No Humanity System - Why Play Anymore?

[FITY]

Now that BATTLEGROUNDS has released, why should I waste 3-5 hours gearing up for the same PVP experience? Because that is all Dayz is now.
What made Dayz special was the bandit skin / hero vest system, so everyone would know who is a KOS killer and who is a killer of bandits. I have spent 2000+ hours in the mod and almost the same in the standalone. Some of that time I was an admin to help protect my players from cheaters. Its just not special anymore when everyone looks the same. The standalone version has devolved into pure PVP, with no reason to trust or help fellow survivors anymore.
Nothing has ever matched the thrill of hunting bandits and knowing I can kill them for + humanity. And knowing I was protected from small arms fire with the hero vest made it a pleasure to interact with a random survivor, I am sad that the father of survival games is now just another game in a sea of survival games.
(But remove the bloodbag for + humanity because that was abused.)

I would love to know what everyone thinks about this. Thanks!

[Shiney Squirrels]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Pickled:

...This is meant to be the "anti game"....

And people like being the Antihero.... it's easier to kill and destroy... then to live and let live.

It's just a shame... the AI's lack of ability to do nothing more then kill is programed... the other players have no other excuse then.... 'because it's fun to"

Also I agree with this:

Diposting pertama kali oleh BlazeMcNight:

I bought DayZ as a survival game.

Not a gear up and hunt people game.

That's what Arma... PLAYERUNKNOWN'S BATTLEGROUNDS... CS:GO... and other games are for... why just lump this game into the same group by playing it that way?

[Punisher]

Diposting pertama kali oleh FITY:

Its just not special anymore when everyone looks the same.

Beards will come. It will be an indicator how long you survived. It is a survival game.
Soft Skills will come. You will benefit in this when you survive.

Diposting pertama kali oleh FITY:

Nothing has ever matched the thrill of hunting bandits and knowing I can kill them for + humanity.

This is not the trump world (good vs evil).
Human nature is infinitely more complex than this.
You want be a hero? You have to deal with the complexity of the real humans.

[FITY]

Thanks people for the input!

@Pickled You still don't understand the mechanics of DayZ Mod - there is no conforming to anything, the PLAYERS' CHOICES determined the outward appearance of the character. Then the appearance was a visual cue to the others of the choices that player had made. You are always free to chose your playstyle.

[Pickled]

I do get what you are saying but am saying that the whole idea of being able to recognise characteristics of a toon as an indication of their past actions and hence your ability to kill them and "feel" good because they where obviously a 'bandit" is silly at best :)

[Nina]

Personally I did not find the humanity system very useful in the first place.

1. If two neutral survivors met, they were likely new-spawns and far more often than not they would try to kill each other for the same reasons people kill each other in the Standalone; Uncertainty.

2. If you saw a bandit there was no incentive to not shoot them regardless of what your own alignment was. Bandits were not friendly to each other, they would also kill other bandits as they were an obvious threat. (And good bandits could get a neutral/hero status by accident.)

3. If a neutral survivor and a hero met, the hero is left practically defenseless as they're heavily discouraged from shooting at neutrals even if they are clearly acting suspicious/hostile (talking in chat/voice, ignoring communication) or they would lose their hero status. If the neutral survivor has already decided he's going to be a bandit, he has a big advantage/incentive to kill the hero.

4. Even with the humanity system in combination with a server-wide chat, people would (at least from personal experience) almost always kill another player on sight, with the rare exception of a friendly survivor and a hero. The only time it never happened was when people didn't have guns yet, because you couldn't even punch.

[EKV]

pure pvp? id say at least 50% of people ive met in last 2 months (thats the time i own thos game for) have been friendly and havent shot on sight. maybe try to play on servers like DUG where you can actually "hunt" for specific players, not having everyone kos and actually making connections with groups/people. i liked the humanity system in the mod but dont know how that would work here since i still prefer having all these different clothes rather that having like 5 skins like in the mod

[Z-40]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Punisher:

Diposting pertama kali oleh FITY:

Its just not special anymore when everyone looks the same.

Beards will come. It will be an indicator how long you survived. It is a survival game.
Soft Skills will come. You will benefit in this when you survive.

Diposting pertama kali oleh FITY:

Nothing has ever matched the thrill of hunting bandits and knowing I can kill them for + humanity.

This is not the trump world (good vs evil).
Human nature is infinitely more complex than this.
You want be a hero? You have to deal with the complexity of the real humans.

Beards will come,announced in 2014,released ? Not yet.

Beards will come,they will!

[Speedbump]

The bandit/hero system was hugely flawed. That would be pretty much the only thing that could make me uninstall aDayZ until mod support is given to take it out.

[FITY]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Nina:

Personally I did not find the humanity system very useful in the first place.

1. If two neutral survivors met, they were likely new-spawns and far more often than not they would try to kill each other for the same reasons people kill each other in the Standalone; Uncertainty.

2. If you saw a bandit there was no incentive to not shoot them regardless of what your own alignment was. Bandits were not friendly to each other, they would also kill other bandits as they were an obvious threat. (And good bandits could get a neutral/hero status by accident.)

3. If a neutral survivor and a hero met, the hero is left practically defenseless as they're heavily discouraged from shooting at neutrals even if they are clearly acting suspicious/hostile (talking in chat/voice, ignoring communication) or they would lose their hero status. If the neutral survivor has already decided he's going to be a bandit, he has a big advantage/incentive to kill the hero.

4. Even with the humanity system in combination with a server-wide chat, people would (at least from personal experience) almost always kill another player on sight, with the rare exception of a friendly survivor and a hero. The only time it never happened was when people didn't have guns yet, because you couldn't even punch.

@Nina
Thats a pretty good summary, but you forgot something:

5, If a survivor shoots you first, you can kill them with no humanity penalty.
That combined with the protection of the hero vest made it a lot easier to walk up to a survivor. If there was some system like that put into the standalone, maybe there could be more interaction.

[FITY]

@Funky Zsasz
Your satement gives me some hope, but it hasn't been my experience. In the last year or so all I have gotten is shot first, or chased down the beach by another fresh spawn. Maybe the majority of veteran players are holding out for a finished game or maybe you tube videos are having a big influence on new players? I don't know but it feels like things have changed.

[Nina]

Diposting pertama kali oleh FITY:

@Nina
Thats a pretty good summary, but you forgot something:

5, If a survivor shoots you first, you can kill them with no humanity penalty.
That combined with the protection of the hero vest made it a lot easier to walk up to a survivor. If there was some system like that put into the standalone, maybe there could be more interaction.

I didn't forget it, I specifically mentioned that the hero can't shoot first.

That said, is it okay for a player to get passive damage reduction? I don't think so.
I can't think of a way to implement it in a way that makes it clear to other players.

[Speedbump]

Diposting pertama kali oleh FITY:

Diposting pertama kali oleh Nina:

Personally I did not find the humanity system very useful in the first place.

1. If two neutral survivors met, they were likely new-spawns and far more often than not they would try to kill each other for the same reasons people kill each other in the Standalone; Uncertainty.

2. If you saw a bandit there was no incentive to not shoot them regardless of what your own alignment was. Bandits were not friendly to each other, they would also kill other bandits as they were an obvious threat. (And good bandits could get a neutral/hero status by accident.)

3. If a neutral survivor and a hero met, the hero is left practically defenseless as they're heavily discouraged from shooting at neutrals even if they are clearly acting suspicious/hostile (talking in chat/voice, ignoring communication) or they would lose their hero status. If the neutral survivor has already decided he's going to be a bandit, he has a big advantage/incentive to kill the hero.

4. Even with the humanity system in combination with a server-wide chat, people would (at least from personal experience) almost always kill another player on sight, with the rare exception of a friendly survivor and a hero. The only time it never happened was when people didn't have guns yet, because you couldn't even punch.

@Nina
Thats a pretty good summary, but you forgot something:

5, If a survivor shoots you first, you can kill them with no humanity penalty.
That combined with the protection of the hero vest made it a lot easier to walk up to a survivor. If there was some system like that put into the standalone, maybe there could be more interaction.

That vest does ♥♥♥♥ all against rifles now doesn't it? And it doesn't help at all if you get shot in the head. Same with the "if you get shot first you lose no humanity" bit, if you get face ♥♥♥♥♥♥ by a 7.62 round because you couldn't shoot first, or minced by an LMG, well that was the systems fault.

[Плюшка Мохнатая]

> Its just not special anymore when everyone looks the same.
ahahaha, ohhh school boooooiiiiiiiiiiiiiii

[FITY]

@Nina
I was just metioning that for the ones here who didn't play the mod. The damage reduction is not fair ai all but is a mute point now since vests are easily found.

My personal opinon of being identitfied as a bandit or a hero as involves taking responsibilty for your actions, or owning up to your actions and the ghille suit was a wussy move, but kind of necessary to snipe from the hill in Electro.
I knew bandits that were pround of thier bandit skin and worked hard to keep it, as it wasnt that easy, because of the point system, it was easy to lose your skin if you died too much and didnt keep killing. It was hard - I tried it myself. The bandits on my servers just wanted to be safe from cheaters like everyone else, back when it was really bad, before the third party anti-cheat tools started to be available. I would say 90% of our players had a real love of the game and it made a great community where everyone was okay with others playstyle choices, no hate.

That brings me to: global chat, which was used on a lot of the servers I played on to out the bandits and report locations to the rest of the server. But global chat is totally un-immersive and the game is a better simulation without it.

I understand there are plans to do something with the face /facial hair, but is that going to be noticable from a distance? I think if you get too close to a uinscrupulous character, by then it will be too late and then you are dead.

Perhaps I should have made the title of this post: If there is no benefit to being friendly, why should I be friendly? Because no one is being friendly to me, and thats just PVP. Maybe I should just shut up and wait to see who is still playing when the game is done being built?

[FITY]

@Rick Mason
Correct, headshots are a 1 shot kill, but that was the risk you took to be Mr. Hero in Cherno.