Silent pointers

[delu]

So, i'm trying to finish with all characters before moving onto ascencion and i'm having trouble with the silent.. Can you please give me some examples of cards to build her around?
With the others i was like "yeah i'll try to build around this" (juggernaut with the ironclad, storm with the defect) and i'm yet to have this moment with her, all the cards i saw so far seem rather underwhelming.. I'm yet to get her past A2
Thanks for any responses

[Kaerius]

I've never had trouble with him if I had a solid defense/draw/poison deck, and I'm going to blame that on blur, and on being able to pretty consistently hit that 12 card limit. So that it's rare to get a turn shorter than that, and when I do, my blur stacked defenses has my back.

[DJDiceZ]

As a follow-up to my post you could try out another more unusual deck i tried to find and experiment with, but it's rather iffy (It's a bit more tailored toward Ironclad fans if anything), and probably not very viable at high Ascension so you might want to avoid it when you get there (terms defined in my other post):

Enablers: Noxious Fumes, Flechette, Riddle With Holes, Envenom, Glass Knife, Bane+ (+ poison source)
Core: Bane+, Envenom, Terror/Trip, Phantasmal Killer, Well Laid Plans, Bullet Time
Other good cards: Predator, Die Die Die, Corpse Explosion, Burst, Footwork, Wraith Form, Nightmare, Backstab, J.A.X, Bandage Up, just good defenses+weak, some card draw in general and preferably at least 4 base energy, otherwise you might need another energy source.
Relics: Funnel, Shuriken, Bag Of Marbles, Vajra, Pen Nib, Necronomicon, Art Of War, Girya, Stone Calendar, Nunchaku, Runic Pyramid, Du Vu Doll (+curses and curse relics), Mutagenic Strenght, Red Mask, Energy relics, etc..

Several ways to do this, but i wouldn't recommend going for more than 1-2 different damage burst setup sources. The point here is to use Silent's most damaging/multi-hit attack cards that don't require any advanced setup, then then set them up with Vulnerable+Phantasmal Killer, and Envenom aswell if you need it. Riddle with Hole is usually bad, but here you're trying to make it scale with strenght, and get as many Envenom hits in as possible. It's especially doable if you have a Necronomicon (you'd get about as much as a flask worth of poison and energy, with 60+(30xStr) damage). With flechette, you're trying to draw, create and have in hand as many skills as possible in the turn you get it, Well-Laid Plans will help with that. Bane+ can theoretically do decent damage for 1 energy, but obviously requires a source of poison, preferably consistent like Noxious Fumes, Funnel, and anything that can take artifact off enemies helps. I didn't include it in the list of cards, but Necronomicon also pairs splendidly well with Skewer, and a way to generate a lot of energy, like Ice Cream. Upgraded Glass Knife is (arguably?) Silent's "strongest" frontloaded damage card, going at 24 damage. The catch? It loses 4 damage everytime you use it. Still, Terror/Trip and Phantasmal killer offer a total damage boost of +200%, aka x3 damage, for all those attacks, including their strenght scaling. Note that you can Burst + Phantasmal Killer to carry the buff through multiple turns.

Overall i wouldn't recommend unless under specific circumstances, like meeting many of the requirements for the relics, enabler and core cards, and not having any better deck showing up. You might still be better off not going for a specific deck, just good Silent cards by themselves but hey, if you want to try out a more face first Silent, power to you, i've made my disclaimers. For reference, with an ideal setup (which is very unlikely to happen), you could 1-2 turn kill bosses, if not 1-2 hit kill.

Originally posted by Khor:

..... surprisingly still is the best Shiv advice in this thread :conwayshrug:

Am i getting the implication one shouldn't even bother with Shivs right? Cmon, let the non-A20 players enjoy some deck variety before they get there.

Not that A20 will personally stop me from experimenting by myself.

Originally posted by I mained Blitztank since 3S:

Eh, Poison's a little iffy on him because he heals and purges debuffs halfway through unless you can time a Catalyst+ (might also need a Burst or Nightmare) to kill him before that happens.

Usually at that point you have enough poison generation and defenses to survive a turn or two, and get a good 10-20 poison every 1-3 turns if not more, it adds up fast. And preferably, you have two Catalysts and kept one for this part, or straight up skipped his heal turn.

Originally posted by gwaihirj:

Any advice to someone who is being stupidly stubborn and trying to shiv with their poison? Besides don't that is? And of course look for the sneko skull and the specimen. (And accuracy)

Don't rely too much on specific relics. Get something like a Deadly Poison and/or Catalyst. Burst can help with those and various skills. Envenom will go decently well with Shivs provided you have a way to take out enemies' block, which might be one of your main obstacles. For block you might want to prioritize Cloaked Dagger and Footwork. After Image is nice. Feel free to pick up an Infinite Blades or two if you come across it, Accuracy is a bit more eh, but if you have enough shivs you could justify it. Poison, and maybe a Thousand Cuts can take care of your other damage needs though. Storm of Steel could be a decent pick aswell, although it might work better with some cards that benefit from discarding. Add some cards like Leg Sweep, Nightmare, Piercing Wail, Adrenaline, Well-Laid Plans, etc... to have an overall better deck. Stuff like Predator/Sucker Punch/Quick Slash for your Act 1 needs, you don't need much more... Should be decent enough?

[Gentlest Giant]

Originally posted by gwaihirj:

Any advice to someone who is being stupidly stubborn and trying to shiv with their poison? Besides don't that is? And of course look for the sneko skull and the specimen. (And accuracy)

Hey, why not? The best decks are those that do a little bit of everything. Having a poison-focused deck with several cloak and daggers is perfectly in line with good building. Most silent decks end up with -something- that benefit shivs, whether it be relics or powers. (I'd stay away from Accuracy though, unless you are really going all in on the shivs.)
The idea to run pure poison decks without anything else but block cards is largely a low-ascension gimmick.

[Khor]

Originally posted by DJDiceZ:

Am i getting the implication one shouldn't even bother with Shivs right? Cmon, let the non-A20 players enjoy some deck variety before they get there.

Not that A20 will personally stop me from experimenting by myself.

Well..."build" and "archetype" are usually bad words around here since they tend to get you dead.
They are doable A0-10 because you can do whatever and still win, and again at A20 as a gamble.... but then you aren`t going to bet on something that`ll get you wrecked by Time Slug and Woke Birb

A good pointer could be on the line of: you should organically add good cards that help you in your current situation
and you should bother with something like a "themed" Shiv deck only if the opportunity presents itself (your first relic is Kunai or a random transform gave you 2 Accuracies)

Originally posted by Gentle Giant:

Hey, why not? The best decks are those that do a little bit of everything. Having a poison-focused deck with several cloak and daggers is perfectly in line with good building. Most silent decks end up with -something- that benefit shivs, whether it be relics or powers. (I'd stay away from Accuracy though, unless you are really going all in on the shivs.)
The idea to run pure poison decks without anything else but block cards is largely a low-ascension gimmick.

If you are running Poison+Cloak and Dagger... isn`t that still Poison+Block only?
and if you have Poison+Blade Dance.. aren`t you doing something wrong?

[Gentlest Giant]

Originally posted by Khor:

if you have Poison+Blade Dance.. aren`t you doing something wrong? :overkill_laugh:

No, why?
If you have a sufficient amount of Thousand Cuts, After Image, Kunai, Ornamental Fan, Envenom etc. the Blade Dance will pull its weight. I see no contradiction at all here.

[Khor]

Originally posted by Gentle Giant:

Originally posted by Khor:

if you have Poison+Blade Dance.. aren`t you doing something wrong?

No, why?
If you have a sufficient amount of Thousand Cuts, After Image, Kunai, Ornamental Fan, Envenom etc. the Blade Dance will pull its weight. I see no contradiction at all here.

Ok, true.... but how is that a "poison-focused deck" then?

[Gentlest Giant]

I'm not hard-bent on definitions, I tend to just think of "focus" as what your major source of damage happens to be. There are many plausible scenarios where one would transition from taking several poison cards in act 1, find an After Image somewhere along with Ornamental Fan, then transition into some shivving.
I think just about short of 95% of my decks are hybrids, that's just how the game goes.

[DJDiceZ]

Originally posted by Khor:

but then you aren`t going to bet on something that`ll get you wrecked by Time Slug

I'd argue it more appropriate for this boss to be refered to as Fun Eater.

[Khor]

Originally posted by DJDiceZ:

Originally posted by Khor:

but then you aren`t going to bet on something that`ll get you wrecked by Time Slug

I'd argue it more appropriate for this boss to be refered to as Fun Eater.

That`s probably true.
I hereby pledge to henceforth use the term Fun Eater while referring to the Boss beforehand known as Time Eater.
(sorry i was bored)

Originally posted by Gentle Giant:

I'm not hard-bent on definitions, I tend to just think of "focus" as what your major source of damage happens to be. There are many plausible scenarios where one would transition from taking several poison cards in act 1, find an After Image somewhere along with Ornamental Fan, then transition into some shivving.
I think just about short of 95% of my decks are hybrids, that's just how the game goes.

Poison having anti synergy with everything else might very well be the exception.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1833731943
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1833393267
If this is my floor 4/5... i seriously want Shuriken, Fan, AND Kunai before even starting to consider adding a Blade dance

[DJDiceZ]

Well yeah, at that point there's no reason to go for anything other than poison. You might aswell not even pick up a single attack. Deck's basically already finished by floor 5.

[corbet]

Originally posted by Kaerius:

I've never had trouble with him if I had a solid defense/draw/poison deck, and I'm going to blame that on blur, and on being able to pretty consistently hit that 12 card limit. So that it's rare to get a turn shorter than that, and when I do, my blur stacked defenses has my back.

i barely ever use blur. it's not that great.

the best blocks are deflects upgraded combined with footworks, and card draw. backflips, lots of card draw.

lets suppose you have well laid plans upgraded. you can always hang onto 2 deflects upgraded or wraith form. and have complete control. where as blur is pretty unreliable compared to that, it's only next turn, with less control overall.

[DJDiceZ]

Originally posted by the barn:

lets suppose you have well laid plans upgraded. you can always hang onto 2 deflects upgraded or wraith form. and have complete control. where as blur is pretty unreliable compared to that, it's only next turn, with less control overall.

I'd agree on a few points here, but keep in mind blur stacks.