Add a Strela for the insurgents to counter air support better?

[Maki Nishikino]

I think this would be neat to see, just one shot and a chance for the helicopters to beat it by using flares.

[Coldsteel]

RPG does the job just fine. You just need to 1) catch them off-guard and 2) lead the target.

[Maki Nishikino]

Originally posted by Coldsteel:

RPG does the job just fine. You just need to 1) catch them off-guard and 2) lead the target.

Lol, I have yet to see someone hit one with it.

[Coldsteel]

Originally posted by Maki Nishikino:

Lol, I have yet to see someone hit one with it.

Well I did, and more than one time. Granted, taking out minigun helicopter is super difficult because it's doing the sidewinder sweep and it's nearly always facing you and sees your rocket, bt far from impossible. Gunship casually turns your back on you and it's pretty trivial to destroy it.

[Casual Sun]

Originally posted by Maki Nishikino:

Originally posted by Coldsteel:

RPG does the job just fine. You just need to 1) catch them off-guard and 2) lead the target.

Lol, I have yet to see someone hit one with it.

I saw it a lot more in beta. I've sen it once after release.

[Maki Nishikino]

Originally posted by Coldsteel:

Originally posted by Maki Nishikino:

Lol, I have yet to see someone hit one with it.

Well I did, and more than one time. Granted, taking out minigun helicopter is super difficult because it's doing the sidewinder sweep and it's nearly always facing you and sees your rocket, bt far from impossible. Gunship casually turns your back on you and it's pretty trivial to destroy it.

Ok, so the RPG-7 does the job just fine. So does an AKM, why need an AK-74?

[Coldsteel]

Originally posted by Maki Nishikino:

Ok, so the RPG-7 does the job just fine. So does an AKM, why need an AK-74?

That's not a valid comparison. Different flavors of the same gun add variety, but that's not what you're suggesting. You're asking to add a weapon that requires no skill, which success depends on a flip of a coin, and which undoes Security's tiebreaker - none of which are good additions individually, and are absolutely terrible when lumped together. RPG helicopter takedown is a small tactical but vastly personally rewarding bonus that hinges on impeccable rocket launcher skills, *that* is just turning the game into a uniform grey mush.

[Maki Nishikino]

Originally posted by Coldsteel:

Originally posted by Maki Nishikino:

Ok, so the RPG-7 does the job just fine. So does an AKM, why need an AK-74?

That's not a valid comparison. Different flavors of the same gun add variety, but that's not what you're suggesting. You're asking to add a weapon that requires no skill, which success depends on a flip of a coin, and which undoes Security's tiebreaker - none of which are good additions individually, and are absolutely terrible when lumped together.

No skill? People say shotguns require no skill, it's a matter of opinion.

[Coldsteel]

Originally posted by Maki Nishikino:

No skill? People say shotguns require no skill, it's a matter of opinion.

Except a homing missile LITERALLY requires no skill. That's not even up for debate.

And again with asinine comparisons, comparing a one-hit-kill gun with an aimbot gun.🤦‍♀️

[Maki Nishikino]

Originally posted by Coldsteel:

Originally posted by Maki Nishikino:

No skill? People say shotguns require no skill, it's a matter of opinion.

Except a homing missile LITERALLY requires no skill. That's not even up for debate.

If you have a helicopter using flares it's no big deal, the problem is you need to notice the missle screaming at you and start dumping flares. I dodge them left and right in DCS. It's a very old MANPAD and not hard to spoof. Notice how I said Strela and not Igla.

[Coldsteel]

Yeah so you want to add a weapon that requires no shooting skill whatsoever, that may or may not do the job depending on RNG, and that completely negates Security's fire support. It shouldn't take a genius to see what's wrong with all this. Helicopters being patched to be more resilient against RPG attacks should've been your clue, too.

Honestly. It's the ideas like that gave us crap like Mercy in Overwatch.

[Maki Nishikino]

Originally posted by Coldsteel:

Yeah so you want to add a weapon that requires no shooting skill whatsoever, that may or may not do the job depending on RNG, and that completely negates Security's fire support. It shouldn't take a genius to see what's wrong with all this. It's the ideas like that gave us crap like Mercy in Overwatch.

The insurgents can't do anything about an A-10. If you have a commander that knows the map well a gun run from that bird can be very effective.

[Coldsteel]

They've got their own variant of a strafe attack, it's called "bomber drones". They also got a rocket barrage which is effectively the same.

[Maki Nishikino]

Originally posted by Coldsteel:

They've got their own variant of a strafe attack, it's called "bomber drones". They also got a rocket barrage which is effectively the same.

Drones require no skill, you just send them on their way and will blow up when they find something. An A-10 does to use it with good results. All it takes is a single rocket to think "uh oh, I need to get into cover". Can a rocket kill you if you're inside a building? I don't think so.

[Ghost_Lead_OneSix]

Since i played sandstorm in beta, i managed to shoot the chopper down only twice ,😂😂😂. There should be a stinger missile. Imo

[ultra friendly gamer on tf2]

Originally posted by Maki Nishikino:

I think this would be neat to see, just one shot and a chance for the helicopters to beat it by using flares.

I think it is very important to first of all: identify the strengths and weaknesses and noticable elements of each team.

SecFor have modern weapons and are backed up by a government, they represent the 'latest' technology.
They also bring to the table sophisticated fire support systems such as an Apache Gunship, Black Hawk and A10s and they also retain traditional fire support such as high explosive and smoke artillery.
The Security team is limited in the number of call-ins they can bring in. They have a one-time-use Assassin and Cleric and a relatively low amount of Warlock runs. This means that the commander must be more surgical in timing with his placements and generally communicate more in order to get the best out the fire support options combined with an assault. Security also lack any effective room-clearing options like the Insurgents, but instead they can cover much more open space.
On the plus side, they bring a massive array of firepower and killing potential to the table, especially with the helicopter CAS. They auto-track targets, use high volumes of fire and with Assassin it uses explosive rounds that can "splash".

OpFor, on the other hand, are less modern in equipment and firepower.
They use unconventional methods of obliterating their enemies, using drones and signature chemical gas as well as smoke and high explosive mortars.
The Insurgents generally have the downside of having their fire support requiring a better placement unlike the helicopters and A10 which encompass an area or strafe a straight line. I've observed that the explosive drones are particularly vulnerable to failure in open spaces where they can be shot down due to the lack of cover, that the explosive drones have more of a 'oval' than a straight line like the Warlock and that Chemical Mortars do not affect a large area and they can only be used sufficiently on a point.
The Insurgents have more sustainability through their fire support and it is much bit more specialized in clearing out rooms. The Big Hosses of the Insurgent fire support are chemical gas, explosive drones and bombing drones and /boi/ do they deal the hurt. Bombing drones can be used to a large area (slighty more than explosive artillery and with more effect), explosive drones and fly into windows and wipe out a fortress clean and chemical gas can be used to pull the enemy's pants down and in conjunction with an assault, it can flush out the SecFor team completely.

I think it is important the Surface-to-Air missile launchers be left out of the game for the sake of balance. The Security team have powerful but limited fire support options that require much more planning and timing to use on the contrast, the Insurgent team have more chances to make use of their fire support but lack the sheer killing potential of the helicopters and more expansive area-of-effect for the A10.
It would suck as a Security commander to know that your helicopter CAS call-ins are left to RNG as the surface-to-air launchers have a

Originally posted by Maki Nishikino:

chance for the helicopters to beat it by using flares .

Generally, RNG is a stupid mechanic. In a tactical hardcore FPS game (note not realistic) with emphasis on no-nonsense combat, RNG would not fit in well because it would not reflect the game's genre well.

Also, there is already a counter to helicopters and what not (although it is not a hard counter),

Using your Demolitions guys to focus on the current helicopter hovering in the sky is a sure way to put it down, Assassin or Cleric.

Cleric is already vulnerable to massed amounts of gunfire as it does not possess heavy armor and it is such a large target (also, people in spawn enjoy protection from Cleric's inaccuracy from the more distance the gunner has to fire from the original call-in spot) and Assassin can be taken down with RPGs.

tldr: no

edit i also realized that rocket barrages exist but elts be real here they're inaccurate as crap and they just litter a huge area with explosions