As a Weirhmacht player how do you counter mass allied infantry

[Archer]

To me it seems to be far to difficult to counter the sheer number of infantry men for USF during early game. They just come in endless waves and there is a limit to which my mg spam could do . Most of our best weapons come tier 2 or 3. By then its way to difficult for the Weirhmacht to mount a counter offensive due to the sheer number of infantry and support units that the allies have. And if you focus too much on anti infantry sooner or later I see m8 Shermans all over the place. By the time I get the tiger it is outnumbered usually 2-1 by just IS-2s. So since it seems like to me that the allies are almost impossible to stop because they are a bit op early game and are played by mostly good or veteran players from COH1. How would any one of you counter them whether as a Weirhmact player or Western Germans? Thank you :)

[Archer]

other than improving just macro and micro because that is very much obvious thanks :)

[Shakesbeer]

grens with LMGs seem to do well at long range. spamming only mg's usually does not work because they can be outmaneuvered pretty easy.

[Archer]

I kind of meant that its just I usually have the same number of mgs as my grens

[Armando]

In my experience the best way to defeat them is Ostwind with good positioning. Stug 3 Ausf E (from Mechanized Assault Doctrine) is also good but you have to micro the attacks - Target specific point).

[r p z :D]

Best way? Obersoldaten with infra stg. :D

[Julius]

Originally posted by rapiz <3 NiP:

Best way? Obersoldaten with infra stg. :D

too bad those 4 man sniper squad is limited to the OKW.

[Darkness]

Pray to RNGesus that you would like your Grenadiers to actually kill a model before the allies get into point blank range or the MG42 to suppress without firing 3-4 useless volleys and you might survive the early game with enough resources and exp to get the stuff that actually works. Other than that nothing I get lives long enough. a flame upgraded half track is fun for me against scripts and penals but if you fight USF 1 bazooka or 1 Zis gun and GG

[Darkness]

Whoops forgot Conscripts just AT grenade halftrack to death so only time to use flame projector is penals and maxim spams, MAYBE against Rifles that aren't in the Elite Rifle doctrine as the AT rifle grenade kills them too...

[YCWD]

Helps alot if you specify the game mode. There are different tactics in different modes of play. For example I could tell you to get Two MGs in 1v1 and overlap them. This will stop another player in a 1v1. But in a 4v4 when there are 4X the number of infantry squads this system changes.

[The Mailman Thinks I Am Gay]

I like to defend early game, so I pick a place that is sutied for holding down. Then I get two mg, two gren, and a mortor.

It something, not fool proof though.

As Jheatless said, you need to specify the mode.

[Archer]

I usually play in 3v3 or 4v4 and usually end up wide open maps

[Joshwerds]

If you play team games just spam out grens and mgs, mortars help too. Getting some Panzer 4s for support is great but if they go heavy on amrour go for panthers.

[Rye]

Variety is important i perfer the OKW fortification docterine because of the MG team call in. However the doctrine and faction dont matter both volks and grens have great early AT options (volks panzershreks are viable vs and tank). In the early stages of the game i personally love to put immense pressure on the allied forces, to beat an inf spam you need very good micro of you infantry and always keep an MG behind your infantry to suppress the rifle spam. Im my opinion USF and the Soviets are easy mode, just spam countless infantry units and hope for the best. Germany requries good micro and combined arms (i personally dont like support guns unless im facing a very good mortar spam). To counter the masses of support guns that the allies field it is imperative to keep moving and applying pressure to the allies.

[Le Elvis]

In random 4v4 matches I have yet to see a viable tactic against early game infantry spam.
As already mentioned, MG spam is just a waste, as MGs get overrun pretty easily, Flak HT is too squishy and dies within seconds most of all due to his inability to shoot while driving.
An early Luchs might be a good option, but it will cripple your early game infantry presence even more. Obers also come far too late to make any difference in the early game. Aggressive and well microed inf spam is very hard to beat. I have lost countless times to it.

As Ostheer I'd go for a several Gren squads with LMG and push aggressively back and mine the hell out of the territory, praying that the Tigers will fix it.
The OKW fortification doctrine is a nice way to make life difficult for inf spammers, but it also tempts you to spend too much on static defense structures.

[Archer]

Thanks guys I really appreciate all of your recomendations. But to Chief red bull how do you become aggressive in early game against allies when in most cases your barely holding your ground in early game. For example if I advance to another sector beyond victory point I usually end up having my grens being squished by the sheer number of american and soviet infantry. Not to mention that I barely hold my ground with my mgs already placed in fuel sector and most of my infantry put in front and at its other flanks as a buffer zone. If I focus to much on infantry I end up getting over runed by american and soviet armor. Not to mention that annoying aa halftrack that supressed my infantry which america can deploy. At what point do you guys think I should bring up the armor it seems very difficult for me to get the timeing right. By armor I mean second teir tanks. Also if you guys wouldn't mind whats ur build order usually. Thanks :)