Maximizing Hyperdrive Range

[Rexxer]

Other posts have already discussed arrangements of S-class modules to maximize effects, so I'll only summarize that aspect. What I'm interested in is how to find the best S-class module since the difference in range is enormous depending on *which* S-class hyperdrive module you can install. I routinely get over 3000 ly range even from ships without a max base hyperdrive range.

Basically, from what I can tell, S-class hyperdrive modules can range from a bonus range of under 200 u to about 250 u, and this can result in a difference of over a 1000 LY in range depending on what the base range is and your arrangement of them. So finding the right S-module is actually very important but neglected in the discussions. But here is a summary of what most people already know:

BASE RANGE of the SHIP: The native unupgraded hyperdrive range of the ship is a value from about 100 to 181. Only explorers can natively reach the maximum range. I have found explorers in the wild (without the nanite upgrades) with 181 or close to it. But I heard if you upgrade a ship to S class with nanites, it will also automatically give the upgraded ship the max upgrade of 181 hyperdrive range. This means, potentially, the best way to get the ideal explorer may be to get an A-class then upgrade it to S. Getting the max base hyperdrive range is a given. You must do it. That being said, with the right hyperdrive modules, I have been able to get ships with less base range to over 3000 LY actual. That is where module selection comes in.

S-CLASS HYPERDRIVE MODULE ARRANGEMENT: The max arrangement will require you have 11 hyperdrive related modules separated in two groupings, one grouping in tech and one in inventory: 6 modules (3 blueprint upgrades + 3 purchased upgrades) in one grouping , and then another 5 modules (2 blueprint upgrade + 3 purchased upgrades) in the other. This is a must: get ALL FIVE the hyperdrive blueprint upgrades available: cadmium drive, emeril drive, indium drive, and the emergency warp...the sixth is the hyperdrive itself. They all stack with S-class modules but these can be built whenever and wherever without exceeding the "three upgrade module limit" which would overload the arrangement causing none of them to work. You must go to the Anomaly to buy hyperdrive blueprint modules with nanites, or get them by completing various starting quests. As for arrangement of them to max out the values, read other posts, but basically I found you must put the S-modules in an "L" arrangement around the highest value blueprint module, creating a box of 4 modules, then add the lower value modules outside of this box, together adjacent to each other. For example, the 3 S-modules you buy would surround the S-Indium drive module you build, and then the hyperdrive unit itself would be outside of that box and the A-class Emeril would be next to the hyperdrive so there is a neat 2X3 clump of hyperdrive modules. In the other section, whether tech or inventory, would be another L-shaped arrangement of the store-bought S-class modules around the remaining A-class module which you can build: the emergency warp unit. Directly opposite that unit, with an intervening S-class module, would be the B-class cadmium drive unit. There is actually a difference if you don't use that arrangement, you must have the A-S-B in one line, and also the S-indium drive must also be in one line with the Hyperdrive unit, S-S-H (S-indium+S-MOD+Hyperdrive):

SS.....SS
SS...ASB
HA

(note: it was pointed out the absolute max arrangement is:

A......SS
SA....SB
SS
SH

But with the 7-4 arrangement I got less than a 1 LY advantage and it is a little clunkier to work other things around in the tech section or inventory, but it can be done if you want the absolute max. At 3000+ LY it won't matter much.)

The goal is to have as many 250 ly S-modules (or as close as you can get to it) in those positions.

MAIN DISCUSSION - How are Drive values generated when you buy a S-class Module? Quick answer is, they aren't. The values seem to be attached you you personally, so you can't go from one station to another trying to find the best value. What it does mean is that you will have to go through many S-modules until you reach the one you need. You won't be able to luck out and suddenly get one from a different station because the predetermined values will travel with you. For example:
I bought or salvaged 5 hyperdrive modules, and carefully lined them up in order so I could see which one yielded a particular value.

I applied them all at once, in order, and noted their range values:
209 220 202 204 214
Then I applied them in the reverse order and noted their range values:
214 204 202 220 209

(To illustrate further, imagine you labeled 5 S-mods, "A,B,C,D,E" then if you mounted "A" first it would show 209 ly, but if you mounted it last, it would be 214 ... all others also being in the order of which you clicked next, without regard to which mod you actually clicked)

In other words, the actual module didn't matter. They are all the same. The values are generated in order by some sequence that is attached to you, not to the module. So it won't matter if you go to a different station and pay more or less for one, all they do is tick off the next value in a sequence that is attached to you. So let's say this sequence bumps off a 250 LY value every 20 to 30 cycles. That means no matter what you do, or where you go, you will need to waste 19-29 S-class hyperdrive modules to get the 250.

Another possibility is that the sequence is generated as a function of the S-modules already installed on the default ship you are in. In other words the sequence is attached to the ship you are in. That way it may be keeping you from cherry picking S-modules to prevent some massive hyperdrive range. Since I can't seem to get much past 3100 LY, my guess is there is some limiting equation keeping any values from appearing that would let you past. However, that is what this post is for. Let me know if you discover anything different.

[Gumsk]

The range is 200 to 250, according to the code. If you haven't seen 250, that's just anecdotal evidence. There is also a setting named 'Weighting' that determines where in the range the curve is, with values like 'MaxIsSuperRare'. You can probably guess how those work.

[Rexxer]

Escrito originalmente por Gumsk:

The range is exactly 209 to 250. You've got a lot of great theories here, but I'm pretty sure you're way overthinking it. When the procedural upgrade is created, the game checks the specifications in the procedural upgrade table and then generates a value seed that itself seeds all the appropriate values within that range. I'm pretty sure it is not storing a list of what upgrades you are destined to get, what kind of ship you have, how you upgraded your ship, where you are in the galaxy, or any other fancy stuff. It's just generating a random seed number. The reason you got reverse numbers when you installed them in reverse order is that the seed value for each upgrade had already been created when you bought the upgrade, so it would always generate the same value.

I have seen 249, but only once, and the distribution of the other values sorta points out the limit also, so 250 is likely the max based on the distribution of other numbers.

That's about what I was guessing: it looks at the default ship's current hyperdrive range with upgrades, then calculates a randomized value that won't let it exceed the max range. The fact you get the exact same randomized series for any group of mods however *does* suggest something other than something that is fully randomized, even if it is an on-the-fly calculation. Something that potentially one could calculate oneself to know how many mods to buy to get the max value at any stage of the game.

[Gumsk]

Escrito originalmente por Rexxer:

Escrito originalmente por Gumsk:

The range is exactly 209 to 250. You've got a lot of great theories here, but I'm pretty sure you're way overthinking it. When the procedural upgrade is created, the game checks the specifications in the procedural upgrade table and then generates a value seed that itself seeds all the appropriate values within that range. I'm pretty sure it is not storing a list of what upgrades you are destined to get, what kind of ship you have, how you upgraded your ship, where you are in the galaxy, or any other fancy stuff. It's just generating a random seed number. The reason you got reverse numbers when you installed them in reverse order is that the seed value for each upgrade had already been created when you bought the upgrade, so it would always generate the same value.

That's about what I was guessing: it looks at the default ship's current hyperdrive range with upgrades, then calculates a randomized value that won't let it exceed the max range. The fact you get the exact same randomized series for any group of mods however *does* suggest something other than something that is fully randomized, even if it is an on-the-fly calculation. Something that potentially one could calculate oneself to know how many mods to buy to get the max value at any stage of the game.

I thought you said in the original post that you installed a group in reverse order and got the stats in reverse order, just as would be expected if set when purchased?

[Rexxer]

Escrito originalmente por MagPwn:

Escrito originalmente por Rexxer:

Also, *if* it turns out the random distribution is based on what your ship already has, it means the same module would open up differently on different ships depending on how close you were to the current limit. So if you had a low ship base number, your chance of getting 250 would be higher than someone with a high base number, and if you already had mods installed that gave you a range close to the limit, it won't ever drop anything higher than you already have other than something marginally better. This is all a guess. I more than anyone would love to see a situation where I could determine a mod installs at 250 on one ship with a low total range, then reload and transfer the uninstalled mod to a different ship closer to the top limit with the full value intact....I'm guessing they probably made it so you can't.

I already got a ship i was gonna pimp, its currently an A class but i will make it an S now and then test if there is a difference. How many hyperdrive modules do you think would be the best to use for such a test, 10, 20 or more?

If you are scrapping ships to build your nanite pool, you will have massive numbers of S-class hyperdrive modules. The drop rate is a little less than 1 per ship, and you'll get about 500-1000 nanites for the remaining modules, which means if you save all your Hyperdrive modules, you will have about 40-50 to chose from automatically by the time you have 50,000 nanites. Plus you will have about 80 storage augmentation pods to fully upgrade that ship, plus some. Clearly they intend ship scrapping to be the preferred way to upgrade ships.

The fact that if you *pay* for storage augmentation it can get upwards of 100 million per slot, buying that stuff clearly is a stupid inefficient booby prize way of doing it. You can buy and scrap a dozen ships for that amount. Buying storage is really clearly meant to be the wrong way of doing it.

[Rexxer]

Escrito originalmente por Gumsk:

The range is 200 to 250, according to the code. If you haven't seen 250, that's just anecdotal evidence. There is also a setting named 'Weighting' that determines where in the range the curve is, with values like 'MaxIsSuperRare'. You can probably guess how those work.

So I guessed correctly: I have gotten one 249 out of dozens of trials, with most being between 201 and 249. It's pretty clear the limit is about 250. Since the maxxed out hyperdrive range itself seems to limit out a little over 3000, possibly 3100 to 3200, again based on many different trials, getting all 250s with a ship base of 181 may not be possible if it is tilting the odds procedurally so you don't go over that limit.

[Rexxer]

Escrito originalmente por Gumsk:

Escrito originalmente por Rexxer:

That's about what I was guessing: it looks at the default ship's current hyperdrive range with upgrades, then calculates a randomized value that won't let it exceed the max range. The fact you get the exact same randomized series for any group of mods however *does* suggest something other than something that is fully randomized, even if it is an on-the-fly calculation. Something that potentially one could calculate oneself to know how many mods to buy to get the max value at any stage of the game.

I thought you said in the original post that you installed a group in reverse order and got the stats in reverse order, just as would be expected if set when purchased?

An equation can yield the same results when you input the same info. That's not inconsistent. But right, it isn't likely a randomly seeded randomization, likely one based on your current config.

[Rexxer]

Escrito originalmente por Ygolnac:

Escrito originalmente por MagPwn:

...And even more so, if you buy an A class is it always going to upgrade to the same S class stats or upon upgrading the stats are rerolled everytime?

That's what was shown on a YouTube video, the guy upgraded from an A-class to S-class and it comes out to 181 which I think is the technical max native hyperdrive range for a ship. I think since you can upgrade any ship to crazy max inventory slots of 48 and 21 for tech now, ship type no longer matters except for looks. But I have yet to upgrade a fighter to S-class to verify if its native hyperdrive range also is maxxed out.

If that is true, then that makes Exotics undesirable since you only get them in S-class, and there would be no way to upgrade their native stats. The only remaining reason to get an Exotic ship would be so you could tool around in something that looks good, but otherwise it would have weak stats compared to S-upgraded "normal" ships. It would also make hunting for S-class ships of any kind a waste of time, since the stats would always end up being less than an upgraded ship.

[Aeod_Ued]

I think that the upgrade’s stats are generated from the seed in the order that you install it.

So, as an example, if you have a hyperdrive upgrade and a pulse engine upgrade in your inventory, save the game and install the hyperdrive module. It will have one set of stats. If you reload the save and reinstall it, same stats. However, if you install the pulse engine upgrade before the Hyperdrive upgrade, different stats.

This is how I got all of my boltcaster upgrades to not enable ricochet. If the upgrade has the wrong stats, install a different one first. Patience and a lot of reloading—only worth it if the difference really matters to you.

[Rexxer]

Escrito originalmente por Lailantie:

OK so I didn't understand that chapter. What is a trial click run?

I was just discussing other experiments to try and get higher values and see if they at all transfer if you move the uninstalled module to another ship that is almost maxxed out. My guess is that it won't work, but the advantage then would be you know for sure the module value is linked to the ship you plan to use it on, calculated on-the-fly when you open it to install. Knowing that is an advantage, because if you open 50 modules in a trial run to see the high value, then if you never see a value higher than ones you already have installed, then you quit the search,... you are at the max and hunting for more won't matter.

If you find one value greater than your lowest installed value, then you can immediately get it by reloading and opening the modules in order until you get to it. And no farther. That way you don't waste modules and do it super quick.

You can also do it trial and error, which is likely the means intended by the devs, ...fly into a space station, buy a hyperdrive mod, try the mod and if the value is higher, you replace your lowest valued mod. Rinse and repeat 50 to 100 times....but that wastes so much time and only costs you lots of nanites without much in return since you are warping 50 to 100 times...what is that, like an hour of time plus the time you diddle around in the space station? Hours wasted. It's much easier to do the same all in one station, saves time and you earn enough nanites and storage pods to fully upgrade any ship.

[Rexxer]

Escrito originalmente por djd16a50:

This is how I got all of my boltcaster upgrades to not enable ricochet. If the upgrade has the wrong stats, install a different one first. Patience and a lot of reloading—only worth it if the difference really matters to you.

Lol...I hate ricochet also. The most worthless stat.

[Ygolnac]

Escrito originalmente por Gumsk:

The range is 200 to 250, according to the code. If you haven't seen 250, that's just anecdotal evidence. There is also a setting named 'Weighting' that determines where in the range the curve is, with values like 'MaxIsSuperRare'. You can probably guess how those work.

It depends, if it has hidden decimals it will never reach 250 and max value showed will be 249. For ship stats where you see the decimals it's like that. Also it's not ME that never saw a 250, but not a single player ever. A 250 was never reported anywhere. So at this point instead saying that my experience is "anecdotal", a proof that I'm wrong would be a better evidence. Otherwise your position that gives for granted that a 250 exists when noone was ever able to produce this evidence is weaker than mine.

[Rexxer]

Escrito originalmente por Ygolnac:

Escrito originalmente por Gumsk:

The range is 200 to 250, according to the code. If you haven't seen 250, that's just anecdotal evidence. There is also a setting named 'Weighting' that determines where in the range the curve is, with values like 'MaxIsSuperRare'. You can probably guess how those work.

It depends, if it has hidden decimals it will never reach 250 and max value showed will be 249. For ship stats where you see the decimals it's like that. Also it's not ME that never saw a 250, but not a single player ever. A 250 was never reported anywhere. So at this point instead saying that my experience is "anecdotal", a proof that I'm wrong would be a better evidence. Otherwise your position that gives for granted that a 250 exists when noone was ever able to produce this evidence is weaker than mine.

I have a 249, so that is proof enough. The limit is 250, so that is the limit you chase when hunting, but you settle for whatever is closest. But as mentioned before, that actually may be impossible if the limiting algorithm prevents values appearing which might make your next install go over the global hyperdrive limit, somewhere around 3100 ly.

That means your chance of finding a 250 or 249 is better if your explorer seed range is very low, since getting the max won't matter in pushing your ship over the global limit.

[Lailantie]

This is a lot of text :) Thank you all for contributing. I learned the following: I can make an autosave, install an upgrade, and if I don't like it I reload, get the uninstalled version and sell it. It's almost unbelievable, but this possibility had not dawned on me until now.

[Gumsk]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2093792733

[MagPwn]

Just fired off 150 hyperdrive modules on my explorer, i got 1(!!!!!) 249 LY range, the rest was 243 or 245 or less. This is gonna get expensive.