Viper: Good or bad? Whats his role?

[Hawkins]

Hey everyone,

in the past few days I've been playing Viper a lot and I love him. He has an easy laning phase and can carry a team to victory, but I hardly ever see him in the competitive scene, and I had always assumed he was a hard carry but apparently he isn't? What lane would he go on the map?

Thanks!

[Furlock O'Donnell]

I would wager a guess that Viper isn't seen much in the competitive scene because a Black King Bar would completely negate just about everything about him, especially his ult and Q. Competitive players, at least from what I've seen, tend to pick characters that can't be shut down or ignored simply by getting an item. Same kinda reason why nobody plays Riki competitively, really. That's my take on the matter, anyway. I'm sure there are other reasons.

[Level 100 Torchic!~]

mana drains hurt him bad, easily kited with low speed, weak damage compared to other carries. not a bad hero, and far from it, just not the best

[Timmy WangDong]

Originally posted by iCarry:

Hey everyone,

in the past few days I've been playing Viper a lot and I love him. He has an easy laning phase and can carry a team to victory, but I hardly ever see him in the competitive scene, and I had always assumed he was a hard carry but apparently he isn't? What lane would he go on the map?

Thanks!

Viper tends to go mid lane and harass a lot or the safe lane for hard carry.

[billy]

I've watched a lot of Pro games recently , noone's ever picked viper and he has never been banned. The same 20 heroes are basically always used by the Pro's , there's about 10 heroes that are banned or picked 90% of the time , maybe 99%.

Hope they do some hero balancing cause it shows there's something wrong when the highest level games always use the same heroes.

One thing i will say though , none of us will be playing at the high levels so maybe it doesnt matter so much if you have him as your main hero.

[76561198095043942]

Yea if you get the right items for Viper he can Pwn anybody. Attack speed items and some Mana Regen's, he's a beast.

[Pasta La Vista]

viper is a carry , kinda like him cuz he is one of the few carries who is good at all early , mid and late game. most of the time people play him mid , and trying to keep the ganks up anytime they can , with the dps he got , he is a bad guy for enemies. easy to play as well , not much of hard comboes

[Espigão]

He doesn't scale that well into lategame and has no escape mechanism, both of these things are really important for a carry.

Originally posted by Furlock O'Donnell:

I would wager a guess that Viper isn't seen much in the competitive scene because a Black King Bar would completely negate just about everything about him, especially his ult and Q.

His ult goes through bkb i believe (just the slow not the damage)

[Marioalexsan]

Originally posted by Espigão:

He doesn't scale that well into lategame and has no escape mechanism, both of these things are really important for a carry.

Originally posted by Furlock O'Donnell:

I would wager a guess that Viper isn't seen much in the competitive scene because a Black King Bar would completely negate just about everything about him, especially his ult and Q.

His ult goes through bkb i believe (just the slow not the damage)

Do you know how important is this slow?
It can 'incapacitate' an super fast sniper, i suppose.
Also, if the hero you gank gets scared and tries to run, then you have more chances to kill him. Unless they get helped soon by more heroes.
And if Viper gets enough money for, like oblivion staff (for mana regen,he's dependant on this),butterfly and heart of tarrasque (i'm going this scheme), he can get hardcore.

[Wutproppen]

Well, he is sometimes played competetively. But not that often.

Compared to carries that are played more often:
- lifestealer and weaver are much harder to kill
- gyrocopter has tons of stuff for teamfights
- morphling has more burst damage and is also harder to kill

*shrugs*

[GooofyX]

TANKY DPS

MEK > AGHS > HEART > DPS

[✪ Sgt. Sagara Reborn]

Originally posted by Furlock O'Donnell:

I would wager a guess that Viper isn't seen much in the competitive scene because a Black King Bar would completely negate just about everything about him, especially his ult and Q. Competitive players, at least from what I've seen, tend to pick characters that can't be shut down or ignored simply by getting an item. Same kinda reason why nobody plays Riki competitively, really. That's my take on the matter, anyway. I'm sure there are other reasons.

+ for this

[SynC[+]]

As many as mentioned above, viper isn't a true carry in a sense compared to the other carries because he doesn't scale well late game (as if he is a support hero) and can be shut down easily before he can dish out serious damage (thus why many players build tanky items on him AND rush mek on him)

That being said though, viper has been picked in the pro scene every once in a while but not as a carry but as a pos 4 support instead (since he has to go mek either way)

[Mia Khalifa's Walrus]

There is a reason one of the most respected players (Fear) says Viper is the worst hero in dota. Not only is the hero largely countered by bkb, but his contribution to his team is very small (right click-slow). In pub matches for us mere mortals however, he's pretty good cuz supports are generally crap and people panic more. In the pro scene tho, you almost won't ever see the hero in pick/ban. Death Prophet is a huge counter to him.

[Mia Khalifa's Walrus]

Look at shadow shaman or bane, heroes who have HUGE team contribution. Or a carry like silencer, Naga, or FV. They contribute in multiple areas that greatly help team.

[7Mad About You]

Viper is very strong in middle lane.

Viper also very strong in early-mid game as his poison can kill his fragile victim quickly.

But in the late game, Viper is outcarry by other late carry hero