request:Nerf Celt Furor Celtica to +10 hp rather than +50%

[Pancake]

Celts are rediculously overpowered in the late game, with their siege spam and wood gathering racial bonus.

They have access to siege rams/onagers and heavy scorpions. Which makes their lives rediculously easy already. Scorpion spam kills fully upgraded paladins, and fully upgraded elepahants and fully upgraded huskarls. Cannons can't take them out fast enough because their reload. Siege onagers with a ludicrous 105 hp, will murder entier lines of fully upgraded mangadui(MOST EXPENSIVE UPGRADED UNIT IN THE FREAKING GAME) and ram tanks in 1 volley. Eagle warriors get massacred by scorpion spam.

They only viable strategy against celt siege spam is counter siege of siege onagers, not just normal onagers BECAUSE CELT SCORPIONS CAN SURVIVE A DIRECT HIT FROM A REGULAR ONAGER/CANON. To make matters WORSE, they fire 20% faster. which means the ONLY viable strategy is to suicide rush with siege onagers or hope for the love of God you have both a mongol and a korean on your team.

lets see how many other races can make siege onagers.

aztec, mongols, saracen, teutons, Koreans.

Well i guess Goths, Franks, Brits, turks, Persians, vikings, huns,mayans, spanish, byzantines, japanese, chinese are out of luck, because nothing they send forward will be able to kill the monstrously overpowered walled up celt

[DarK | Adélie]

Celt exceptional siege is justified as in open maps they are not that good (especially in Castle and Early Imperial Age), plus they got a mediocre archer line and cavalry (no Bloodlines/Plate Barding Armor), thus are not likely to go to that Imperial supremacy stage. And even so, in open maps it's easy to dodge Scorpions and Siege Onager hits with Cavalry/Eagles.

And even so, in BF style maps that you may refer too, you should do everything to not getting a Celt boom anyway, especially if they are in the flank position. It's not like they are OP in all ages. And even even even so, Bombard Cannons (especially turk ones with +HP and +2 range) are an excellent way to counter siege, even their pesky 400 HP Siege Rams.

+40% HP in The Forgotten is a good balance.

[Pancake]

Originally posted by Harald Hardrada:

Celt exceptional siege is justified as in open maps they are not that good (especially in Castle and Early Imperial Age), plus they got a mediocre archer line and cavalry (no Bloodlines/Plate Barding Armor), thus are not likely to go to that Imperial supremacy stage. And even so, in open maps it's easy to dodge Scorpions and Siege Onager hits with Cavalry/Eagles.

Theiy have elite skirmishers and paladins, even without the extra 1/2+ armor, paladins are very strong with 160 hp.. I'm saying late game celts are overpowered, early/mid game their fair game.

Originally posted by Harald Hardrada:

And even so, in BF style maps that you may refer too, you should do everything to not getting a Celt boom anyway, especially if they are in the flank position. It's not like they are OP in all ages. And even even even so, Bombard Cannons (especially turk ones with +HP and +2 range) are an excellent way to counter siege, even their pesky 400 HP Siege Rams.

its not their 400 hp siege rams, its the fact that they can run forward with an unstoppable army of unkillable siege rams/scorpions/siege onagers + fortified walls to block off any harrasment, hell since they get so much wood, they don't even need to make fortified walls, they could just wall with pure siege workshop

[Pancake]

even with + 2 range, cannons fire too slow to kill off 17 rams charging forward, followed by siege onagers (whom they can't individially one shot) that will one shot the cannons + aoe

[TerminallyGrill]

Originally posted by meow:

Celts are rediculously overpowered in the late game, with their siege spam and wood gathering racial bonus.

They have access to siege rams/onagers and heavy scorpions. Which makes their lives rediculously easy already. Scorpion spam kills fully upgraded paladins, and fully upgraded elepahants and fully upgraded huskarls. Cannons can't take them out fast enough because their reload. Siege onagers with a ludicrous 105 hp, will murder entier lines of fully upgraded mangadui(MOST EXPENSIVE UPGRADED UNIT IN THE FREAKING GAME) and ram tanks in 1 volley. Eagle warriors get massacred by scorpion spam.

They only viable strategy against celt siege spam is counter siege of siege onagers, not just normal onagers BECAUSE CELT SCORPIONS CAN SURVIVE A DIRECT HIT FROM A REGULAR ONAGER/CANON. To make matters WORSE, they fire 20% faster. which means the ONLY viable strategy is to suicide rush with siege onagers or hope for the love of God you have both a mongol and a korean on your team.

lets see how many other races can make siege onagers.

aztec, mongols, saracen, teutons, Koreans.

Well i guess Goths, Franks, Brits, turks, Persians, vikings, huns,mayans, spanish, byzantines, japanese, chinese are out of luck, because nothing they send forward will be able to kill the monstrously overpowered walled up celt

Don't let the Celts get to Imperial Age then.

[kreexz]

I was watching a twitch stream a few days ago, BF 4v4, I think it was on voobly with AoC. This celt player controlled the map pretty well with the Hscorp + SO + halbs combo, and basically slaughtered hundreds of war elephants and paladins. When the masses of elephants or paladins came close he just pulled the halbs through to stop them while SO and scorp projectiles just ripped the cavalry to pieces, basically for hours.

[kreexz]

Originally posted by Cuchulainn:

Originally posted by meow:

Celts are rediculously overpowered in the late game, with their siege spam and wood gathering racial bonus.

They have access to siege rams/onagers and heavy scorpions. Which makes their lives rediculously easy already. Scorpion spam kills fully upgraded paladins, and fully upgraded elepahants and fully upgraded huskarls. Cannons can't take them out fast enough because their reload. Siege onagers with a ludicrous 105 hp, will murder entier lines of fully upgraded mangadui(MOST EXPENSIVE UPGRADED UNIT IN THE FREAKING GAME) and ram tanks in 1 volley. Eagle warriors get massacred by scorpion spam.

They only viable strategy against celt siege spam is counter siege of siege onagers, not just normal onagers BECAUSE CELT SCORPIONS CAN SURVIVE A DIRECT HIT FROM A REGULAR ONAGER/CANON. To make matters WORSE, they fire 20% faster. which means the ONLY viable strategy is to suicide rush with siege onagers or hope for the love of God you have both a mongol and a korean on your team.

lets see how many other races can make siege onagers.

aztec, mongols, saracen, teutons, Koreans.

Well i guess Goths, Franks, Brits, turks, Persians, vikings, huns,mayans, spanish, byzantines, japanese, chinese are out of luck, because nothing they send forward will be able to kill the monstrously overpowered walled up celt

Don't let the Celts get to Imperial Age then.

That's like saying "don't play vs the Huns on Arabia then".

[TerminallyGrill]

It takes a high degree of micromanagement skill to mass siege weaponry and to use it effectively. The celts lack high tier archers or cavalry which allows you to counter with your own + supporting units. Furor Celtica has already been nerfed by AoF, and most importantly - siege weapons are very expensive. Harrass the celtic opponents economy, cut of their gold supplies, and they'll have no siege weapons.

[Dugaul]

So this was the tread what nerfed celts?

I am talking about the hp to seige units from 50% to 40%

I call bs you have gone and nerfed a cvi what has one of the worst tect trees in the game and go and nerf there main Strengths.

look at there blacksmith upgrades ffs

Celts even with the great seige lineup get hit hard without Cannon that inself is a nerf the -hp to celtic sige units was a huge mistake.

And shocking to see it only took a 7 comment tread to nerfed the Cvi

[〆Alex0083]

No it's not. They nerfed it in AOFE when they still aren't the offical DLC.

[The Very Hungry Caterpillar]

I think it was a little bit more than a small 7 comment thread that got the Celts hp bonus nerfed.

[AromaticTreeRoots]

I fully disagree with the thread topic.
,plus dont celts NOT get the 3rd teir lumber mill tech? that does reduce their over-all LATE GAME wood gathering ability.

ok , siege onager is not the only counter to mass'd scorpions.. tebuchets 1 shot any other siege units (except rams), yes, trebuchets require micro control to attack units, but theyd be stupidly powerful if they didnt . same with monks.

usually, if you allow an opponent to mass up anything/ any combo, in very late imp age. its going to be hard to counter, expecially in certain situations. so maybe if you can't beat them in less than 2 hours, maybe they deserve to win, ehhehe.. and 50 bombard cannon or 50 terebuchet will counter 50 scorpion and/or siege onager.

and the game is almost always in a situation more complex than UNIT V UNIT

i kinda think siege onager is not designed well anyway, should function as a long range support unit, not a 1-hit-kills-10 units . / its capability to take out its primary counters (paladins/ bobard cannons/trebs.) <----- but celts unique technology doesnt (Change) that dynamic,

EDIT: plus, celts have huge disadvantages. their monastary is weak. their archery range/ techs are weak... their horses dont have bloodlines or 3rd teir armor, so they are relatively weak late game. they dont get bomabrd cannons. . them being good at siege, and have a tech that makes them slightly better at what they already accel at, is not some huge game-breaking bonus.

[Ruinae Retroque Rursus]

If you let somebody snowball a gigantic army of siege onagers you deserve to be smashed.


As others have said, Celts have exceptional siege but rubbishy almost anything else. They need at least something strong, and that's their lategame capability.


Let's also ignore the fact that IRL Celts didn't have much of a lategame - they barely got into the Castle Age....

[Pancake]

this was posted 4 years ago and i was getting my ass handed by siege onager scorpion spam on BF.

At this point idc, don't play AoE 2 much anymore, can't believe someone raised this zombie post back form the dead

[AromaticTreeRoots]

holy cow, didnt even notice it was from that far back

[Masasa]

Originally posted by Meow:

this was posted 4 years ago and i was getting my ass handed by siege onager scorpion spam on BF.

At this point idc, don't play AoE 2 much anymore, can't believe someone raised this zombie post back form the dead

Maybe it's a sign you should get back into the game