Please Re-add the ability to switch off reprojection completely, or just use Asynchronous reprojection.

[GingasVR]

So back around December you guys decided that motion smoothing software was ready for the stable branch... you forced an update on everybody and took away the option for people to control what kind of reprojection to use or to turn reprojection off completely.

Before the update I...( an I assume most people) would disable interleaved reprojection and keep on asynchronous since it only reprojected a few frames when needed(versus locking the FPS at 45 and being super aggressive with missed frames)


Motion smoothing IMHO does NOT work in most games. It’s creates a warping effect that makes me motion sick... asynchronous reprojection never caused that issue for me.

Now obviously this is fine right??? You can just go into the video tab and turn off motion smoothing in preferences. NO. If you turn it off, SteamVR automatically defaults to interleaved reprojection...which is the WORSE form of reprojection.

So let’s say you can run most games in VR around 90 FPS... which looks and feels the best.

With motion smoothing or interleaved, If that FPS drops even slightly to 89... then BOOM your frame rate will try to go to 45 FPS instantly. This has a terrible effect on games because of the constantly switching frames.

Alright... “Up you SS so you stay below 90 FPS all the time, or keep motion smoothing on all the”

Yes... this makes it look smoother..but then you get a warping effect and things in vr games will be RUNNING at 45 FPS. It actually makes me want to throw up, I get physically sick if it goes to 45.

I... just don’t get why they took away the option to have asynchronous on by default and disable motion smoothing/interleaved.:


It’s great for people with low end systems who don’t have the option.. but if you have a high end VR system and hover around 90 FPS... then it’s absolutely terrible.


I’ve also compared performance metrics to this update, and opting into the MacOS default (no motion smoothing)

In most cases it’s running 2-3 MS faster then the most recent update.

Reprojection is also kicking on randomly in SteamVR home when not needed (because I assume it’s defaulting to the much more aggressive interleaved instead of asynchronous)


PLEASE valve! ADD back the ability to customize reprojection, forcing people to 45 FPS when they have a high end system and hover around 90 most of the time creates an unbearably bad expietence... I actually felt like I needed to puke a few times when using motion smoothing or turning it off on the latest update.


Don’t fix what wasn’t broken,



POOF.

proof.

Motion Smoothing on-Current SteamVR Build
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s95KYyx_pio&feature=youtu.be

Motion Smoothing off-Current SteamVR Build
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_Kj-NkXuok&feature=youtu.be

MacOS Default- Older SteamVR Build
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2D8U919FD0g&feature=youtu.be

Taken inside SteamVR Home

Test it out yourself.

Specs:

1080ti -overclocked

i7 6700k -overclocked

16GB RAM

[--ranXerox--]

Your system injects extra frames to keep 90 fps at all times regardless of the background dropping fps. Your headset will output 90 fps even if the background drops to 45 fps. headset does 90 fps at all times. The higher the super sampling, the more artifacts appear. You may need to drop your Super sampling if you see artifacts appearing. Do not use software which states you are running under 90fps because it will give you a false idea of what's really going on.

motion smoothing works like this, It does so by injecting extra frames.

from valve:
"The way we are applying Motion Smoothing in SteamVR is a bit different. When SteamVR sees that an application isn’t going to make framerate (i.e. start dropping frames), Motion Smoothing kicks in. It looks at the last two delivered frames, estimates motion and animation, and extrapolates a new frame. Synthesizing new frames keeps the current application at full framerate, advances motion forward, and avoids judder.

This means that the player is still experiencing full framerate (90 Hz for the Vive and Vive Pro), but the application only needs to render 1 out of every 2 frames, dramatically lowering the performance requirements. Even better, if synthesizing a new frame for every frame delivered by the application still leads to performance issues, Motion Smoothing is designed to scale further down to synthesize 2 frames or even 3 frames for every 1 frame delivered."


Read off the milliseconds. If it goes in the red, drop the super sampling. this might be your nausea issue.


my experience:
If I use the default head gasket, i get nausea myself. when I used a VRcover headgasket, my eyes are much closes to the lense and I don't experience nausea regardless of millisecends because I feel my head is closes to the FOV necessery to remove this motion sickness.

Same thing on a PC monitor. if the FOV is off, I get instant nausea. The first Witcher game caused so much nausea I refunded it. Love the series though.

Of course everybody is different. HOpe this helps.

[GingasVR]

Absolutely not.

I’m on a 1080ti and 6700k, before motion smoothing was a thing, my headset and hand movement was FINE at %200 SS


After motion smoothing, there is a clear performance drop, and it’s using interleaved reprojection (AKA the worst form of teprojection available)


I should NOT and I will not DROP my SS when it was RUNNING fine prior to this stupid update.


VR should NOT drop to 45 FPS if it can’t hit a stable 90. Asynchronous was able to get the headset to 90 if it wasn’t stable, the downside was hands were slightly jittery, but it wasn’t super aggressive and if the headset could maintain a good 90 it would instantly turn off.


This new form on motion smoothing synthetically doubles the framerate. BUT it is WAYYYYY to agressive.

It should NOT try to get to 45 FPS from 89. It’s creates lag and artifacts in the headset. THAT is what’s making me sick.


I do not normally get motion sick. I’ve been using a vive since it launched in 2016. So trust me. I’ve got my VR legs



Valve and prioritized low end computers that can’t handle VR in the first place... while simultaneously destroying any an all options to disable this stupid system.

If your computer hovers around 90FPS then your ♥♥♥♥♥♥. If you can’t handle 90 in the first place then this is a good update.

synthetic frames are 100% worse then real frames

[Bob Loblaw]

I didn't notice a change on my machine due to the update. I had async on, interleaved off (felt clunkier than async), motion smoothing off (didn't like the artifacts). It still looks the same to me.

[--ranXerox--]

Originally posted by Gingas:

It should NOT try to get to 45 FPS from 89. It’s creates lag and artifacts in the headset. THAT is what’s making me sick.

Maybee the artifacts gets you sick or the FOV. anyway I have your same rig and it runs at 200% just fine no artifacts.

I also have a 2080ti on a vive pro 200% which looks way clean and no artifacts. I can also boost it to 400% and runs just fine in most cases.

[GingasVR]

Originally posted by --ranXerox--:

Originally posted by Gingas:

It should NOT try to get to 45 FPS from 89. It’s creates lag and artifacts in the headset. THAT is what’s making me sick.

I also have a 2080ti on a vive pro 200% which looks way clean and no artifacts. I can also boost it to 400% and runs just fine in most cases.

It's definitely not running fine. You're running games at 45 fps. That is not fine.

Motion smoothing is implemented in a terrible way, and if you're saying you can't notice a difference between the fake framerate of motion smoothing, and the 90FPS and slight jutter of asyc reprojection that only turns on when needed.... thats like when people say they don't notice a difference between 30 and 60 FPS

Theres a CLEAR DIFFERENCE, and because this is VR, it can make people PHYSICALLY SICK.

I've done countless tests on this and rolling back to MacOS default (update before motion smoothing) Framrate is better on the mac version. You HAVE THE ABILITY TO turn off inerleaved reprojection and just use Async (on new update if you uncheck motion smoothing then it defaults to some mixed form of both async and interleaved... which IMHO is ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥)

I'm glad you don't notice a difference in motion smoothing. But no.. it is not running fine for you.

[--ranXerox--]

if you say so, 45fps it is.

[GingasVR]

Originally posted by --ranXerox--:

if you say so, 45fps it is.

proof.

Motion Smoothing on-Current SteamVR Build
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s95KYyx_pio&feature=youtu.be

Motion Smoothing off-Current SteamVR Build
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_Kj-NkXuok&feature=youtu.be

MacOS Default- Older SteamVR Build
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2D8U919FD0g&feature=youtu.be

Taken inside SteamVR Home

Test it out yourself.

Specs:

1080ti -overclocked

i7 6700k -overclocked

16GB RAM

[DmAnd]

There is no reason why we can not have a few check boxes to enable/disable async, interlaced and motion smoothing

[--ranXerox--]

what exactly are you showing me here. it says 90hz with milliseconds of 8.2. the video isn't going to show us anything. This stuff is completely subjective and I'm not saying I don't believe you. anyway, mines looks smooth and not like in that video and I have about 200 trophies in a single room. something doesnt seem right.

my rig runs 90fps. Try updating the nvidia drivers. They been putting out alot of new drivers to improve this. make sure its in direct mode too. I'm not using steamVR beta either.

[GingasVR]

Originally posted by --ranXerox--:

what exactly are you showing me here. it says 90hz with milliseconds of 8.2. the video isn't going to show us anything. This stuff is completely subjective and I'm not saying I don't believe you. anyway, mines looks smooth and not like in that video and I have about 200 trophies in a single room. something doesnt seem right.

my rig runs 90fps. Try updating the nvidia drivers. They been putting out alot of new drivers to improve this. make sure its in direct mode too. I'm not using steamVR beta either.

are you serious.... it's showing reprojection and motion smoothing in the first 2 videos and smooth 90 fps in the last one.


go into settings enable GPU monitors in the headset and report back.

You WILL ABSOLUTLY SEE A DIFFERENCE.

JUST BECAUSE it "looks smooth" DOES NOT MEAN ITS SMOOTH.

it's reprojection and locking to 45 fps when there is a slight frame dip. Valve needs to fix this broken software or allow us to switch it off and ONLY USE ASYNC reprojection

[--ranXerox--]

Here is an update to the above.

I dropped my SS down to like 50% and I noticed a slight blur on steamVR home. So it does effect it. I had to restart application. the changes use to occur instantly on previous versions.

I then boosted the ss to 350% and it looked the same but I did notice something- When turning off motion smoothing, Re-projection kicks in. I notice my wand blurring across my face with with motion smoothing off.The application also tells me re-projection is on. With motion smoothing on, re projection never kicks in according to the software (but we know how motion smoothening works already).

yup, Visually seeing 45fps is pretty bad. The interleaving does make me hurl but motion smoothening has improved it for me. They keep tweaking it and in my opinion has improvements.

I wonder if this could work for you. https://steamcommunity.com/app/250820/discussions/0/1732090362042833245/

[Rogu Spanish]

I've been having some performance issues with Rec Room for some time, in particular the Laser tag map CyberJunk City where it is very obvious. The game stutters often and makes me dread playing that map, well until I tried switching to the macos branch without motion smoothing.

I played one game and didn't stutter once, in light of this I really think all reprojection options should be made available to choose as we please.

[CircumSamurai]

Originally posted by Chiesa5o:

I've been having some performance issues with Rec Room for some time, in particular the Laser tag map CyberJunk City where it is very obvious. The game stutters often and makes me dread playing that map.

Last time I played Rec Room fairly recently, I too was having performance issues that I'm pretty sure I didn't have before, especially on that CyberJunk City map. I don't get why they would take away options to tweak as we please. Just make it the new default setting, while still letting people who want/need to change it, change it.

[Gᴜsʜɪɴɢ Gʀᴀɴɴʏ]

I've definitely noticed a performance drop since the motion smoothing update. I keep motion smoothing off, but games where I was previously getting great performance are now stuttering even though motion smoothing is off.

On the bright side, my Vive wireless adapter is losing connection much less than before.

[TrustedKiller]

If you still want to use Async reprojection, you can download OpenVR Advanced Settings and it lets you turn on/off all those settings.