WHY SHOULD WE SUFFER, VALVE? PLS READ.

[Domojaxx]

Why should traders suffer even more? You made so many changes that affected trading that you almost killed it. It's so difficult to trade cross sets with 1:1 value, that most people BUY the cards, due to your changes Valve. Most people have dropped the forum trading discussions and get less by the minute.

WHY NOT MAKE A BETTER ALGORITHM? An algorithm that eliminates the trading card feature for the placement of games? Do you really think that dropping cards LATER will stop anything? It will just prolong it. As for bots - YOU MADE THAT MISTAKE - PEOPLE can MAKE 200+ ACCOUNTS, BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T PUT A LIMIT TO THE ACC NUMBER! IF YOU set that limit to 1 acc MAX per person, that would make a change. BAN THE BOT ACCOUNTS, you found! Some have only 1 friend and bots named from number 1 to 200 with same pic. Multiaccounting exists for you to make more money or not?

WHY NOT LIMIT GREENLIGHT process regarding cards? IF THAT's really the problem, you should NOT AFFECT YOUR 10 MILLION USER BASE but the exploiters of that system, right!?

VALVE, SHARE such things sooner and discuss them with your users, INSTEAD OF SHOVING AN UPDATE MONTHS LATER AFTER YOU THOUGHT THAT YOU HAVE FOUND A PROPER WAY OF DEALING WITH your problems.

NORMAL PEOPLE buy games BECAUSE of REVIEWS,SCREENSHOTS, GAMEPLAY, WORD of MOUTH and NOT affected by a game showing as Popular.
TRADERS buy games because of REASONS LISTED ABOVE OR the need TO collect cards.

There are different kinds of people, and you should treat them as such - don't make ALL people suffer, because of the actions of BAD greedy people.

TL:DR Valve is making changes to trading cards (http://steamcommunity.com/games/593110/announcements/detail/1954971077935370845) so I am ranting about how the problem they see could be combatted, instead of the changes they will make. They want cards to drop at a later point than current settings, because of other people exploiting their service for monetary gains and wanting to make games be purchased only from their store. So Valve doesn't affect the multiaccounting which could have a bigger impact on the matter, and want to make more themselves. My point of view - not 100% of Valve's reasons and why they are actually implementing their changes. Maybe because of other stores selling keys for less money which are authorised resellers like HumbleBundle etc?

[Domojaxx]

[quote=LawndaleLion;

If they did just that, then they could tackle other issues. We're just talking about the tip of the iceberg here. Steam has so many other problems such as censorship en masse on game forums, people having to buy second copies of old games on GOG just to make them work on Steam, and Early Access somehow still existing. And yes, I get it, some games have succeeded via EA, and props to those that have, but ultimately that's what you have beta testers and the like for. One game abandoned is one too many. [/quote]

You are right. Servers / game items having ridiculous prices / gambling / steam support / scammers / and other changes - the list is quite big. One user wrote to me that his client has a blackscreen on everything than the Library tab. Why he wrote to me? Cause I was active in 1 of the few support toipics for the issue and that topic is now LOCKED...

So, yeah - cards are the smallest problem, but have been one of the two coping mechanisms with the rest of the problems with Steam (The other being Gaming.)

[Satoru]

1) complains about constrained supply leading to higher prices

2) uses low prices of cards to level up

Solution: constrain supply on Greenlight which will raise prices......

I don't think you understand how this works

[Aerooooooo]

Escrito originalmente por Domojaxx:

So, yeah - cards are the smallest problem, but have been one of the two coping mechanisms with the rest of the problems with Steam (The other being Gaming.)

If you need money for gaming on Steam, get a job or use Steam wallet cards. It seems really simple to me.

"Coping" is code word for enabling. And we've seen the results of said enabling for years now.

[Tito Shivan]

Cards meant to be something you got while you played the game. Not something you play the game for. I personally like how the new changes work in strengthening that mindset.

[Domojaxx]

Escrito originalmente por Satoru:

1) complains about constrained supply leading to higher prices

2) uses low prices of cards to level up

Solution: constrain supply on Greenlight which will raise prices......

I don't think you understand how this works

Maybe you are right, as I don't do such things.
I hope changes are actually for the better.

[Start_Running]

Escrito originalmente por Narcoleptic Marshmallow:

So basically, we only get cards if we actually play the games now? I'm failing to see the bad in it.

Actually the game itse

Escrito originalmente por Domojaxx:

Escrito originalmente por Narcoleptic Marshmallow:

So basically, we only get cards if we actually play the games now? I'm failing to see the bad in it.

More like it if the game is played overall and meets a certain criterion. If you yourself haven't played the game at all and cards are approved you will be able to drop them.

I'm guessing this will be m,ore or less factor. The number of Steam purchases as well as the number of refunds perhaps, maybe with Cumulative playtime thrown in.

Naturally event cards will an exception.

If anything this means that card prices and value will probably go up, since it reduces the ability of people to level up with junk cards. Thusly, cardw will be more valueable

[Domojaxx]

Escrito originalmente por LawndaleLion:

Escrito originalmente por Domojaxx:

So, yeah - cards are the smallest problem, but have been one of the two coping mechanisms with the rest of the problems with Steam (The other being Gaming.)

If you need money for gaming on Steam, get a job or use Steam wallet cards. It seems really simple to me.

"Coping" is code word for enabling. And we've seen the results of said enabling for years now.

I mean that i am mad for Steam not bettering their actual service, like a better usage for ther Beta client, or buying better servers.

I have a job and have money, but I would rather buy pills for the health of my grandmother who is sick than spend it on stupid things like cards, making profit for devs who are the said exploiters and for Valve who don't move their ass to make a better quality control (of Greenlight services / steam support)

I don't think i should spend money to get cards - that will make me more or less part of the problem - totally on the other side of my point.

If you are here to troll, with that money comment - just get out.

[Domojaxx]

Escrito originalmente por Tito Shivan:

Cards meant to be something you got while you played the game. Not something you play the game for. I personally like how the new changes work in strengthening that mindset.

True, so Steam should have put more manpower and more requirements behind Greenlight or card drops in genrel in the first place. But games that are already out that are bad and have a cool badge are already approved by Valve, so i cannot return them the the Greenlight test phase before realease and i won't play them because they are bad. Valve is at fault for realeasing them - why not make a badge out of it.

The mindset of people won't change with announced future changes though. There will be exploits sadly. Some people play games - some don't.

And I don't like to play games AT ALL for cards and take hours of download and GB of space. I prefer to idle them for 2 hours and play them whenver I have the time and enjoy them. Trading and gaming are 2 different things for me and many users. People dropping cards only by idling are NOT playing games in actuality.

[cinedine]

Escrito originalmente por Tito Shivan:

Cards meant to be something you got while you played the game. Not something you play the game for. I personally like how the new changes work in strengthening that mindset.

From the moment they tied levels to it, cards where meant as a cash cow. In F2P games the intention has always been spend money. And the Summer Adventure sale (the one with points for crafted badges) has made it abundantly clear that they were just milking.

Achievements are also meant as something you got "while you play". And from the get-go it has become something people "play for". That was several years before cards.

A company that employs economists to analyze in-game economy and has such a high user-base to gether analytical data regarding behaviour from doesn't introduce something like this as a nice-to-have for the players.
Even the introduction of cards speaks volumes. Start with a small subset that is "easily" collectable and sparks the 'Gotta catch'em all!"-attidute many gamers have and subsequently broaden the pool.

[Aerooooooo]

Escrito originalmente por Tito Shivan:

Cards meant to be something you got while you played the game. Not something you play the game for. I personally like how the new changes work in strengthening that mindset.

I agree entirely. But money is the root....

[[CFE]SANDMAN37©]

Think about it,you own nothing,its all a illusion,sure you have a DRM account with forfited ownership of your product and someone deciding and dictating the house of cards,should you expect anything less? its like a big cow with lots of teets,everyone sucking off them but when the cow decides enough is enough the tap is turned off,of course its ruined,when those changes happend that was the deviding line,question is how much is one willing to put up with? only thing keeping peaple here on that side of the fense yes peaple who can see the bs is the fact one has spent duckets and is a great loss if one leaves,kinda stuck in the middle wouldent you say.all roads lead back to the cow while the pups cant do anything about it.

[Aerooooooo]

Escrito originalmente por Domojaxx:

Escrito originalmente por LawndaleLion:

If you need money for gaming on Steam, get a job or use Steam wallet cards. It seems really simple to me.

"Coping" is code word for enabling. And we've seen the results of said enabling for years now.

I mean that i am mad for Steam not bettering their actual service, like a better usage for ther Beta client, or buying better servers.

I have a job and have money, but I would rather buy pills for the health of my grandmother who is sick than spend it on stupid things like cards, making profit for devs who are the said exploiters and for Valve who don't move their ass to make a better quality control (of Greenlight services / steam support)

I don't think i should spend money to get cards - that will make me more or less part of the problem - totally on the other side of my point.

If you are here to troll, with that money comment - just get out.

I am not trolling whatsoever.

I'm simply making the point that if you want to spend money on Steam, you should do so via what you've earned from working for it or via Steam wallet cards.

Wallet cards are not the problem. You don't see them adversely affecting the PSN, do you?

I hope your grandmother gets better also. Very respectable of you to put your money towards helping her.

[Aerooooooo]

Escrito originalmente por Orange Sunshine:

Think about it,you own nothing,its all a illusion,sure you have a DRM account with forfited ownership of your product and someone deciding and dictating the house of cards,should you expect anything less? its like a big cow with lots of teets,everyone sucking off them but when the cow decides enough is enough the tap is turned off,of course its ruined,when those changes happend that was the deviding line,question is how much is one willing to put up with? only thing keeping peaple here on that side of the fense yes peaple who can see the bs is the fact one has spent duckets and is a great loss if one leaves,kinda stuck in the middle wouldent you say.all roads lead back to the cow while the pups cant do anything about it.

The only reason I even still use Steam is because the games I play need it. I've been done with gaming for a long time now - I just stick to what I already own instead of buying new games, so I need Steam to play what I own.

I agree with the rest, though. Ultimately we are hamsters spinning in our wheels, because not too many people will like leaving behind something they've spent thousands upon thousands on.

[Purple Tentacle]

i've read through most of this thread and im still struggling to see how your negativly effected by this change. people who trade cards will still trade cards people who sell/buy them will continue selling and buying them

im also not sold on the price of cards going up either, i suspect you'll see a 0.01 rise at the very most as this wont effect card supply on any game rather than the terrible "games" that were only created so cards can be created for them. before these games were popular prices were pretty much the same and people traded cards i see no reason why theres going to be a significant increase or even an increase at all now they are (hopefully) going away

i applaud valve for this change

[The End]

And that's when our group of bad actors arrived, aiming to make money by releasing 'fake' games on Steam.

These fake developers take advantage of a feature we provide to all developers on Steam, which is the ability to generate Steam keys for their games. They generate many thousands of these keys and hand them out to bots running Steam accounts, which then idle away in their games to collect Trading Cards. Even if no real players ever see or buy one of these fake games, their developers make money by farming cards.

http://steamcommunity.com/games/593110/announcements/detail/1954971077935370845

I think the change Valve is making is a great change, they will reduce the scumbag developers who made fake games just to earn money on tradingcards.

If you think this change is a problem for you, then you obviously was a part of the problem.

Good job Valve.