Slay the Spire

Slay the Spire

This game is terrible and I'm done with roguelikes.
And now I'm going to update my review about how toxic the community is as well.
Naposledy upravil Red Painted Elk; 26. kvě. 2024 v 9.46
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Zobrazeno 115 z 91 komentářů
Long story short: you've been proven wrong, already. About almost all of that. You're just currently bad at the game, and it sounds like you'll refuse to listen to advice or people that can help you, so you probably always will be. But it also sounds like roguelikes and other such highly cerebral games aren't really for you, so it's probably for the best, anyway.
Naposledy upravil LHGreen; 26. kvě. 2024 v 5.34
If its not for you and you are struggling then play something you like. Obviously. However, just to quickly deal with your main numbered pts:

1. Your deck is your strategy. Every hand you draw should lean into that after you have actually developed the deck a bit via the cards and relics you gain. If you have no synergies then you wont hit any synergies. If your deck is just random stuff with no plan then yes, you will likely have a hard time of it. That said, decks with no overriding theme but consisting of just good stuff can still do well. As long as they have some balance. Leading me to;

If you didnt draw a defensive card then maybe you weighted your deck too heavily with other stuff? If you keep your deck fairly balanced then you wont have this problem. In a quite small deck you will cycle through all your cards in the space of 3-4 turns (or less). You might sometimes get sub optimal turns but how you build the deck will determine that to a large degree.

2. The bosses will always tend to have good attacks and debuffs etc. Your deck should be more than capable of dealing with them by the time you get there. Even in act one you should be able to muster up a decent defence to the bosses strongest attack or ways to mitigate it.

BWZS Clem původně napsal:
Of course a ton of you will just say 'git gud', but NONE of you have gotten 'gud', you have only gotten lucky.

3. (You didnt call it 3 but it seems to be another complaint in line with 1 and 2). People who have played a bit and have bothered to learn the mechanics will tend to do well every run. Some people (who are way better than me) will win the vast majority of the runs they play because they craft their deck in the most optimal fashion. Its not a case of luck, its a case of knowing what you are doing. I find the whole "git gud" thing a bit toxic tbh but the fact remains that the "gud" players and even the ones like me who are competent but not outstanding do fine by playing the game as it should be played. Just to reiterate, its not a case of playing countless runs in order to get lucky. Its possible to get a winning deck in pretty much every run. Thats not luck.

All this aside, if its not for you then move along. Its a great game. The combos and synergies are the thing that keeps me coming back for more. I guess its not for everyone.

Edit: Oh, I see you deleted your lengthy rant post (with bullet pointed whines) and replaced it with "im going to cry about all the nasty people telling me im wrong in my review of the game". Funny. Bye sweety.
Naposledy upravil Banzai; 26. kvě. 2024 v 16.25
The fact that people can consistently have high win streaks in this game proves you wrong, though. Gremlin Nob is a frustrating boss, but he teaches you a lesson early on in the game, which is that you're not going to have a hitless run, you have to treat your health as a resource and plan accordingly.
Looking at your complaints, you have no clue how the game works and are frustrated by game mechanics you don't understand.

Of course, you blame your lack of skill and knowledge on RNG and call it a slot machine instead of faulting yourself for it. That's a very common reaction.

But here's the thing. If any of us creates a new profile they can win game first try 99-100%. Why can't you and why is it a slot machine that everyone else can consistently win at? We're not talking of being lucky, but stopping to play after 50 wins in a row, because it gets boring not to lose.

That very first elite you fought gets stronger for each skill (usually a defend) you play, so playing blocks is objectively bad. You hit him over the head without blocking once.

As a general rule, each elite you expect to lose 20-40 HP to, 60 if all goes wrong. That's not a slot machine, that's resource management (HP). You know that fighting 2 elites on your path costs you 40-80 HP.
You plan accordingly, as Ironclad heal from normal fights, include campfires to rest and shops where you might buy a potion to speed up the fight and reduce the HP loss.

You also chose a path that branches off, so you can skip the elite if you don't get a damage card in your first 3 fights.

Don't even try to theory craft your dream deck and build it. You take what you get or skip it. You'll look for 2 card synergies, or even 1 card synergies and build around that. You'll pick up cards you don't want, because they are necessary to survive or to kill the next elite and you learn to deal with it and how to build a working deck out of it.

And that's why people like the game.
Naposledy upravil Spawnling; 26. kvě. 2024 v 8.00
Hearts™ původně napsal:
The fact that people can consistently have high win streaks in this game proves you wrong, though. Gremlin Nob is a frustrating boss, but he teaches you a lesson early on in the game, which is that you're not going to have a hitless run, you have to treat your health as a resource and plan accordingly.
^This! Lot's of high players have consistent winstreaks!
And Gremlin Nob, to me, was a great lesson. After losing to him like 3 times, I figured out what Hearts was saying. It is some damage, but health is a resource you have to manage, which is a very different concept to most games. I found once I treated health like a resource, and not something to be hoarded, I did consistently better.
BWZS Clem původně napsal:
So, if skill is the main driver of this game, this SHOULDN'T happen and people who have 'mastered' the 'hard mechanics' should be able to CONSISTENTLY win.

I don't see that, not even in the best streamers.
People are winning consistently.

The best streamers don't win 100% of their runs because they play 5 difficulties above the hardest difficulty the game intended to have and fight an optional boss, who added to make the game even harder for those who want.

To explain this: The developers intended the game to have 15 ascension levels, each making the game harder.
The community wanted more and together they added another 5.

You are failing against the first elite on ascension 0, they win on ascension 20, while taking on extra challenges to unlock act 4.

This is not meant as an insult, everyone died to act 1 elites, but most don't whine about. Instead they learn from their mistakes.
Naposledy upravil Spawnling; 26. kvě. 2024 v 6.33
I have about a 94% winrate at A0 across all four characters with an almost 400 game sample size. When the game came to phones, so I was playing a fresh account, I tried playing all four characters in a row while raising ascension each time, and it took me about 10 runs to lose for the first time. I'm also not even close to the best at this game, and this data is from my phone runs, which are often done while I'm out and about and not 100% focused, so I could easily improve that winrate if I wanted to. How could I win so consistently over so long a period, while you struggle to make it to even the first boss, if it is all RNG and no skill? Are you really so silly as to claim that everyone who is good at the game simply has permanent godlike RNG?

Lastly, the best streamers have " most runs still end in failure."? Where are you getting your data for that? For example, Xecnar has a spreadsheet of his hundreds of runs of A20H, and I'm seeing records like 74-26 (Defect), 78-22 (Silent), 84-16 (Ironclad), and Lifecoach has some similar records like 81-19 (Ironclad), and won 43 Watcher runs in a row. A20H is miles harder than A0, but they are still winning consistently. Still no skill involved and all RNG though, right?
Zu 26. kvě. 2024 v 7.34 
About the elite called Gremlin Nob that you mentioned: I feel like there's an opportunity here to look at things from the perspective of a Yugioh player.

Maxx C is still at 3 copies in Master Duel, right? That's a fair reason to put Droll & Lock Bird into your deck. (Or maybe this is no longer the case but bear with me.)

Similarly, knowing that the first elite you path towards is a 1 in 3 chance of being Gremlin Nob, low impact skills become less valuable. If you do fight him first, the next elite will be something else. If you don't, the next elite is still a 1 in 2 chance of Nob.
In other words, your evaluations of card rewards are always contextual, and this is something that distinguishes new players from experienced players.

Now let's go back to Maxx C. Even though it's powerful, if there's a tier 0 deck that's terrorizing the meta but (for some reason) does not play Maxx C, you wouldn't play Droll & Lock Bird either, would you?
Instead, say this tier 0 deck has a line of play where they end up with a wide board before extending further, suddenly you have more of a reason to run Nibiru to improve your matchup against it.

Importantly though: There's no guarantee.
You've been there before. You go second, you draw no hand traps or going second tools like Evenly Matched, your opponent develops a board with negates, ends their turn, and now you might as well surrender.
That's basically what it's like to draw 4 Defends and 1 Strike against Gremlin Nob at this game's difficulty level 18.

Look, I'm not denying that this game has more rng elements than Yugioh, especially across the 1 hour (on average) that you take to play through 1 run.
It absolutely does.
Nonetheless, if you ever feel like trying this game again, I promise you that you can reach a point where you win virtually every run (up until like difficulty 15).

And yes, there will be more moments where you see something for the first time and feel cheated like "Wait. Where did that 60 damage hyperbeam come from!?" Well, turns out it always happens on turn 6 and you better remember that 1 of 3 bosses in act 2 can do this. It's part of the learning curve.
No enemy in this game is truly random. Your skill issue is not knowing the game yet.
You can't possibly expect to know all the movesets and strategies 5 hours in. But this isn't an action game, if you don't think ahead you're going to have a difficult time. You should be able to defeat Act 1 unless you don't understand the game at all. The main point: synergy.
BWZS Clem původně napsal:

Sorry no, there is no strategy. It is just a slot machine.

*snip*

Decided to not waste time responding to the rest of your silliness. The above quote sums you up however - you have no understanding of how the game works so therefore you see each run as a coin flip or a scratch card lottery ticket etc. You are wrong, but you are too far gone to convince you otherwise so I would strongly suggest find something more to your liking to play. Ill informed rants here just make you look silly.

Suffice to say, regardless of the card options you are given, the route on offer, the shop items on sale and the relics you pick up, people can and do win runs regardless of getting the best stuff. No luck involved. Skill. And its not a case of playing run after run after run to do this. Im talking about literally every run. Pretty much every run is winnable if you make the right choices. You are not making the right choices. You thinking otherwise is Dunning Kruger in full effect. But thats fine. The game is pretty hard.

I wish you well in whatever you move onto. This game is not for you.

Edit: Please dont reward the OPs ignorance with clown awards. Please :)
Naposledy upravil Banzai; 26. kvě. 2024 v 8.23
I'm still not good at this game. I'd hesitate to even claim entry level competence. AND to top it off, I tend to dislike card collection games. This on though, somehow snagged my interest. I use to agree lock-stock-and-barrel...slot machine. Then, largely from reading posts herein, I started not just playing Act I...but actually paying attention to it. Where I use to route in order to avoid the various Elites...I started engaging them, adding to my relic count. I started going deeper into the game,m before getting slaughtered.

Oh I STILL get slaughtered more times than not. But now it tends to take the game longer to do so than it use to. Am I gud? Hell no. Am I better? Lil bit.
Grumpy Old Dude původně napsal:
I'm still not good at this game. I'd hesitate to even claim entry level competence. AND to top it off, I tend to dislike card collection games. This on though, somehow snagged my interest. I use to agree lock-stock-and-barrel...slot machine. Then, largely from reading posts herein, I started not just playing Act I...but actually paying attention to it. Where I use to route in order to avoid the various Elites...I started engaging them, adding to my relic count. I started going deeper into the game,m before getting slaughtered.

Oh I STILL get slaughtered more times than not. But now it tends to take the game longer to do so than it use to. Am I gud? Hell no. Am I better? Lil bit.
This. The fact that you have actually noticed how you have improved and therefore achieved more success as time has gone on proves the OP has no clue what he is talking about.

Personally I have played a lot of card games (going back to the early days of MtG) so I picked this up quicker than some will, but just like you I struggled until I worked things out here. And now I rarely lose a run when playing a daily climb for example. Again proving that the RNG element is far less important than how you manage the run.
Could've left your original post and 2 comments you've deleted. I'd have more stuff to laugh at, hahah :)
But seriously, A0 wins are not that hard. If you are struggling, there are mods that give you buffs, kind of like reverse ascensions* where the lower the level is, the more buffs you have. You could start with them, then work your way up
Naposledy upravil Little Horn; 26. kvě. 2024 v 9.50
BWZS Clem původně napsal:
Sorry no, my point still stands. Even the 'best' players fail runs most of the time. I really don't care what you have to say beyond that point.

No, they don't. Where the hell are you getting your info? That's definitively false.

BWZS Clem původně napsal:
I have probably watched 50+ hours of streamers on this game and I have never ONCE seen what you are describing. I don't take rando anon claims in forums as evidence.

What kind of ♥♥♥♥♥♥ streamers are you watching? The ones who actually know what they're doing stream A20 runs and still win more than half the time. Do you not realize that you're watching them play the hardest hard-mode the game has, and you can't handle the easiest? If they streamed runs on the level you're playing at, they'd never lose. They could do it live 24/7 for a year in a relay-style marathon and never lose once. That's not luck, that's skill.

Hell, I could make 10+ hour video of several runs at the level you play at and win them all.

BWZS Clem původně napsal:
You can be absolutely wiped in your 3rd encounter no matter how 'skilled' your deck design is.

YOU can. Most of us would usually find that difficult without deliberately trying to lose.

BWZS Clem původně napsal:
I reiterate, and you and EVERYONE else who has played this game has experienced it: You have gotten your dream cards, you have 'skilfully' upgraded and dropped cards, and you STILL fail before the end most likely due to a bad hand or boss buffs.

Not really, and not often. In my case, it's usually because I like to take risks for big rewards.

BWZS Clem původně napsal:
So, if skill is the main driver of this game, this SHOULDN'T happen and people who have 'mastered' the 'hard mechanics' should be able to CONSISTENTLY win.

For those people, it DOESN'T happen, and they're usually able to win with some consistency.

BWZS Clem původně napsal:
I don't see that, not even in the best streamers.

I see a lot of theorycrafting and wiki checking and community discourse but most runs still end in failure.

Again, where the hell are you getting your horrifically erroneous info from?
Naposledy upravil LHGreen; 26. kvě. 2024 v 10.09
LHGreen 26. kvě. 2024 v 10.13 
And here's his earlier posts, so that sniveling ♥♥♥♥♥ can't weasel his way out of anything:

BWZS Clem původně napsal:
Banzai původně napsal:
1. Your deck is your strategy.

Sorry no, there is no strategy. It is just a slot machine.

You may THINK there is some aspect of skill, like how you pull the lever or 'getting good' at pressing the reel stop buttons, but it's all an illusion.

A pretty well crafted one too, to encourage you to throw away hours and hours and hours and hours hoping for that elusive set of lucky draws on cards and relics so you too can proclaim yourself a hardcore gamer.

It's only slots, that's all it is. You can be absolutely wiped in your 3rd encounter no matter how 'skilled' your deck design is.

Banzai původně napsal:
2. The bosses will always tend to have good attacks and debuff

I'm not talking about bosses, I'm talking about elites. I don't even have a f$&king clue what the floor boss looks like and I'm not going to waste another 5 hours trying to RNG that.

Banzai původně napsal:
. People who have played a bit and have bothered to learn the mechanic

There ARE no hard mechanics, only RNG synergies that you either get or you don't. It is so amazingly frustrating that people like you are labeling a chance game as somehow strategy related.

I reiterate, and you and EVERYONE else who has played this game has experienced it: You have gotten your dream cards, you have 'skilfully' upgraded and dropped cards, and you STILL fail before the end most likely due to a bad hand or boss buffs.

So, if skill is the main driver of this game, this SHOULDN'T happen and people who have 'mastered' the 'hard mechanics' should be able to CONSISTENTLY win.

I don't see that, not even in the best streamers.

I see a lot of theorycrafting and wiki checking and community discourse but most runs still end in failure.

Again, not because the game is hard. If it were 'hard' mastery would convey winning advantage. It doesn't, all it does is slightly hedge your bets against disaster. And again, not nearly as influential as drawing two bad hands.

Look you can argue all you want, and claim this and that and point to a community of stockholm syndrome endurers with massive sunk cost fallacy going to support your claims of it being skill based.

But it's all just delusions you tell yourself so the hundreds of hours you sunk into a slot machine doesn't sting as much.
BWZS Clem původně napsal:
LHGreen původně napsal:
Long story short: you've been proven wrong

Sorry no, my point still stands. Even the 'best' players fail runs most of the time. I really don't care what you have to say beyond that point.
BWZS Clem původně napsal:
Hearts™ původně napsal:
The fact that people can consistently have high win streaks in this game proves you wrong,

I have probably watched 50+ hours of streamers on this game and I have never ONCE seen what you are describing. I don't take rando anon claims in forums as evidence.

Lol, damn, he even edited the OP, and went full chickenshit with it. Sorry I couldn't catch it.

Lol, and I love that I'M the only one who was even remotely toxic (because OP obviously set out to be toxic, so there was no reason to feign politeness), and yet you're ALL gonna take the flak for it!:steamhappy: Which just goes to show how toxic OP really is. ♥♥♥♥♥ is a lost cause.
Naposledy upravil LHGreen; 26. kvě. 2024 v 10.23
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