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also your bonuses beat that of the holy roman empire. very unrealistic and silly
Why shouldn't AOE get Northamerican factions? They would offer interesting gameplay possibilities. like the Travois. If you don't like Sioux and Iroquois because of the timeframe and/or the fact that they get horses I will understand this but IMHO Sioux without horses is like Saracens without Camels. Furthermorel like I said on top of my article is that anachronism are already part of AOEHD (Gothic Hand cannoneer), so Indians getting horses is in my opinion tolerable. On the other hand, some of the presented civs like the Mississipian Moundbuilders and the Pueblos have a very interesting culture which is completely in the timeframe, offers an interesting culture and also a unique architecture. Here an article about the Mississipian moundbuilders
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mississippian_culture
A guy called Kondrikthus developped even an architecture set for the Missippi culture :
http://kondrikthus.deviantart.com/art/Mississippian-Architecture-Set-Age-of-Empires-2-338494647
Copyright of the picture: Kondrikthus
I already play AOE3, I would only like to see Northamericans in AOE2. Ninjas aren't a civilzation; they're Japanese. They could at best be added as second UU for the Japanese, because splitting up the Japanese civ most likely won't ever happen. Further I would say that they are already Indian factions (mesoamerican) which are better than the Teutons in certain aspects, like the Aztek Monk or the Inca tower push (despite not having BT). Additionaly I would say that the holy roman empire is not the measure for allowed civ boni, only OP- and UPness. If you would make some research about the civs you would see that most of the civ boni fit with the history of the civ. Here some links from Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mississippian_culture
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pueblo
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sioux
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iroquois
heck if i wanted new native american civ, i will look for olmecs, toltecs, totonacs, zapotecs or the civilization of Teotihuacan, but i know that will be redundant because how the game engine works (like aztecs, mayans and incas same model for buldings only one or two unique units, no gunpowder, no horses one unique wonder)
and of course sioux and iroquois are totally out of question, the game end point its in the beggining of the conquest and colonization of america (thats why the conquerors), sioux and iroquois are from around 1700-1800 , thats why they dont belong in aoe2 and thats why they are in aoe3, its like asking for egyptians, greeks and romans civs to be included in aoe2
thats jus nonsence
Building on hills were always easier to defend than houses on the ground, so 100% HP for buildings isn't illogical. On the other hand, we have already civs which have historical inaccurate buildings e.g. the Huns and Mongols(if you don't count their conquered cities) with their stone walls. The Mesos civs would be much weaker, because they wouldn't get any siege units and crucial blacksmith techs like iron casting on the meso side. At least I would say that mud buildings will be part of the AOE world if you have seen the teaser of the new expansion, so Mississipians aren't illogical.
You should start at 2:33 to see gameplay of the new expansion. Watch for the Malian wonder on the left side.
Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2Zig-WIjWc
I would really like some additional meso civ. In the link below, you will see a huge list with civs including some meso ones, which would offer IMO interesting gameplay. Credits of the list go to Dynast.
http://aoczone.net/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=72799
Timeframe of Age of Empires II goes until 1598 (Noryang Point campaign in the Battles of the Conquerors.
Iroquois Confederacy founded before 15th century. Here the proof from Wikipedia:
"Iroquois Confederacy
The history of the Iroquois Confederacy goes back to its formation by the Peacemaker in the 15th century or earlier, bringing together five distinct nations in the southern Great Lakes area into "The Great League of Peace".[2] Each nation had a distinct language within the Iroquoian family, a territory, and a function within the League. Iroquois influence extended into Canada, westward along the Great Lakes and down both sides of the Allegheny mountains into Virginia and Kentucky and into the Ohio Valley"
Sioux are also a possible civ, because they existed before 1598, otherwise they couldn't have struggled with the Cree and Illinois in 1642 (a civ isn't built up in less than 44 years). See this part of an article of Wikipedia about the Sioux in German.
"Geschichte
Jerome Lalemant beschrieb 1642 erstmals das Volk der Sioux, die Ackerbau betrieben und am Oberen See Mais und Tabak kultivierten. Ihre Dörfer waren gut befestigt und sie befanden sich ständig im Krieg mit den Cree und den Illinois. Die ersten Europäer, die mit Sicherheit zuerst auf die eigentlichen Sioux trafen, waren Medart Chouart und Pierre Radisson, die 1661 den Stamm der Ottawa besuchten, die wiederum Besuch von den Sioux erhalten hatten."
Of course they didn't have their summit in the 16th century (they didn't have horses and chemistry), but giving them their summit techs (horses and chemistry) isn't a bigger crime than the other ingame anachronisms, because in the 18th century they had them (unlike the Goths,which could never have used chemical weapons, they could have at least used machine guns from a time machine^^)
ninjas are not just another japanese civ thats like saying mayans like azteecs no. just no.
we dont need american civs we have 3 all ready, and they are all ready in AOE3. plus they suck.
Poor English aside, since I'm not entirely sure if I'm arguing your actual point correctly, you'd be surprised what you can do to have unique meso civs.
Let's use an example as Szaladon linked before.
I'll use Toltecs
Toltecs, A major empire in late Precolumbian Mexico a few centuries before the coming of the Aztecs (800-1250)
A Defensive Civ
Bonuses:
- Repairmen 2x workrate, -33% repair cost
- Skirmishers +2 damage vs. ranged, gaining +2 in Castle
- Architecture free; Masonry Free in Feudal Age. Walls, gates and Palisades benefit.
- Start +100 Stone, +25 Wood
TB: Blacksmiths work 25% faster
Coyote Warrior – Durable, very short range archer with bonus damage vs. cavalry. Slow and weak to missiles.
Stats [Elite]: 70 [85] HP, 9 [13] damage (+8 [13] vs cavalry) 3/1 [6/1] armor, 2 [2] range. Costs 70w/55g
UT1: Tortilla – All food income increased by 15%
UT2: Metallurgy – Provides an additional Blast Furnace AND Bracer to represent the fact that Toltec metalworks were better than the other civilizations of the area and that they likely overpowered much of their opposition
Tech tree:
Disabled Infantry: Elite Eagle Warrior
Disabled Cavalry: Structure
Disabled Archery: Hand Cannoneer, Cav Archer, Parthian Tactics
Disabled Siege: Heavy Scorpion, Bombard Cannon
Disabled Dock: Cannon Galley, Fast Fire Ship
Disabled Blacksmith: Cavalry Armor
Disabled Economy: /
Disabled University: Bombard Tower, Siege Engineers
Disabled Castle: Sappers
Disabled Monastery: Atonement, Fervor
We can already see that this civ is very different. While Mayans and Aztecs have very strong early game aggression, Toltecs are defensive and build into a late game power... one without Elite Eagles, but access to almost everything else. Powerful Siege, Fully Upgraded Arbs and Elite Skirmishers with +1 range/Damage (and Thumb Ring), Powerful Champs and Halbs with 2 more damage and even Galleons with +1 damage/range.
All of this to hide their lack of elite Eagles. That's pretty much the theme of the civ: How strong can a Meso Civ without Elite Eagles be?
This is a very different civ from the Aztecs or Mayans from start to finish, but it would be forgiving and more than acceptable to give them the same voice pack as Aztecs or Mayans.
That said, an expansion revolving around one cultural area is something that almost never sits well with me because it means 1 playstyle will take hold more than another, even if you can be very creative.
Ninjas are n't anything other than japanese spies during feudal japan, which were mostly used in the Iga province. And a single Japanese province, even having been indepent for a short time, doesn't make IMHO a whole new faction, especially if we have other interesting and IMO more interesting civ candidates in North America, South America, Africa and Southeast Asia. The proof if you don't trust me:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ninja
The most important citation of it:
"A ninja (忍者?) or shinobi (忍び?) was a covert agent or mercenary in feudal Japan...mercenaries and spies for hire became active in the Iga Province.."
"plus they suck."
A statement without argument is worth nothing, but I respect your opinion. If you want, you can give me some constructive critic and explain your point.
there is rebel states ruled by ninja who hate everything about samurai
it would be a whole nother ball game for japanese ruled by ninja not samurai, archer bonuses all round.
but back on point we dont need a nato american civ, we got the best o the best aztec and mayans why would they add the ones from aoe3? how would that even work? it wouldnt. a few tents and gunpowerder troops? the hand cannoneers in game are not the same as the ones from aoe3, the ones in game should be utterly useless tbh, fire rate of 2 shots per min and 15% chance to hit anything. but for game play purposes they are a counter unit to massed inf witch is funny because historically they where counter Cav aka paladins,
also your nato americans are terrible compared with the mighty aztec and mayans who fit the game time period perfectly btw.
you have not a empire or anything just a few cheifs and tents.... and the americans who fought them noting special either. compared with the aztec\spanish clashes.
anyway stop giving me wiki links i'll never read and also i would perfer if they added more viking themed civs if anything, but hay i'd take the Portuguese over your nato americans anyday.
Armstrade feels like such a placeholder UT like an extra layer of Chemistry before accessing Gunpowder.
Pons, a translation tool, says that the English adjectiv Indian can be used both for things coming from India and from Native Americans. But if you're confused with the usage of this word, I can change it.
a.)Timeline
Pueblo: 700- 1300 AD
Mississippi: 800-1600 AD
Iroquois and Sioux (Explanation in first text):
Two of the four civs; namely the Sioux and the Iroquois, are on the border (or even outside) of the timeline of Age of Empires II, but I included them for two reasons
1. These are two of the most famous Indian civs
2. It seems me the only logical possibility to add chemistry and cavalry from America. Don’t forget that anachronisms were always part of Age of Empire II (Gothic Hand cannoneers ^^)
Timeline (Sioux): 1500-1800 AD (see German text in commentary 6)
Timeline (Iroquois): 1500-1800 AD (see English text in commentary 6)
If you don't know the official end of the timeline: 1598 (Noryang Point campaign in the Battles of the Conquerors).
Additional Explanation for chemistry and horses for Native Americans:
Of course they didn't have their summit in the 16th century (they didn't have horses and chemistry), but giving them their summit techs (horses and chemistry) isn't a bigger crime than the other ingame anachronisms, because in the 18th century they had them (unlike the Goths,which could never have used chemical weapons, they could have at least used machine guns from a time machine^^)
b.) Which boni are weak? Give me some suggestions, if you have any idea to make them
better.
c.) I will explain you, who Arms Trade work if it wasn't clear enough because of my perhaps too short description
1. Doesn't need chemistry, only Imperial Age and of course a castle and ressources to research it.
2. Effects: Enables you the capacity to build BTs, Elite Cannon Galleons, Hand cannoneers and Bombard cannons. You don't need to research anything; your villager could immediately build a BT without researching anything in the university
3. This makes a huge ressource save, you don't need to research anything in the University or the dock.
PS: The work you did with your 68 civ list is absolutely remarquable if I think how much time it took me to develop (only) four civs.
I play already AOE3, I only played with the idea to add them in AOE2.
Americans (mostly Anglosaxons) not equal to Native Americans (native inhabitants).
See my answer number 9
Adding a new region is IMO always something interesting. How that should work I try to realize through my civ boni, UUs, and UTs. How chemical weapon should work to be historic accurate is not part of the discussion. Beside that, Hand cannons were historical used to counter massed troops and cavalry.
See answer b timeline in this number at Dynast and the answer below.
Having survived for centuries against the racial discrimination of the American settlers isn't remarquable for you? Or even win several battles against the Americans with only, like you said, having tents and chemical weapons through trade (Example: Battle of Little Bighorn)? They were not add for nothing in AOE3 and IMO even having a borderline timeline would be worth to have included in the AOE2 world.
Others civs could be:
-Timurians (1370-1405): Elephant Hand Cannoneer and Elephant Monk
-Rapanuis or Polynesians (300-1722): Fire Archer (Infantry Mangudai)
-Australians (???-present): Infantry Boomerang (Infantry Arambai)
-Marajoara/Amazons (800-1400): Unique Skirmisher snd Slinger
Other possible units:
-Ballista Horse
-Cavalry Condotierro
-Elephant Skimirsher
-Archer with high melee defense
-Hand Cannoneer with anti-cavalry bonus
-Cavalry Organ Gun
-Elephant Organ Gun
Middle Ages USA and Brazil need to be represented!!!