The reversal system is awful.

[Raden]

I'm just venting right now mostly because I am angry, but....

I am sick of being reversed by an AI that's been beaten into the ground with no remaining strength or spirit, and yet they can seemingly do whatever they please to me and the reversal system will just sit idly by and allow it. This game is so player unfriendly it's unreal. I know a lot of people tend to just sim matches but I could swear that was how it was designed and the only reason we can play at all is because there might be some uproar if we couldn't, so they tacked on the ability to control a wrestler as an afterthought.

When I've got full energy and spirit there should be no damned way I'm getting countered by someone I've pummeled the crap out of for 15 minutes (and been unable to pin, that is another gripe unto itself).

[Aki]

Originally posted by Nth:

Originally posted by officemonk:

Well at least with medium and big moves.

Yeah, also if you keep spamming the same move over and over, they become less effective each time. It acts as a deterrent from a player just spamming a high offense move over and over to try and get a cheap win.

Originally posted by View The Phenom:

Originally posted by Viper:

Is This True?

This part I didn't know!

This is false, it all depends on the opponent's current spirit. You can freely spam moves assuming the wrestler is worn down enough to take them.

It's also false that using the same move over and over becomes less effective. Moves have the same base damage every time they're used, with some modifiers depending on whether specific skills are active, how damaged the body part used to deliver the move is, etc.

Now I am really confused.

Which is it?

[View The Phenom]

My point is correct. There is nothing in the code, barring damage to body parts and offensive/defensive parameters, that reduces the base damage of a move. Spamming a move multiple times does not make a difference. And using the same move over and over again doesn't increase the chance of a reversal, that's all tied to an edit's spirit and the move's category (small, medium, big, etc).

If you want to spam the most effective moves in order to gain "cheap wins", and that's an odd way to view it for a game with zero competitive aspects to it (no rankings, no functional online modes, etc), outside of the universal reversal system tied to spirit there's nothing to prevent you from doing so. That includes getting an edit's spirit low enough to the point where you can effectively spam a big move over and over again.

If you want to make an edit that focuses on spamming the most damaging moves per category, nothing prevents it. You just end up with a very boring edit that nobody wants to download.

[justdan2k1]

Hey Raden -
I've been playing Fire Pro since the SNES days.

I've still got my copy from '98 that I bought from my local game store -- Super Fire Prowerestling X Premium.

Quick question.
Are you playing against custom CAW?
Then you will need to go in and alter them.
Look for S's, change them to something appropriate.

Retrostation1989
Commander Dan

[hybridial]

If you want to play decent matches against the AI, and not many people seem to love doing that but I am one, so this is how I would say it goes for me;

If the difficulty of the AI is less than 8, it doesn't stand a chance against me unless it has a massive stat advantage. I need it to be on 8 given relatively equal footing for there to be a chance it can beat me. And oh, it can beat me, because some moves in the game are just match enders at a certain point. However if you're new to the game, I suggest starting at 4, and moving up. You'll move up from there fairly quickly.

You also need to have an understanding of how the game's inner mechanics work, and how stats work and what differences the stats make. You do need to read a guide on this but there's several good ones here on Steam. It makes a big difference imo if you figure out what stat levels work for you. I actually play with edits who are very strong, all 190-210. But because all of them are that, and have their points spent in different ways, it results in I think exciting matches. And because the points are spent in different ways, each character works a bit differently, has different strengths and weaknesses. And if you know these, you can work the matches tactically.

I've played a lot of wrestling games over the years against the AI and honestly Fire Pro has the best there is, because ultimately it doesn't rely on cheapness like just being able to reverse 99.9% of the time. That will happen if you go for big moves early, but if you actually wrestle a match properly it remains a satisfying and often unpredictable challenge.

And even then I still squash them sometimes.

That's my general tips but on possibly what might be causing the problem the OP has might be the Ukemi setting. The Ukemi setting decides how much the AI will take offence willingly through different stages of the match. This can make that wrestler simply impossible to defeat. So of course this should be kept at something reasonable. It can be used for the Cena/Hogan comeback special, and that's primarily what it's there for. Again it will say in the guides on AI logic what would be reasonable settings, based on what you want.

[Arachnid Soul]

Originally posted by Kaijudo:

All I do 99% time is Wrestle the AI, I don't sim a lot. I haven't noticed any of what the OP is saying.

Same here. I play the game usually vs AI at 8 difficulty. I'll play it on 10 sometimes, but after 8 I lose some ability to control my matches (not the worst thing in the world). I wasn't doing that on day one. I had fun learning the Fire Pro system, and having increasingly better matches in the process. Also on certain days, on level 10, sometimes a young boy will watch me with a combo and a school boy, or arm bar for a shock win. Fire Pro games seem to find the best balance between giving you freedom in the matches, but at the same time giving you very lose boundaries, just to keep things in check to some degree. I've played other wrestling games where you can start with massive moves in the first 20 seconds, and then... try to figure out what random things to do for the next 10 minutes, in an attempt for the match to make some sort of sense. Why not start the match with a piledriver and then follow it up with a dragonranna, before going to side headlocks and arm wringers? It's wrestling, its not Street Fighter. If you put the time in, you'll most likely get the hang of the controls enough to at least have some good matches on 1 difficulty. Then you can work your way up.

[Raden]

I tend to prefer to increase my difficulty by fighting more people. I never play just 1v1 matches anymore, they're 1v2 at minimum. Sometimes 1v3 and rarely 1v4. Endless battle royals are my favourite though.

I still think it's dumb a wrestler with zero spirit, energy and breath can reverse your attempt to pick them up off the canvas though. That will never not be stupid.

[Arachnid Soul]

Originally posted by Raden:

I still think it's dumb a wrestler with zero spirit, energy and breath can reverse your attempt to pick them up off the canvas though. That will never not be stupid.

I'd agree with you, if I didn't see that happen in real world matches. It happens quit a bit. People build reputations from it. Fighting spirit.

[justdan2k1]

Originally posted by Raden:

I still think it's dumb a wrestler with zero spirit, energy and breath can reverse your attempt to pick them up off the canvas though. That will never not be stupid.

Heh...
I disagree, but only insofar as that's how Japanese Puro is booked. Both men completely destroyed, hanging on by a thread - multiple near-falls, multiple finishers laid in -- until one man wins over the other.

Omega V Okada IV in 2018 is my example of that.

Did you find that the characters you were having problems with were set to have their crowd settings on S?

[Raden]

I dunno, I will have to check that out. Some definitely seem to be more of a pain in the rear end than others.

[TowerDefender]

I’ve been playing Fire Pro for over 20 years, and used to test the games constantly for the ability to spam moves, which I always disliked. (This was before we had guys probing the code for exact explanations.)

The one thing that I always noticed (all the way up to FPR) was your ability to win a match using the same progression of three or four moves from weakest to strongest. From then on, I started simming.

Spamming a move used to impact the match rating for most audience types, I believe. But it never seemed to impact reversals or damage.