent job specially compared to many clickbaits. Now Bellular fails to me why you would place him in the same boat as SidAlpha

Yeah I don't get the hatred either because he's DEMONSTRABLY correct time and again. In fact, to everyone that has professed to moaning about him it's literally "burble, burble burble".

Plus I don't see anything wrong with being openly left wing - all that matters is one thing - can you back it up?

For myself, I'm more left as I was chair of my local Labour party for several years so he doesn't seem remotely odd to me. Maybe he just does to an American audience where they're WAY more right? I don't know.

[Black Blade]

Messaggio originale di Kusa:

@Black Blade.

It is an open forum. Welcome to Steam discussions, all are welcome and the OP has thrown up a thread for discussion with little substance only speculation.

Odd how you mention on topic whilst been off topic but let's be honest moderators decide what is on topic.

Odd how you overlook the OP's use of the word claim/claims.

Attacking? Your way off base, yet have no problem with the OP taking a dig at others.

As an opinion is based from a personal viewpoint then holding water has no relevance from any viewpoint including your own.

Finally it is not for you to decide what may be included nor to steer the conversation in a set direction.

My opinion and points stand.

Have you read the last part of my post? if not here is the short of it:
I am not telling you what to do, I am simply sharing how I feel

You are correct and I do not deny in any way, mods have the final say of what is off-topic, but that normally shown with tread lock
And I don't think we need to get to the final part of them needing to come in and do it, if we can moderate our self

I am not sure what you mean what I overlook, if you mean that I reply to you and not to him or something that simple that I took the last

Besides that, the attack is for everyone no one specific

As an opinion is based from a personal viewpoint then holding water has no relevance from any viewpoint including your own.

Finally it is not for you to decide what may be included nor to steer the conversation in a set direction.

My opinion and points stand.

I am not telling you what to do, I am simply sharing how I feel
I do not decide, but as you said your self its an open forum and therefore I am allowed to suggest, just as you can, just as OP can and anyone can
You can take my feelings however you want, or completely ignore them, I am not telling you what to do I am simply sharing what I feel

And if it's not clear I am repeating that line over and over because I have no idea how I can stress to you the point beyond that

On any case I am not going to reply to anything more about that, that to me seems off-topic, you do with that as you wish

has thrown up a thread for discussion with little substance only speculation.

Messaggio originale di Start_Running:

Well thats kinda to be expected when the topic has so little actual substance to it. This is just shy of 'Chemtrails are Mind control gasses spread by lizard people!".

Thusly one must question the motive of the poster for putting up such a topic for discussion.

Doing such things even speculatively can be considered a form of slander.

Then the topic can die for inactivity, if there is no substance to the topic, it has no reason to become a battleground that is not on the topic
something that I think goes against the:

Messaggio originale di Steam Rules:

General Rules

Do not do any of the following:

• Derail a thread's topic

Source: https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=4045-USHJ-3810
Rule but I am not telling you what to do I am simply sharing how I feel

[Black Blade]

Messaggio originale di Radene:

30% is a lot.

Messaggio originale di cinedine:

It's 30 % from the US sale price.
In countries with VAT included you are already losing the tax and then 30 % from whatever's left over. Which you than have to pay income tax on, as it's more than a bit stupid to expose your money laundrey with tax evasion.
And that's assuming no royalties from the game engine.

So yeah, it's a lot. And even more. If the numbers are against you, the loss can be up to 50 %.

I guess it kind of depends on the case, I honestly said it was not much taking from memory something about money laundry I read years ago that I think they lost like 70% on it, and were ok with it, as they basically are making free money somewhat, as they do very little income and a lot of outcome from where it was seeing that its basically illegal money

I really should not take things from memory like that, to be honest, not even sure where I read it, but ya, guess 30% is a little too much, even that then remember game developer is also losing 30% supposedly and all, and some of them can still make a profit.. so... I don't know, but as of all the disagree I guess I was way off on that