Agility is terrible

[Jolly]

I have experimented with building a character of every main type including a jack of all trades for A18

I play on:
-Survival Difficulty (Insane is boring, kite hit kite hit kite hit forever... and just camp out during horde night instead of fighting it, Zzz)
-120 minute days (to do trader missions)
-300% xp gain (just to build my characters)
-50% loot (I don't like finding everything too quick and easy) except I have a problem with food because of this, which is why Fortitude build was a lot easier.

I got to basically lvl 35 on each build
I put Points directly into the Attributes to level 9 (Strength, Agility, etc) by then my character reaches level 10 and then finally I start putting Points in the skills. I eventually find the corresponding item (Cigar, Ski Goggles, etc) which brings me to level 10 in Attributes.

Agility based was the last character I made. Just from reading the skills while building other characters, none of it sounded good so I saved it for last.... and well, I was right (as far as I can tell)

I started building Sneak dmg and Bows, It was exactly how I used to play most of the time I played this game. Sneak into a house and pop them in the head with a bow, so I figured this should be good... Nope, not with all these traps and zombies being triggered just being in a certain room, forcing me to use some gun or run waking up even more, sneaking around taking so long I can only do 1, maybe 2 mission a day (on longest day setting) and having to prevent dropping down in a room that always triggers an ambush by using tools to break into that room aggroing everything in range (so sneaking becomes useless). Sneaking around at night to avoid runners is UBER boring and even with the increased sneak speed it takes WAY too long to sneak around threats at night.

I eventually went into Pistols/Knifes and Light Armor, focused on building ammo, I could run through a house no problem, it's the run back that was insanely boring. I thought Agility had the ability to save Stamina while running but they put that in Fortitude instead (Rule 1: Cardio).

So, Strength can hold more, Fort can run more, Intellect can build vehicles, and Perception doesn't have much of a problem eventually finding schems for vehicles like my Perception character never put any skills in Intellect except Forge (because my trader had a broken forge). So, Sneak must go into building a bike and hope it can find something better than a bike later on. There's nothing there for traveling which is boring af for an Agility based character. What is the end game for Agility. Building an impenetrable Base as Strength, or fly anywhere or protect with traps as Intellect, Agility isn't even that good for PvP, whatever...

Knifes don't really have stun or stagger as much as blunt weapons do, now they added Zombies has a chance to charge at you when they're hurt. So your knives better kill something quick and bleeding doesn't really help when they are charging you. This gives me WAY more incentive to use my Bow/Gun instead of my knife (Except when they are on the ground, which feels like I wasted skills in Knives)

Heavily modified Pistols is the bees knees. I love it and the ammo is cheap/easy to make. I never did find a supressor tho . That might be a fun build but compared to the other builds...

Here's my rank from Funnest to Least (and what I like about them) [and what i don't]
Intellect (Turrets was great fun, augurs and gyrocopters, need I say more)
Strength (Building my own fortification and gathering resources was very efficient and level up really fast) [lack of food was more serious]
Fortification (Every ability here is awesome which I can't say for any other Attribute, Dominates late game) [Slow start]
Perception (I want to try Demolition build later, buried treasure is as easy as showing up)
Agility... (Modified Pistol) [Agility]

[Retro Hacker Developer]

With everything maxed in agility you can instant kill almost anything with sneak attacks so quests are a cinch. Also machetes are a lot of fun.

[JimmyIowa]

Originally posted by Jolly:

Insane is boring, kite hit kite hit kite hit forever...

No opinion on the main point of your post. But I agree with the above. Insane becomes a test of patience rather than skill.

The thing is, if you can reliably kite and not take damage in easy difficulty (which anyone with over 50 hours in the game can do), then by definition you can also do it on insane. Because the enemies on insane don't attack or move any faster. You are, in fact, 100% as safe on insane as easy. The only difference is that enemies take boringly long to kill.

The best way to bump up challenge is to increase zombie run speed across the board. Easy difficulty with a fast run speed is 10x more challenging than "insane" with default run speeds.

[Damnion]

Meh agility isn't as bad as your letting on. The silenced pistol is wicked strong in an early game stealth build. Switch to a magnum for horde nights later on. With triple xp, half loot, and 120 min days your game stage is gonna be wicked high on horde night though and you are gonna be less likely to have the supplies you need to fight it. If you leave loot on normal you are also likely to not need to spend more than the first point in chef to pick up teas. The rest of the cooking recipes are easy to find in kitchen loot and garbage bags. There is also a pretty descent chance of finding the schematics for workstations looting their destroyed versions. Its also not unusual to find vehicles in the shop, or pick up vehicle schematics.
Agility build isn't bad, it's just bad for you. If you find sneaking around a house 1 shotting enemies boring play a different build.

[Chaoslink]

Originally posted by JimmyIowa:

Originally posted by Jolly:

Insane is boring, kite hit kite hit kite hit forever...

No opinion on the main point of your post. But I agree with the above. Insane becomes a test of patience rather than skill.

The thing is, if you can reliably kite and not take damage in easy difficulty (which anyone with over 50 hours in the game can do), then by definition you can also do it on insane. Because the enemies on insane don't attack or move any faster. You are, in fact, 100% as safe on insane as easy. The only difference is that enemies take boringly long to kill.

The best way to bump up challenge is to increase zombie run speed across the board. Easy difficulty with a fast run speed is 10x more challenging than "insane" with default run speeds.

Yup, I totally agree as well. Its like playing the Mass Effect 1/2 games and raising the difficulty. All it did was make enemies have more health to a degree that was just ridiculous. The only difficulty it brought was having to find more ammo to shoot with, assuming that was even relevant. Insane in 7 days is no different. Just bump up their health to near ridiculous levels and boom, its... harder? Boring seems like a better word. Makes ammo more of an issue? More like makes me have to go smack coal and nitrate ores more often...

Originally posted by Jolly:

Perception (I want to try Demolition build later,

I LOVE playing with explosives. Horde night is great. Crank up the zombie spawns and just find a place to cluster them up. I love finding a good stairwell to hide in, knock out a stair or two so they can't reach you and just drop a grenade down there every so often for massive XP gains. Really wanna mess things up? Toss a few dynamites instead. Not to mention how satisfying it is to stick a shaped charge to their face... Its more end game as you'll need quite a bit of resources, especially gunpowder, to have enough explosives. Use a red dot sniper for single enemies, a spear in melee and bombs for clusters and you're golden. I generally use heavy armor too as you'll want that protection if a bomb doesn't go as far as you'd have liked.

[Jolly]

Originally posted by Retro Hacker Developer:

With everything maxed in agility you can instant kill almost anything with sneak attacks so quests are a cinch. Also machetes are a lot of fun.

Does Sneak even work for PvP?

I haven't gotten a Machete yet, the only thing that'll make my points in "Deep Cut" worth it imo.

[Lunacy]

I've been trying out bleed knife build in single and I find myself still using sledge for everything. Even without points into sledge it still 1shots basic zombies. Sometimes I'll knife to apply bleed then finish with sledge and they die while ragdolled.
There's a book series if you manage to find it all you will always deal sneak damage with knives (not sure if applies to machete) during the night. Which still isn't a lot of damage, that's like half a sledgehammer if you specced full sneak attack.
I put 1 point into sneak attack so far since 2.5x sneak damage with hunting rifle can 1shot most random outside zombies for easy exp.

[Jolly]

Originally posted by Damnion:

Meh agility isn't as bad as your letting on. The silenced pistol is wicked strong in an early game stealth build. Switch to a magnum for horde nights later on. With triple xp, half loot, and 120 min days your game stage is gonna be wicked high on horde night though and you are gonna be less likely to have the supplies you need to fight it. If you leave loot on normal you are also likely to not need to spend more than the first point in chef to pick up teas. The rest of the cooking recipes are easy to find in kitchen loot and garbage bags. There is also a pretty descent chance of finding the schematics for workstations looting their destroyed versions. Its also not unusual to find vehicles in the shop, or pick up vehicle schematics.
Agility build isn't bad, it's just bad for you. If you find sneaking around a house 1 shotting enemies boring play a different build.

I'm sorry but what silenced pistol? Are you talking about a Pistol with a Silencer Modifier?

You'd be surprised how little to nothing you find in kitchens with 50% loot which is why food is a problem which is also why I'm doing nothing but missions to get money to buy from traders/vendors.

Between all my characters I found maybe 3 schems in broken crafting blocks. I don't get your point, you say to put a skill in Chef for teas but, I didn't need to waste one for a forge? Forgive me but it just sounds like you just want to argue.

But seriously what is this Early Game Silenced Pistol you're talking about?

[Jolly]

Originally posted by Luna-Sharkeh:

I have Burning Shaft Mod on my knife and the DOTS doesn't even kill basic zombies.

[JA]

How do get machete in a18?

[Damnion]

Originally posted by Jolly:

Originally posted by Damnion:

Meh agility isn't as bad as your letting on. The silenced pistol is wicked strong in an early game stealth build. Switch to a magnum for horde nights later on. With triple xp, half loot, and 120 min days your game stage is gonna be wicked high on horde night though and you are gonna be less likely to have the supplies you need to fight it. If you leave loot on normal you are also likely to not need to spend more than the first point in chef to pick up teas. The rest of the cooking recipes are easy to find in kitchen loot and garbage bags. There is also a pretty descent chance of finding the schematics for workstations looting their destroyed versions. Its also not unusual to find vehicles in the shop, or pick up vehicle schematics.
Agility build isn't bad, it's just bad for you. If you find sneaking around a house 1 shotting enemies boring play a different build.

I'm sorry but what silenced pistol? Are you talking about a Pistol with a Silencer Modifier?

You'd be surprised how little to nothing you find in kitchens with 50% loot which is why food is a problem which is also why I'm doing nothing but missions to get money to buy from traders/vendors.

Between all my characters I found maybe 3 schems in broken crafting blocks. I don't get your point, you say to put a skill in Chef for teas but, I didn't need to waste one for a forge? Forgive me but it just sounds like you just want to argue.

But seriously what is this Early Game Silenced Pistol you're talking about?

Pretty much all your problems come from gimping yourself with 50% loot. You can put a point into forge early game too if you want to, i was just saying on normal looting it doesn't take long to find a forge or the schematic, i like to get tea early b/c it completely eliminates getting the ♥♥♥♥♥ if you never drink anything but tea or mineral water.
Protip for food, find 2 or 3 vending machines and mark em on your map, they restock every day and you never have to worry about food again, unless you get really unlucky.
Anyway my point was it's not the build, its just your play style that's the problem, which is fine, play how you like, just don't complain about issues that only arise because you changed the setting off of default. Or do, it's a free country.

[BigRowdy]

Originally posted by Damnion:

Originally posted by Jolly:

I'm sorry but what silenced pistol? Are you talking about a Pistol with a Silencer Modifier?

You'd be surprised how little to nothing you find in kitchens with 50% loot which is why food is a problem which is also why I'm doing nothing but missions to get money to buy from traders/vendors.

Between all my characters I found maybe 3 schems in broken crafting blocks. I don't get your point, you say to put a skill in Chef for teas but, I didn't need to waste one for a forge? Forgive me but it just sounds like you just want to argue.

But seriously what is this Early Game Silenced Pistol you're talking about?

Pretty much all your problems come from gimping yourself with 50% loot. You can put a point into forge early game too if you want to, i was just saying on normal looting it doesn't take long to find a forge or the schematic, i like to get tea early b/c it completely eliminates getting the ♥♥♥♥♥ if you never drink anything but tea or mineral water.
Protip for food, find 2 or 3 vending machines and mark em on your map, they restock every day and you never have to worry about food again, unless you get really unlucky.
Anyway my point was it's not the build, its just your play style that's the problem, which is fine, play how you like, just don't complain about issues that only arise because you changed the setting off of default. Or do, it's a free country.

I dont see it as gimping, I play 25% loot. The Struggle is REAL. Everyday consist of gathering food for the first half, hunting or trading, then the second half is for raiding or building. Of course this is just my playstyle, I aint superior or nothin, I just like to really struggle to survive. It makes finding loot so much more rewarding when you do find something...

[Jolly]

Originally posted by Damnion:

Originally posted by Jolly:

I'm sorry but what silenced pistol? Are you talking about a Pistol with a Silencer Modifier?

You'd be surprised how little to nothing you find in kitchens with 50% loot which is why food is a problem which is also why I'm doing nothing but missions to get money to buy from traders/vendors.

Between all my characters I found maybe 3 schems in broken crafting blocks. I don't get your point, you say to put a skill in Chef for teas but, I didn't need to waste one for a forge? Forgive me but it just sounds like you just want to argue.

But seriously what is this Early Game Silenced Pistol you're talking about?

Pretty much all your problems come from gimping yourself with 50% loot. You can put a point into forge early game too if you want to, i was just saying on normal looting it doesn't take long to find a forge or the schematic, i like to get tea early b/c it completely eliminates getting the ♥♥♥♥♥ if you never drink anything but tea or mineral water.
Protip for food, find 2 or 3 vending machines and mark em on your map, they restock every day and you never have to worry about food again, unless you get really unlucky.
Anyway my point was it's not the build, its just your play style that's the problem, which is fine, play how you like, just don't complain about issues that only arise because you changed the setting off of default. Or do, it's a free country.

You think these issues only arise from changing a few settings? You read my OP right? ..because you're taking me way out of context. My OP is talking about the cons of Agility compared to other Attributes and the ONLY time I brought up putting a point in Forge wasn't even my Agility build and on the contrary had to do with I FIND SO MANY SCHEMS that I ONLY had to put a point in Forge early as testing Perception AKA Not putting points in Intellect + Vehicles.

Also, tea doesn't feed you not sure why you brought that up in the first place, also Finding 3 Vendors that actually work doesn't happen easy every game. Sorry if you only read the title, it only holds so much room so I said something critical of Agility. So forgive me again, if thinking you just came to argue because it sounds like it.

So, what is this Early Game Silenced Pistol you were talking about or were you talking about 100% loot = finding Early Game Silencer Modifier and a Pistol?

[KellyR]

Originally posted by Jolly:

~snip~

I feel like the entire OP reads as "I don't personally enjoy stealth, therefore the build that is literally for stealth is clearly objectively trash. Because I don't like it."

[Chaoslink]

Originally posted by KellyR:

Originally posted by Jolly:

~snip~

I feel like the entire OP reads as "I don't personally enjoy stealth, therefore the build that is literally for stealth is clearly objectively trash. Because I don't like it."

I read it more that it isn't good because it isn't efficient. Hence the reference to how long it takes to clear houses compared to other builds.

[Bad Brad]

Thanks for this guide. I've restarted a few times trying different builds and I finally went with a hybrid Perception/Strength build and I'm loving it.

I put 7 points in Strength. Strength gives me sledgehammer + Sexual Tyran which is a super efficient combo for killing. My level 5 Iron sledge cracks heads with ease. Strength also means I can mine like a mad mole and never run out of raw materials for base building. Pack mule is nice too.

Then I put 5 into perception. This gives me good skills with a rifle, and a very high loot bonus from lucky looter. I also took the skill that helps me find animals which means I get more meat.

I think I will leave Strength at 7 and Perception at 5, and now start working on Fortitude for the healing, damage reduction and iron gut.