Who's the STRONGEST?

[Gamrage]

I've always thought since most of the characters in Tales of franchise tend to have varying strengths in terms of Hi-Ougi attacks. Which characters in all of the tales of games are the most powerful in terms of sheer force and firepower? (Let's go for Protagonists only.)
You guys can talk about spell casters, swordsmen or just altogether strongest in terms of sheer damage potential. (I wouldn't use numbers as a basis for power on the characters)

Spellcasters:
Genis: For most characters in the "Tales of" franchise, the attack Indignation is saved as a Hi-Ougi attack. In Genis's case, he has Indignation as a regular spell that could be casted. To top it off, he takes Indignation to the next level with "Indignation Judgement."

Hi-Ougi Extension Characters(Harold Berselius & Beryl Benito): I'm pretty sure these charaters deserve a mention since they can pile up the damage with a series of relentless Hi-Ougi chains.

[Sofia]

I'm pretty sure nobody's topped Lloyd for sheer force and firepower because he ends up with a sword that can cut through dimensions. (Gaius from Xillia ends up equalling him on that front, but strictly speaking the sword is a second character so I'm not sure it's a fair equivalence to say Gaius with Muzet equals Lloyd.)

If you're only looking at Hi-Ougis, and not looking at dual ones, most of them have identical damage multipliers and none of them ever come up in cutscenes as big deals, so how would you even rate it? Genis might have 'Better Indignation' as a Hi-Ougi but someone else's Hi-Ougi 'Regular Indignation' is actually going to do just as much damage.

[Simon]

I love the blue earth extension.

[Winged One]

this in all honesty is a question that comes up within the community after every major Tales release, and there are 2 generally accepted "top 5 lists" at this time..

are we including "god powers" or not? god powers being supernatural powers which put the character in the teir one would consider god like


With God Powers:

1) Cress (third wielder of the Eternal Sword, and whos entire combat style is a bootstrap paradox)
2) Lloyd (second wielder of the Eternal Sword)
3) Ludger (Chromatus is an extremely overpowered curse, one that could theoretically negate the abilities of the Eternal Sword)..
4 & 5) at this point they would likely be extremely close enough it would be hard to pick which gets what, but Sorey and Velvet (Armatization and crazy power stealing)..




without God Powers, basing it solely off of the individuals combat merrits and not what crazy artifacts or blessings/curses they bare:

1) Cress
2) Stahn
3) Lloyd
4) Leon (you gotta love Leon)
5) Kratos




keep in mind, this is only taking into account playable characters.. if we are including non-playables and antagonists, the grading becomes a whole lot harder

[Winged One]

ohh wait, are we talking about "game combat" strength, or more of an "in-universe power level".. I was assuming you mean't the latter :P


Milla's Mystic Arte in Xillia was rather OP if memory serves, since it did 4 elemental damages at once it would often automatically cause a grave hit combo

[Daddy Kaneki]

Speaking from a lore power level point of view, out of Berseria's group, Laphicet is the most powerful and Eleanor is the weakest.

[Gamrage]

Originally posted by Eizen:

Speaking from a lore power level point of view, out of Berseria's group, Laphicet is the most powerful and Eleanor is the weakest.

When you think about it, Eleanor was capable of being a vessel for Laphicet.(many characters state that this is a pretty grand task.) Aside from combat potential, you can think of Eleanor as the gun who holds the potential bullet.

If Eleanor is weak, the same could be said for Sorey from Zestiria, who's strength comes from the acumilation of 5 different elemental seraphim. The main difference is that she relies on her own battle strength rather than Sorey who draws his potential from armatization.

[Fel]

She became his vessel when he was unconsious, it might make a difference, because she is clearly overpowered every time he wants her to move (or not move).

But if we follow your argument, isn't oe of the most powerful characters Teresa instead?
She managed to have both laphicet and the other "special" malak, when even Melchior didn't bring a second one when he was bound to him despite being a potent force himself.

[RiO]

Originally posted by theseraph1:

With God Powers:

1) Cress (third wielder of the Eternal Sword, and whos entire combat style is a bootstrap paradox)
2) Lloyd (second wielder of the Eternal Sword)
3) Ludger (Chromatus is an extremely overpowered curse, one that could theoretically negate the abilities of the Eternal Sword)..
4 & 5) at this point they would likely be extremely close enough it would be hard to pick which gets what, but Sorey and Velvet (Armatization and crazy power stealing)..

That should totally have Ludger at first place since his Chromatus freezes time for anyone that is not also directly wielding Chronos' power over time, such as other Chromatus bearers.

While the Eternal sword can be used to pierce time and space, it is still a tool that requires outside human manipulation from within the flow of time to be able to do so, giving a Chromatus bearer a distinct edge.

[The Tempted Man]

Kaldaien. This idiot has no equal on this board.

[Kaldaien]

Originally posted by ϟMangekyō Sharinganϟ:

Kaldaien. This idiot has no equal on this board.

Yeah, I know you're looking for a response... but have you ever stepped back for a second and casually observed your own behavior? You'll be horrified by what you see.

"Who's that ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ with the red icon? ... oh, right, me."

[The Tempted Man]

Originally posted by Kaldaien:

Originally posted by ϟMangekyō Sharinganϟ:

Kaldaien. This idiot has no equal on this board.

Yeah, I know you're looking for a response... but have you ever stepped back for a second and casually observed your own behavior? You'll be horrified by what you see.

"Who's that ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ with the red icon? ... oh, right, me."

Further proof that you are just an teention ♥♥♥♥-----e.

[Kaldaien]

Originally posted by ϟMangekyō Sharinganϟ:

Originally posted by Kaldaien:

Yeah, I know you're looking for a response... but have you ever stepped back for a second and casually observed your own behavior? You'll be horrified by what you see.

"Who's that ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ with the red icon? ... oh, right, me."

Further proof that you are just an teention ♥♥♥♥-----e.

In what world? You're describing yourself consistently and it's sad that you don't realize it :(

[Winged One]

Originally posted by ϟMangekyō Sharinganϟ:

Kaldaien. This idiot has no equal on this board.

has nothing to do with the topic

Originally posted by RiO:

Originally posted by theseraph1:

With God Powers:

1) Cress (third wielder of the Eternal Sword, and whos entire combat style is a bootstrap paradox)
2) Lloyd (second wielder of the Eternal Sword)
3) Ludger (Chromatus is an extremely overpowered curse, one that could theoretically negate the abilities of the Eternal Sword)..
4 & 5) at this point they would likely be extremely close enough it would be hard to pick which gets what, but Sorey and Velvet (Armatization and crazy power stealing)..

That should totally have Ludger at first place since his Chromatus freezes time for anyone that is not also directly wielding Chronos' power over time, such as other Chromatus bearers.

While the Eternal sword can be used to pierce time and space, it is still a tool that requires outside human manipulation from within the flow of time to be able to do so, giving a Chromatus bearer a distinct edge.

time and space is only one part of the Eternal Swords power, it is near omnipotent as it was used to revive a dead Mana Seed and fuse a person soul with a mana seed (as well as create and maintain the mana link system and mana funneling)..

the Eternal sword is for all intents and purposes all powerful, it not only gives the wielder power over Space and Time (like Maxwells Temporal Blade), but the ability to create and alter..

[Gamrage]

Originally posted by Fel:

She became his vessel when he was unconsious, it might make a difference, because she is clearly overpowered every time he wants her to move (or not move).

But if we follow your argument, isn't oe of the most powerful characters Teresa instead?
She managed to have both laphicet and the other "special" malak, when even Melchior didn't bring a second one when he was bound to him despite being a potent force himself.

Well, it was mentioned that she wasn't able to bring out the true potential of either of the characters. She could only use them at face value.

[Fel]

To be fair, neither could eleonore (at least in the story, but it does unlock his mystic arte, so maybe at least a bit), the main difference only being that Laphicet and number one had their emotions scealed before being offered to Teresa (like every other "malak" that is bound to an exorcist, most exorcists don't even know that they are not initially tools but proper living beings, or quite a few would be likely to start generating malevolence through guilt).

Thing is, that sceal doesn't seem to actively be hindering their abilities, so it shouldn't impact how much power they have.

It's definitely true that Teresa never "used" them to the highest of their abilities, but it's also because she had no way of knowing that they could do more than casting spells for her (even laphicet doesn't find out about his own abilities until quite a lot later after all, and it's his own powers and his own body).

The case about Teresa is funny because it is mentionned that the "capacity" is innate and allows to bind more and/or stronger spirits, but it's not like Melchior and Artorius couldn't sense the "capacity" and how potent those 2 "rank A" spirits they gave her were.

It can definitely be argued that both laphicet and number one grew after being separated from her, but given that they were ranked "A" in the first place, I don't buy the argument that she would somehow have a weaker power than eleonore.


In either case, they don't stand a chance against the actually powerful beings in any of the worlds of the Tales of games.
Artorius is definitely on a higher level than both of them, being able to bind and even armatize with an actual empyrean (granted it's not one of the elemental ones, but still).

That said, I would like to point out that usually the most powerful beings in the worlds of this series are not taking an active role, usually barely granting a bit of their power, like the main spirits in symphonia (not only do they govern their element, the only thing you "beat" is a form used to test if the mortals are worthy of their powers).
Maxwel can leisurely make a whole city fly for thousands of years, the "great tree" actually generates the mana that everyone uses to live, and so on.