7 Days to Die

7 Days to Die

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Question about stupid mechanics
I stop playing years ago so I was wondering if zombies are still able to dig through dirt, rock, and ore? Also, can zombie still sense heat from miles away and through said dirt, rock, and ore?

Dumbest thing I have ever heard of so I am hoping they changed it. Cheers!
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Showing 1-10 of 10 comments
Thienen May 13, 2022 @ 6:35pm 
Yes they are capable of sensing you anywhere if Feral Sense is on. There is no block in the game that doesn't take damage from zombies either. They might only do like 1 damage to a 10k health block but if left alone, they will eventually break through.
Shurenai May 13, 2022 @ 6:41pm 
Yes, Zombies still dig dirt/rock/ore just as well as they do your wooden/cobbletone/concrete walls.

And zombies have NEVER sensed Heat at any point in time; This is a misunderstanding based on the usage of the term Heat Map; A heat map is not discussing Temperature in F/C; A heat map is a presentation of where activity occurs most frequently in a given space. EG: A keyboard heatmap would show which keys are struck most frequently during a given activity; Pic for example: https://www.bypeople.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/keyboard-characters-distribution-heatmap.png

The heat map has been renamed to Activity Map because it's less confusing for the end users.

The Activity Map has always been about your presence in the world. You make sound, You build structures, You produce smoke, and light, and smells- And you're trying to hide from a zombie hive mind that can use your activity to pinpoint your location and send scouts to harass you or full on assaults during a blood moon.

And neither of these things are going to be changing any time soon. So.. You're welcome to go back to A12 or so and experience your ideal version of the game, I guess?

Edit: With that said, The activity map is a lot more forgiving than it used to be; And you can dramatically turn down zombie damage vs blocks; reducing it by as much as 75%- Applies to all blocks, natural terrain and structures.
Last edited by Shurenai; May 13, 2022 @ 6:58pm
Yea...zombies with indestructible adamantium fingernails (or whatever lore reasons there are for zombies that die to axes, arrows, and bullets yet have hands that can hold the core of the sun) who also have a telepathic hive mind controlling them is a pretty far deviation from what I understood to be the original direction of the game. But hey, it's not every game that stays in alpha for 10 years so there were bound to be some hard choices to make on what makes sense and what doesnt.

I would understand the point about an activity map and zombies sensing your activity more, if the mechanic was for the zombies to find the door, tunnel, opening into the underground base instead of walking directly over top of wherever you are and tunneling straight down. Is literally the most illogical solution to the devs issue with players hunkering down in a base.
"The zombies can hear/smell/taste/feel vibrations 100ft under the earth, but wont travel through the clear opening to your base because the hive mind told them there would be traps and turrets so they must stand on top of your base and tunnel straight down because....logic......."

With that being said, I think I will just wait until they realize they shouldnt keep stupid choices and mechanics that make no logical sense just so they can cheese players who like to bunker. Much like their dumb choice to call it a heat map wen it had nothing to do with heat and changed their minds.
Shurenai May 13, 2022 @ 8:49pm 
Originally posted by James Bean:
who also have a telepathic hive mind controlling them is a pretty far deviation from what I understood to be the original direction of the game.
Originally posted by Straight from the kickstarter:
7 Days to Die is an open world, voxel-based, sandbox game that is a unique mash up of First Person Shooter, Survival Horror, Tower Defense and Role Playing Games combining combat, crafting, looting, mining, exploration, and character growth.

In the near future where the a third world war leaves the Earth in ruins but the worst was yet to come. Nobody knows for sure if it was the radiation, the biochemical weapons or an act of god but an unknown virus soon transforms the surviving humans into an army of the animated dead, acting as a single-minded being.

You play a survivor trapped in the savage zombie infested world of Navezgane County Arizona one of the last true Eden’s on Earth. Ironically Navezgane means “Killer of Monsters” to the Apache who have inhabited the land for centuries, and that’s pretty much what you’ll do as you fight to survive and search for the truth behind what really happened.
Relevant part in bold.

As for the rest; The zombies are supposed to be a threat to the player. If they can't destroy literally anything a player can build with, Then all a player has to do is stack a few blocks and stand on it to be completely unkillable. In a survival game. That just isn't right.

Most other games get around this conundrum by simply not allowing the player to build things, see Left 4 Dead; Or by virtue of the enemies not really being a main focus of the game, see Minecraft. I understand you might disagree with that; And that's your prerogative.

But the devs want the primary antagonistic force of the game to actually be a reasonable threat to the player at all times. Back when zombies couldn't dig down? Yeah, dig three blocks down and throw a block over head and you were untouchable by zombies. Straight up ruining any sensation of surviving against a zombie horde when they become literally zero threat to the player and you can freely wipe them out for free loot.


Also the hive mind doesn't know what a trap is. Seriously- The AI makes ZERO consideration for any traps you've placed. Everything in the game world with a physical presence is just a block to them. You CAN however pretty easily place your traps in such a way that the AI percieves a path is blocked when it technically isn't; For example if you place wooden spikes in a 2 high 'wall' around the entire perimeter of your base except on one side where the door is, they'll think you have a wall all the way around your base and act accordingly, trending towards the door instead of walking into the spikes- Because the spikes are just a wall to them. You have to use traps properly- Set spikes into the floor and ensure there is an actual walkable path.

In short... Zombies tunneling straight down to your base is partially a failing on your part to design for the enemy; But also admittedly the AI just isn't that complex.

Their goal is to reach you, If you make path A so much harder than path B, they'll pick B. They don't think about 'oh there's a door waaay over there 100 blocks from the player', they think 'player is at XYZ, I'm at ZYX, this is what is in my detection range aaaand there's no valid path so I'll make one."


..At the end of the day, It's just code, and that code doesn't have the freedom of independent thought. The activity map says 'Spawn screamer, send screamer to XYZ'. From there, the AI has like a 20-30 block radius it can detect and path within, and if a path becomes too complex it's ruled out. The end result of this is exactly what you've run into- Complex path to player through a bunker door, ladder, three tunnels and three rooms, ruled out, path to position directly above XYZ and dig straight down.

And..really...you could solve that problem anyway. As I mentioned, The activity map is FAR more forgiving than in prior versions for one; And for two..just..just place some traps yo. Dig a shallow pit and fill it with spikes, screamer think it's a floor and walk right onto it. Being underground is a defense- But it shouldn't be your ONLY defense.


Edit: some additional notes:
One, Screamers don't magically know where you are; They're sent to a specific block in the area and only respond aggressively if something gets between them and that block or they see a player.

Two, It occurred to me you might have more ire with the weekly horde magically tracking you; You can actually just turn hordes off now if it bothers you that much.,
Last edited by Shurenai; May 13, 2022 @ 8:56pm
Crater Creator May 14, 2022 @ 7:56am 
Originally posted by Shurenai:
…A heat map is not discussing Temperature in F/C; A heat map is a presentation of where activity occurs most frequently in a given space. EG: A keyboard heatmap would show which keys are struck most frequently during a given activity; Pic for example: https://www.bypeople.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/keyboard-characters-distribution-heatmap.png

Hmm. A random thought… the laws of thermodynamics being what they are (any activity is going to produce some heat), perhaps every Heat Map is also, inadvertently, a heat map. :munchies::lunar2019grinningpig::munchies:
Holy ballsack.....if the mods cant agree on stupid mechanics then how do the developers....oh yea....they are too busy playing in stupid bar bands and ripping console players off to care..what an embarrassment
Shurenai May 14, 2022 @ 10:34pm 
Originally posted by James Bean:
Holy ballsack.....if the mods cant agree on stupid mechanics then how do the developers....oh yea....they are too busy playing in stupid bar bands and ripping console players off to care..what an embarrassment
What the developers do as a hobby in their off-time has little to do with the development process, They are in fact human beings, Not machines. I doubt you spend 168 hours a week working either?

And the console issues were a result of Telltale's mismanagement and ultimate bankruptcy; And because Telltale finalized the game on console, there's literally nothing TFP can do to fix up the console version due to Sony's PSN and Microsoft's Xbox store rules that prohibit changes to 'finished' games that break save compatibility. (Although there are plans afaik to try and do something, they're on the backburner till the PC version is complete.)
Are you seriously going down that rabbit hole? Ok lets go

Game is in early access for 10 years.....still in ALPHA....but im sure developers stupid crappy band, that he spends more time promoting than his 10 year old ALPHA GAME, doesnt take away from completing the game that was started over 10 years ago.

These developers make money from selling copies of their unfinished buggy game on console......one way or another they made money from the deal.........Console players buy the game, along wit the promise it will be updated into a complete game......publisher of console edition goes belly up..............game developers give middle finger to all console players who bought their game and take a stance they will not update or even continue working on the console version. The developers had every opportunity to do SOMETHING to make it right........what did they do? Took that money and started a crappy disgusting band.

Are they legally obligated to trow a bone to the people who bought their game on console? Nope. Is it one of the most disgusting moves from a dev company ever? Sure was. Been playing video games since Pong and have never even HEARD of a developer who sold as many copies to a game as 7 days has just completely ♥♥♥♥ on people who supported them. And to top it off people like you defend it...like them ignoring the people who got screwed by the publishers of console edition is top notch business practice. Technically not their problem but their name on the game so kinda is their problem on the low. Just a disgusting show of capitalism.....But keep on championing for developers who can sell millions of copies of a game but are too inept to create anything more than an alpha game in over 10 years.

You say developers cant do anything? They could offer a free copy to every console player tat got ripped off. But that would require the devs to not be money hungry greedy crappy human beings.

But according to you, they are gods among men for their 10 year old alpha game XD LOL

But I would turn my back on them too after making a nice profit from an unfinished voxel game. They ripped off console players so I have no doubt PC players will get burned too. History is our greatest teacher, not fanboys who roll with the BS lies and excuses.
Teresa May 15, 2022 @ 7:29am 
Telltale sold the console game as a complete game. People bought the console game as a complete game. It was neither bought or sold as an alpha version that would be updated.

Hoping for updates was fine. Expecting them was a mistake.
Shurenai May 15, 2022 @ 12:42pm 
Originally posted by James Bean:
Are you seriously going down that rabbit hole? Ok lets go

Game is in early access for 10 years.....still in ALPHA....but im sure developers stupid crappy band, that he spends more time promoting than his 10 year old ALPHA GAME, doesnt take away from completing the game that was started over 10 years ago.

These developers make money from selling copies of their unfinished buggy game on console......one way or another they made money from the deal.........Console players buy the game, along wit the promise it will be updated into a complete game......publisher of console edition goes belly up..............game developers give middle finger to all console players who bought their game and take a stance they will not update or even continue working on the console version. The developers had every opportunity to do SOMETHING to make it right........what did they do? Took that money and started a crappy disgusting band.

Are they legally obligated to trow a bone to the people who bought their game on console? Nope. Is it one of the most disgusting moves from a dev company ever? Sure was. Been playing video games since Pong and have never even HEARD of a developer who sold as many copies to a game as 7 days has just completely ♥♥♥♥ on people who supported them. And to top it off people like you defend it...like them ignoring the people who got screwed by the publishers of console edition is top notch business practice. Technically not their problem but their name on the game so kinda is their problem on the low. Just a disgusting show of capitalism.....But keep on championing for developers who can sell millions of copies of a game but are too inept to create anything more than an alpha game in over 10 years.

You say developers cant do anything? They could offer a free copy to every console player tat got ripped off. But that would require the devs to not be money hungry greedy crappy human beings.

But according to you, they are gods among men for their 10 year old alpha game XD LOL

But I would turn my back on them too after making a nice profit from an unfinished voxel game. They ripped off console players so I have no doubt PC players will get burned too. History is our greatest teacher, not fanboys who roll with the BS lies and excuses.
Rabbit hole? Sweet, I love rabbit holes. Let's go.

First, off, As for "they spent that money on a 'crappy disgusting band'"; You seriously need to get it in your head that there is a difference between an individual and a company. TFP, the company, has made millions. And like every other company in existence, It pays it's employees wages. Wages that those employees can then spend on whatever the ♥♥♥♥ they want- If one of them wanted to take the money they earned for working and make a band, That's his choice, It's his money that he earned.


Now, Onto the meat:

Yes, TFP made money by selling the console rights to Telltale. But the agreement they had with Telltale basically said TFP had very little say in what Telltale did with the console version of the game. Telltale is the one who sold the 'unfinished buggy game on console', With promises it would be updated; And it was updated. And then Telltale started going belly up and released the console A16 version as a finalized version of the game; They called it a 1.0, thus ending any 'promises it would be updated further'.

Now, This action on Telltales part is supremely important, Because the rules of the Sony PSN and Microsoft XBOX stores explicitly prohibit game developers from doing any update that would invalidate player saves upon a released product. Telltale stated to PSN/Xbox that Console 7DTD was Finished. End of story.

It's not that the developers 'gave a middle finger to all console players and took a stance to not update or even work on the console'; It's that they literally ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ cant update it even if they wanted to because two companies 50,000x their size said "No." (Sony and Microsoft, If that wasn't obvious.)

There isn't a bone they can really throw, here. Console players want to play the game on console, not on PC, so just handing out PC copies of the game is in itself an insulting move. TFP polled players several times in several places, and what they ultimately determined was that, since there is literally nothing of merit they could currently do for console players, they would finalize the PC version so that they have a 1.0 game that wouldn't be changing drastically every couple months to begin porting to console.


And to be clear here also, TFP spent millions on re-acquiring the rights and intellectual property for the console version of the game between court fees and the actual repurchasing. If they just wanted to say '♥♥♥♥ the console players, we got their money' as you keep implying, They would have kept that money to themselves. Such a "disgusting show of capitalism" where they spent millions buying back something they could have just let fall into the crevices, hm?

They're not ignoring console players, There's just not much that can be done with the original console version. What they've been doing instead is preparing for the future. As some examples:

Originally posted by SylenThunder w/ slight tweaks:
August 2021:
TFP formed a partnership with a distribution company for future distribution of physical copies of 7 Days to Die. As part of the deal the company printed copies of the original PS4 version but complete with all existing updates that had been released as their research showed there was still a demand. This re-release of the original physical game did not add anything new to that version but it did form the foundation for the future when they are ready to print and distribute the new game.

September 2021:
  • Earlier this year TFP scheduled a consultation with Unity Developers to get personalized help for using Unity optimally with their game. The main focus of this consult was to get the most out of the heavy optimization work they were planning starting with A20 until final release of the game. But it also included help with easing the way for porting the game to consoles in the future once it was done.

  • In a tweet, Rick Huenink made the comment that there will for sure be a port of the finished game for Playstation 5 and the new Xbox Series. TFP is committed 100% to that goal and it is the reason they purchased the console rights to their game so they could ensure that it would happen once PC development was finished.
    • On the developer stream tonight Rick Huenink stated that they definitely will be porting the full game to PS5 and Xbox series and are in talks with several studios to make it happen once the PC game is finished and no longer in flux.
    • He also stated that they hope to be able to back port the full game to PS4 and Xbox One as well. Rick thinks it might be possible and it is something they are going to be seriously looking into. They also hope to provide dedicated servers for console as well as crossplay.
They've done quite a bit more since, but I don't fancy digging through even more topics.

This does not look to me like a company that "completely ♥♥♥♥ on people who supported them"; It looks to me like a company that is preparing to do right by the people who supported them. They clearly also aren't just "ignoring the people who got screwed by the publishers".

The devs cant do anything with the current console version of the game. They really can't. Offering a free copy to console players does next to nothing- Many console players don't even have actual PC's, so offering them a free copy of the PC version is moot; And offering them a free copy of the console version is...just dumb? They already have the console version. And many of the console players that had both a console AND a PC had already bought the game in both locations so again, the attempt would fall flat.

As for 8~ years in alpha (10 is an exaggeration and you know it), Games take time to develop, and the current average development time for video games is 5+ years, and that average is set by massive companies like EA and Ubisoft. I'm not going to go any deeper into this because my god there are like 15 locked megathreads on the subject with hundreds and hundreds of pages of arguments.


I do not think they are gods among men. I think they're a small company of 25~ people that are taking on a game even AAA companies like EA, Blizzard, and Ubisoft wouldn't touch with a 10 ft pole. They aren't perfect either, but they're doing their best to do right by the community as much as they can, and they're putting the time in to complete the game that they promised in the kickstarter even though the development timeline is MUCH longer than they ever wanted it to be. They are doing their best to stand by those promises they made back then, to create a game that has all those features, that is every bit amazing as they envisioned it, instead of simply giving up and leaving it alone, or just calling it a 1.0 and walking away.


People have this twisted impression that they're still working on the game for massive profit and extending it indefinitely into alpha because they're, as you put it, "money hungry greedy crappy human beings"- But no. If they just wanted money, They would have ditched the game several years ago and started a new one or just walked away free with the cash.

They got most of the sales that would ever happen by then, and development work isn't free. The amount of cashflow in their direction now is a trickle of what it was in the first few years, And that trickle is barely enough to offset costs- I'd personally wager it doesn't even offset costs, I don't have access to their financial reports- But I know enough about the industry to estimate the costs involved and it's a near thing; They're coasting at best right now, And slightly in the red digging into the bank at worst. If it was just for the money, they've made the worst move possible. But it's not about the money. It's about making the game right.


I could say SO much more in response to you right now. But, In short a quick TL;DR:
Originally posted by James Bean:
The developers had every opportunity to do SOMETHING to make it right........what did they do?
They began preparing to do the console version right, Themselves, Without shifting the work to a publisher because that went south last time. And they're planning it properly, to do it right, with the finished 1.0 version of the game.
Originally posted by Teresa:
Telltale sold the console game as a complete game. People bought the console game as a complete game. It was neither bought or sold as an alpha version that would be updated.

Hoping for updates was fine. Expecting them was a mistake.
Also this.
Last edited by Shurenai; May 15, 2022 @ 12:44pm
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Date Posted: May 13, 2022 @ 6:10pm
Posts: 10