what is exactly Denuvo and why are people upset?

[jcalof]

im debating to purchase as it does have denuvo but a pc is much better at holding fps and i did buy a gaming rig so would i have great specs for this on a ryxen 3600x with a geforce rtx 2080 TI i would think? My ps4 version stutters but is this capable of using my ps4 controller? i never really game on my pc except for detroit become human

[Kaldaien]

Originally posted by Mrbud420 💩:

Kaldaien is a douche. He is so pro-drm that no amount of proof or evidence will away him against his beloved Denuvo. You can check my profile and see how many games I have I am no pirate but the first thing I do when I buy a Denuvo ridden game is crack it.

Yes I crack my legally purchased Denuvo games because I don't want to deal with stupid online checks and low fps/microstuttering. Kaldaien's makes his dumb ass patches not work if they notice denuvo is missing.

You are laughably misinformed. I don't make them not work, they don't work all on their own. I check the validity of SteamAPI, I don't give two @#$%s if Denuvo is there and valid because I don't have tens of thousands of lines of code tied to Denuvo like I do SteamAPI.

The only connection is that pirated games use fake SteamAPI and you will hit my check and receive a warning telling you to disable Special K's SteamAPI features and not bug me trying to get support for your non-standard version of the game.

You are comically misinformed, but that was good for a laugh and I thank you for that :)

[Kaldaien]

For even more context why this amuses me, here's the source code for the crazy guy's theory.

https://gitlab.com/Kaldaien/SpecialK/-/blob/0.10.xdr/src/imgui/EULA.cpp#L348-359

How you get any of what he just claimed from that :shrug:

[jcalof]

i used death stranding offline ethernet cable was unplugged it works fine only for testing

[jcalof]

i know i played this game like 12 times on ps4 but why would it not care about copy protection offline entirely

[CheeseBoar]

Originally posted by jcalof:

i used death stranding offline ethernet cable was unplugged it works fine only for testing

Until you need to validate the files, sure, it'll work fine. But it won't last forever that way.

[Kaldaien]

Denuvo actually never validates anything.

It doesn't care whether anything is changed (thankfully, or it'd be very mod unfriendly). What actually happens is the activation expires because the Steam store's crypto sessions are only good for 2 weeks at a time.

That 2 week thing has been a relict of Steam's DRM since day one :-\ It used to affect games using the client-side Steam DRM, but Valve patched that out in ~2013. It's still very much a part of Steam's server-side DRM.

[CheeseBoar]

Originally posted by Kaldaien:

Denuvo actually never validates anything.

It doesn't care whether anything is changed (thankfully, or it'd be very mod unfriendly). What actually happens is the activation expires because the Steam store's crypto sessions are only good for 2 weeks at a time.

That 2 week thing has been a relict of Steam's DRM since day one :-\ It used to affect games using the client-side Steam DRM, but Valve patched that out in ~2013. It's still very much a part of Steam's server-side DRM.

I'm curious, then, why do you have to go to a Denuvo website if your validation runs out and you have to manually redo everything? Even Irdeto's own Denuvo FAQ says this in the Application License Management section:

"Our technology controls and restricts usage of copyrighted works and games. With the unique anti-piracy solution for commercial Windows Applications, for B2B software, the technology features comprehensive license management capabilities for any application.

With all digital licenses handled globally via hosted secure software and a web Application (SaaS), it frees developers from complex software and hardware management."

That certainly sounds like DRM that needs to validate files. Even if it isn't on a technical level, if it exists for the same purpose, then it might as well be the same thing.

[Kaldaien]

It's because Steam's DRM is being used by Denuvo's servers. They start a crypto session once they've validated you're logged in to Steam and who you claim you are. They're not validating your files, it's your identity that's in question.

Also Denuvo has a DRM service unrelated to Denuvo anti-tamper, it's important not to get the two things confused. If you go on to that page and start reading things, they're talking about multiple different products. Should hopeuflly become more evident when you see the bullet points for optical media pressing services.

[Bitwolf]

I do wish the "only Pirates want it out!" thing would stop, I pre ordered death stranding over a month ago, I payed for my copy. I don't want another point of failure within my games. It also stopped me from playing MGSV when my internet went out, cause steam wasn’t in online mode.

[Talon Rose]

Originally posted by Kaldaien:

Originally posted by jcalof:

im debating to purchase as it does have denuvo but a pc is much better at holding fps and i did buy a gaming rig so would i have great specs for this on a ryxen 3600x with a geforce rtx 2080 TI i would think? My ps4 version stutters but is this capable of using my ps4 controller? i never really game on my pc except for detroit become human

It's an anti-tamper solution that moves the game's DRM off of the local machine and instead handles it in the cloud. It's unfortunately got a side-effect of requiring you to connect to the Internet once every 2-4 weeks to re-do the cloud-based DRM check.

Other than that, 99% of things you hear about it are fabrications.

False.
As always.
"99%".

So the *myriad* of videos in the internet, demonstrating performance losses, longer loading times and stability issues are all...what? Fake? Staged?
I wish you kept to tinkering with your toys instead of trying to protect this garbage product. One's cute, the other is actively harmful.

[Kaldaien]

Go away, troll.

[Floydfire]

Originally posted by Kaldaien:

Go away, troll.

He's not really trolling, you can check on youtube to see how many test are made with denuvo, i've bought the game, so don't go "only pirates want drm to ♥♥♥♥ off" cause it's not true, DMC5 was one example that also had Denuvo on it (they made it denuvoless by mistake) and in not high end hardware you could see the difference in performance. I had fx8350 and nvidia 1050ti at the time and without denuvo i was able to gain an average of 10fps. So maybe Denuvo doesn't impact people with Top Tier hardware that doesn't really feel the weight of Denuvo, but it can impact people that BUY the product (since pirates nowadays have it harder to play a denuvo game, which means they most likely never really play it soon enough) and don't have a top tier hardware. And that can be the difference between an happy customer or a sad and angry one. And for most of the time, when a drm get cracked, the drm is more an issue for those that bought the product than the ones that pirated. I can see why it's needed, but it's sad that the DRMs really protects only the one that sells the product when it works (damaging the user experience) and when it doesn't work it doesn't even protect it.

[Kaldaien]

Originally posted by Floydfire:

Originally posted by Kaldaien:

Go away, troll.

He's not really trolling, you can check on youtube to see how many test are made with denuvo, i've bought the game, so don't go "only pirates want drm to ♥♥♥♥ off" cause it's not true, DMC5 was one example that also had Denuvo on it (they made it denuvoless by mistake) and in not high end hardware you could see the difference in performance. I had fx8350 and nvidia 1050ti at the time and without denuvo i was able to gain an average of 10fps. So maybe Denuvo doesn't impact people with Top Tier hardware that doesn't really feel the weight of Denuvo, but it can impact people that BUY the product (since pirates nowadays have it harder to play a denuvo game, which means they most likely never really play it soon enough) and don't have a top tier hardware. And that can be the difference between an happy customer or a sad and angry one. And for most of the time, when a drm get cracked, the drm is more an issue for those that bought the product than the ones that pirated. I can see why it's needed, but it's sad that the DRMs really protects only the one that sells the product when it works (damaging the user experience) and when it doesn't work it doesn't even protect it.

Yes, he's really trolling. I deal with that guy attacking me constantly. How you can sit there and clam otherwise is mind boggling. I don't go and do that to people, and if I did, you could rightly call me a troll too.

[Bitwolf]

Well, at least this one runs offline, I still hate how it blocked me from playing my genuine copy of MGSV when I had nothing else to do. Now im wary of any and all denuvo games. Shame the pirates copy worked just fine offline.

[Bitwolf]

Originally posted by Floydfire:

Originally posted by Kaldaien:

Go away, troll.

He's not really trolling, you can check on youtube to see how many test are made with denuvo, i've bought the game, so don't go "only pirates want drm to ♥♥♥♥ off" cause it's not true, DMC5 was one example that also had Denuvo on it (they made it denuvoless by mistake) and in not high end hardware you could see the difference in performance. I had fx8350 and nvidia 1050ti at the time and without denuvo i was able to gain an average of 10fps. So maybe Denuvo doesn't impact people with Top Tier hardware that doesn't really feel the weight of Denuvo, but it can impact people that BUY the product (since pirates nowadays have it harder to play a denuvo game, which means they most likely never really play it soon enough) and don't have a top tier hardware. And that can be the difference between an happy customer or a sad and angry one. And for most of the time, when a drm get cracked, the drm is more an issue for those that bought the product than the ones that pirated. I can see why it's needed, but it's sad that the DRMs really protects only the one that sells the product when it works (damaging the user experience) and when it doesn't work it doesn't even protect it.

While I agree that lack of denuvo can improve performance, Id say Kaldaien has more of a right than anyone to be pissed at pirates, considering they come to him in droves when his mods don't work with their cracks.