Panther VS Pershing and German Armor In General

[Caernavon]

I keep seeing people ranting that the Pershing is underpowered, that it loses to the Panther in tank-to-tank combat.

I'd like to know why so many people are saying that, because -I- use the Panther, and every time I've engaged a Pershing, the encounter has ended disasterously for the Panther. And unlike the Pershing, MY tank has various perks, such as upgraded armor, faster reload, etc.

The Pershing's 90mm cannon seems to be able to reliably defeat Panther frontal armor, and I haven't been able to consistently use the Panther's mobility to circle the Pershing, because most USF players I've encountered thus far have been skillful enough to accompany the Pershing with other troops and vehicles.

To be honest, I feel like German armor has been nerfed across the board. I used to use the Panther extensively, but the extreme fuel cost delayed the deployment, and I could never seem to overcome the sheer number of Allied tanks using a lone Panther or two. Then I switched out to STUGs (even before they were buffed), but when Relic replaced the "stun" ability with a turret-jamming one, the STUG lost a great deal of power. Panzer IV is decent tank that fails miserably when confronted with more advanced Allied armor (in particular the Jackson eats Panzer IV's for breakfast).

The Allies now have numerous platforms in the game to deal with German armor. They have the famous 17pdr gun on Fireflies and in fixed positions. The USF now has the Pershing and the Jackson, and together they can do more than they could ever do apart. Even the Soviets have gained....the limitation of one heavy tank on the field has re-oriented the battlefield in such a way that those T-34's (especially the upgraded ones) remain a relevant force even in late-game.

Maybe this is a good thing. Before the British arrived on the scene, the matchmaking system overwhelmingly favored German players....there were times when 80% of all players online were playing German. Now, with the British and the USF heavy tanks, the matchmaking appears near-even, or even favorable to the Allies.

[Luka]

Some saying ist underpowered others overpowered.. Thing is, it just released other day. The community needs to play game more and give it time so devs actually can collect some data as well as constructive feedback.

Is supposed to be expensive for quality same with ranger. No opinion on should be buff or nerf..

[Fornax The Lazy]

Hmm,was here to laugh at fanboys,'m quite confused now.
Generally you're right except you should realize that bulletins are not that game changing unless stacked.

[Caernavon]

@Luca- I would expect a Pershing to be at least equivalent with a Tiger 1 series tank, because I know that Pershings engaged and destroyed Tiger 1 tanks during the war. One Pershing engaged and knocked out a Tiger at about 900 yards, which was a pretty decent engagement range. A Tiger was also knocked out in battle near Cologne, also by a Pershing.

[Luka]

Ja Pershing ist quality tank for price.

[dubweiser101]

Well I can tell you, after having played several team games against Pershings that they are indeed quite good. They will hold up against a Panther, and Tiger. Support them with an M36 and you have a powerful armored fist. Personally I believe that the population values for allied armor needs to be brought in line, because at this point USF can muster tons of armor (due to pop cap values). An M26 with an M4 + M36 is a nightmare compared to a pair of Panzer V Panthers.

[Exarch_Alpha]

The tank is good, but the rest is a bit meh. Using the mine ability is critical to get good results of the doctrine in early and mid game, expecting a unit to be saviour alone, late game, won´t work.

Pershing doctrine gives you only 2 artillery options: the Major (HAHHAAHAHAHAHA) and the Howitzer, meaning you are very ♥♥♥♥♥♥ versus well entrenched germans. Good luck killing that 88.

[Caernavon]

@Exarch- That's very true. Without something like a Priest, it can be hard to drive German forces out of a well-designed entrenchment.

[ArrangedTuba292]

The pershing can kill a panther and may hold on in a fight against a tiger if used right but in all reality the tigers stats are far better health and armour wise the pershingis a little better than the panther all i ask is a decreasd price in fuel not by much tho

[dubweiser101]

Originally posted by dabigfattuba:

The pershing can kill a panther and may hold on in a fight against a tiger if used right but in all reality the tigers stats are far better health and armour wise the pershingis a little better than the panther all i ask is a decreasd price in fuel not by much tho

You're a player with sense. 100% agree with you. For the price, the Pershing packs a nice punch, especially when supported with a cheaper M36. Good bye Panther; good bye Tiger. Balance is fair as far as M26 goes. That being said, I'd like to see a slight increase in population cap values for the rest of Allied armor since it's now easy to flood the field with armor for allies. OKW stands little chance since since fuel is beyond scarce.

[Fornax The Lazy]

Wait,did you say that fuel is scarce for OKW?

[mustachewarfare]

Originally posted by dubweiser101:

Originally posted by dabigfattuba:

The pershing can kill a panther and may hold on in a fight against a tiger if used right but in all reality the tigers stats are far better health and armour wise the pershingis a little better than the panther all i ask is a decreasd price in fuel not by much tho

You're a player with sense. 100% agree with you. For the price, the Pershing packs a nice punch, especially when supported with a cheaper M36. Good bye Panther; good bye Tiger. Balance is fair as far as M26 goes. That being said, I'd like to see a slight increase in population cap values for the rest of Allied armor since it's now easy to flood the field with armor for allies. OKW stands little chance since since fuel is beyond scarce.

IMO

for OKW, the key is abandoning volks => panther transition

and relying on their jagdpz4 which comes at surprisingly good timing. I noticed that solely teching into battle group HQ gives very good result in 1 vs 1 since jagdpz4 will hit the field around the time ally will produce medium armour. Jagdpz4 arguments OKW's lack of proper long range AT capability and when supported by volksgrenadier is relatively secure from enemy armour threat.

And it is hard for any army to reach pop cap unless you are winning by a great margin. So allied armour's pop cap will only have minor impact on ally's MP income imo. Also, is there any ally armour that has significantly lower pop cap compare to other armour? I couldn't really think of at top of my head.

[@theweedfather]

Pershing costs too much fuel for what it does, it should be 200 fuel since it's performance is similar to a panther and not a tiger.

[dubweiser101]

Originally posted by Major Fornax:

Wait,did you say that fuel is scarce for OKW?

Can you read? Yep fuel is scarce for OKW...

[Fornax The Lazy]

Originally posted by dubweiser101:

Originally posted by Major Fornax:

Wait,did you say that fuel is scarce for OKW?

Can you read? Yep fuel is scarce for OKW...

Guess I should not be surprised.

[The Burned Man]

Originally posted by 47:

Pershing costs too much fuel for what it does, it should be 200 fuel since it's performance is similar to a panther and not a tiger.

But it ♥♥♥♥♥ infantry too so it's kind of a Brummbar and a Panther at the same time