Best civ for defensive, wall up, late game player?

[Peek]

I used to play AOE 3 and I have now made the transition to AOE 2. I'm having trouble picking a civ.

Typically I like to wall up (sometimes 3 thick) build up a full army and attack late game. I don't like doing small annoyance attacks and I don't like rushing.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

[grraf]

Umm the Italians anyone ?!
genovese crosbows vs all mounted units,
20% cheaper handcanons to wreck infantry,
20% cheaper bombard canons to deal from a safe distance with onagers&trebs
condotieros to handle gunpowder along with aztek&mayan eagles/goth huskarl quick flood styles
full hussar&cavalier for dealing with archers/siege/what ever other utility role u need filled
Oh btw theyr age ups are 15% cheaper and this usually translates into being able to at the very least keep up in tech with yr oponent(ideally surpass him by quite a bit)... also theyr tech tree is rather well rounded

[Bodkin Arrow]

Number 6 eredeti hozzászólása:

NIK_F_S eredeti hozzászólása:

Its generally thought as bad because this doesnt work against humans, you wont even get to bombard cannon towers by the time your opponent rushed you, if he gets your economy to take a slight hit and you just dont care and play on his eco is a bit better aince he has less idle time and dead vills, this becomes a snowball effect and with every kill he gets in your eco Ou lag farther behind
He probably ends you by the time he goes castle if you dont attack him yourself

This is the reason its not really useful, against the ai its a different matter as against the ai its possible to play that way, did the vs. 7 achievement the same way

Hm I get your point here. Still I have practised this playstyle for a really long time and early rushers usually dont do that well vs me. Teutons can create crossbowmen as well which helps a lot against pikemen. After the rushers pikemen are down I can still send in my knights. Because of the way the techtree works you can research the first few with nearly only food, after that they will start costing more and start costing gold. With the resource dependent playstyle I'm using I can usually get a lot of techs in in a short time. To counter these rushes you ought to make a lot of barracks/archery ranges/stables so you can produce your units faster. Also I position my castles quite well which means there is nearly no way for my opponent to reach me without passing my castle. I also try and put my 11th or 12th villager on stone mining so I can start building a castle the very second I enter the castle age. The key to doing this properly is villager management. But the truth is it is very hard to play a defensive playstyle vs actual humans. Though I think in due time and practice someone who really feels like he is a defensive player can actually mount a great defense and win the game with it.

I think its cool you are thinking outside of the box and are having fun with it, so by no means I want to take that away from you. However, in my experience your approach is only viable on low skill games or vs AI. Playing overly defensively is very risky as you give away too much map control and your opponent will boom undisturbed. It seems you play some form of Fast Castle into Castle Drop strategy, which at best is achievable at usually around 16 minutes. On open maps vs equaly skilled opponents thats pure suicide unless you are a master of early super efficient walling. Don't get me wrong, I would really like your approach to be as viable as the standard offensive approach, I just have my doubts. Feel free to convince me though, if you have a good replay or some other idea.

[Zerr der Härte 🌟]

What you want is not only a good booming civ with a good university tech tree, but ways to ensure that you come that far.
Incas, Saracens, Byzantines, Malians, Chinese come into my mind. If you 1vs1 or be close to an enemy, it is extremely hard to boom and if you are a pocket player, it doesn't really matter how good your defenses are if you just can boom hard enough. So in cases where it is revelant (having an opponent next to you) you should have a balance of defense techs and early game bonuses, aka. Incas, Chinese or Malians (before the patch).

[Lord Puddington]

The best options have already been mentioned (as well as some others). Originally, Chinese and Byzantium were jacks-of-all-trades with good defensive capabilities, but Chinese didn't have Great Wall tech by then. Mayans and Incans are excelent New World option, probably the best if teamed up together.
Don't forget, however, the Spanish, because in team games their gold bonus is amazing; however, in 1 v 1 they have the fastest builders for that unexpected defensive building, and are the only civ with fully upgradable trash.
Cheers,

[NZL]

for the base game AOE,AOC i like the chineese\mayans for late defence games, but you should also try the persians.. the war ele is kinda op if all your doing is massing special units. forgotten civs i would have no idea maybe the slavs? they get most tech, and teutonic knights on horses, & that tech that makes champs and herbs get splash dammage, but i never liked Teutons or the Byzantines... too much teutonic knights are way to slow (but really strong but really easy to kill with run and hit with archers) and the Byzantines, eco i struggle with everytime
in short, get good with mayans, then switch to chineese.

[NZL]

CANNOLIS eredeti hozzászólása:

Persians have some of the worst walls. Useless. Byzantines/Teutons/Incas have strong walls. So perfect for defensive play.

it isn't all about walls.

[Jarl Axel Svarrson]

I play mostly defencive as Britons relatively well. Wall up with palisades around 14 min (in game time), build spears in feudal and castle fast. Then pump out longbows while getting upgrades and try and get to Imp to get that awesome extra range. Proceed to build Halberds and more longbows aswell as a couple trebuchets, advance after defeating an attack and proceed to wipe them from the map.

[Sephyrias]

Even if there were a civilization with the best walls and unbreakable defense, you'd still lose all the time, when the map doesn't let you wall up completely before the opponent's Knights or Archers arrive to raid your town.

tldr: The map choice for your strat matters much more than your civ choice.

[Jarl Axel Svarrson]

Sephyrias eredeti hozzászólása:

Even if there were a civilization with the best walls and unbreakable defense, you'd still lose all the time, when the map doesn't let you wall up completely before the opponent's Knights or Archers arrive to raid your town.

tldr: The map choice for your strat matters much more than your civ choice.

Its fairly easy to palisade during/before clicking up to Feudal on most if not all maps.

[Sephyrias]

Jarl Axel Svarrson eredeti hozzászólása:

Its fairly easy to palisade during/before clicking up to Feudal on most if not all maps.

Palisades are gone in a matter of seconds when the opponent comes with Castle Age units. Against those, you need stone walls, but you won't have enough time for that on maps that don't assist your walls with terrain.

[Jarl Axel Svarrson]

Sephyrias eredeti hozzászólása:

Jarl Axel Svarrson eredeti hozzászólása:

Its fairly easy to palisade during/before clicking up to Feudal on most if not all maps.

Palisades are gone in a matter of seconds when the opponent comes with Castle Age units. Against those, you need stone walls, but you won't have enough time for that on maps that don't assist your walls with terrain.

Build some archers/crossbows/longbows and put houses behind the palisades to repel attacks.

[Zerr der Härte 🌟]

Jarl Axel Svarrson eredeti hozzászólása:

Sephyrias eredeti hozzászólása:

Palisades are gone in a matter of seconds when the opponent comes with Castle Age units. Against those, you need stone walls, but you won't have enough time for that on maps that don't assist your walls with terrain.

Build some archers/crossbows/longbows and put houses behind the palisades to repel attacks.

If you do that, you give away map control AND economic advantage

[Jarl Axel Svarrson]

Zerr der Härte 🌟 eredeti hozzászólása:

Jarl Axel Svarrson eredeti hozzászólása:

Build some archers/crossbows/longbows and put houses behind the palisades to repel attacks.

If you do that, you give away map control AND economic advantage

This is one of the problems i have with most RTS's. They often dont have great support for defencive stratagies.