I don't understand the extremely low TTK - whoever spots the enemy first wins 99% of the time?

[JTHM]

I'm a little confused as to how this game is enjoyable - if you get spotted first, you're dead, and vice versa. I know the hardcore players will disagree, but with such a low TTK aiming essentially doesn't matter as long as you can get two shots off.

What am I missing here?

[The roast is real]

This is not a casual first person shooter, so you can't play as if it was one. You need to play slow, check corners, communicate with your team, etc. That's what makes it fun, not running and killing everyone like CoD or Battlefield.

That's why it's called "Semi-realistic tactical shooter". It is meant to be unforgiving and brutal.

[SKN The LISPer]

Same as with Squad and Arma to an extent, tactics make a big difference, followed with team play. Proper utilisation of smoke and flashbangs make the spotting "issue" moot.

[JTHM]

Автор сообщения: The roast is real

This is not a casual first person shooter, so you can't play as if it was one. You need to play slow, check corners, communicate with your team, etc. That's what makes it fun, not running and killing everyone like CoD or Battlefield.

That's why it's called "Semi-realistic tactical shooter".

I think there is a pretty good argument to be made that lower ttk - lower skill ceiling.

With a higher TTK, you need to actually have consistent aim, control recoil, etc.

[SKN The LISPer]

Автор сообщения: JohnnyR

I think there is a pretty good argument to be made that lower ttk - lower skill ceiling.

With a higher TTK, you need to actually have consistent aim, control recoil, etc.

The issue lies more in it being CQB, which means aiming is less important(as the distance isn't enough for bullet drop or similar to matter), compared to Arma(large sized encounters) or Squad(medium sized encounters). In those games the skill ceiling is obvious with the bullet drops and necessity of optics for proper shots.

But even so, if there is smoke(at the location enemies are likely to be, therefore they can't see) you are free to move without any fear of being spotted, if anyone moves out of the smoke you get them before they have a chance to get you.

In a building, flashing it first means they're all blind, giving perfect breach chance.

The skill ceiling in this game isn't high for the individual, definitly(since it's CQB), it is however high for the team. Team filled with very good shooters are not going to win against a mediocre shooters that use communication and tactics.


Insurgency is, and has always been the middle ground between realistic tactical shooters(Arma, Squad), and the average arcade shooter(Battlefield, COD, CS). Where strategy and team-play is heavily encouraged, but not necessarily required.

[The roast is real]

Автор сообщения: JohnnyR

Автор сообщения: The roast is real

This is not a casual first person shooter, so you can't play as if it was one. You need to play slow, check corners, communicate with your team, etc. That's what makes it fun, not running and killing everyone like CoD or Battlefield.

That's why it's called "Semi-realistic tactical shooter".

I think there is a pretty good argument to be made that lower ttk - lower skill ceiling.

With a higher TTK, you need to actually have consistent aim, control recoil, etc.

Yeah, and with lower TTK you need to actually think what you're going to do to win, play carefully, play with your team, plan, etc. Pretty much harder and skillful than just running and gunning and "have consistent aim and control recoil" (you need to do this in Sandstorm as well btw).

I've played a lot of casual shooters like Cod and BF and they're muuuuuch easier than any realistic/semi-realistic tactical shooter.

[JTHM]

Автор сообщения: The roast is real

Автор сообщения: JohnnyR

I think there is a pretty good argument to be made that lower ttk - lower skill ceiling.

With a higher TTK, you need to actually have consistent aim, control recoil, etc.

Yeah, and with lower TTK you need to actually think what you're going to do to win, play carefully, play with your team, plan, etc. Pretty much harder and skillful than just running and gunning and "have consistent aim and control recoil" (you need to do this in Sandstorm as well btw).

I've played a lot of casual shooters like Cod and BF and they're muuuuuch easier than any realistic/semi-realistic tactical shooter.

You know, I think you make some really good points. I guess what is comes down to is that low TTK isn't fun (for me), as it just comes down to who spots who first, with no chance of recovering.

[Dog]

Dont get seen, yo!

[₸ΣLΣPΔ₸H]

Автор сообщения: JohnnyR

Автор сообщения: The roast is real

Yeah, and with lower TTK you need to actually think what you're going to do to win, play carefully, play with your team, plan, etc. Pretty much harder and skillful than just running and gunning and "have consistent aim and control recoil" (you need to do this in Sandstorm as well btw).

I've played a lot of casual shooters like Cod and BF and they're muuuuuch easier than any realistic/semi-realistic tactical shooter.

You know, I think you make some really good points. I guess what is comes down to is that low TTK isn't fun (for me), as it just comes down to who spots who first, with no chance of recovering.

That's the important part, it's not necessarily fun for you. I used to play MW2 and BF3 exclusively in hardcore mode years ago, because I disliked standard mode play. While we shouldn't expect and "long TTK" mode for INS, it would be nice to see another developer come up with something that suits what you might like more. What are we stuck with these days? Another COD clone? Fortnite? Not many interesting options tbh.

[SimpleSiren]

People get used to games like COD run and Gun. This is Run and gun and Duck

[Heatnixx]

I got this game yesterday since I used to play the free Insurgency source mod. Honestly the only thing I miss is the minimap, the maps are so confusing otherwise.

[Maki Nishikino]

Автор сообщения: Heatnixx

I got this game yesterday since I used to play the free Insurgency source mod. Honestly the only thing I miss is the minimap, the maps are so confusing otherwise.

Can you not see the objectives on your screen as you play?

[SKN The LISPer]

Автор сообщения: Maki Nishikino

Автор сообщения: Heatnixx

I got this game yesterday since I used to play the free Insurgency source mod. Honestly the only thing I miss is the minimap, the maps are so confusing otherwise.

Can you not see the objectives on your screen as you play?

I've still gotten lost plenty of times, lol. Though I hate minimaps and do not want them added, getting lost is part of the experience.

[Maki Nishikino]

Автор сообщения: SKN The LISPer

Автор сообщения: Maki Nishikino

Can you not see the objectives on your screen as you play?

I've still gotten lost plenty of times, lol. Though I hate minimaps and do not want them added, getting lost is part of the experience.

Alright.

[Division]

Just like Insurgency Source 2014, your skills from casual games such as cod, battlefield, and other non-realistic fps shooters would not work in this game cause it requires patience and coordination, oh and communication too cause its hardcore.

[BENWOOT]

There are some games where i have super high TTK and other super lows. But imo that's why TDM was good, it allwed you to have a higher TTK