HDR10 PQ or hdr10 srgb?

[UncleZedz]

Whats the difference between them, thanks.

[PainDoesntExist]

Basically, the first HDR option uses a 10:10:10:2 framebuffer

10-bit red / green / blue 2-bit alpha (not important)

The second HDR option (scRGB) uses a 16:16:16:16 framebuffer

16-bit red / green / blue / alpha

HDR10 scRGB (16-bit)
is higher quality; 16 is larger than 10 :slight_smile:
is floating-point; it suffers less visible banding artifacts
is based on Rec709 / sRGB color primaries, so well suited for consumer displays

HDR10 PQ (10-bit)
uses half as much memory as scRGB
… can’t think of anything else good about it :stuck_out_tongue:
The PQ in this mode refers to Perceptual Quantization, it is a form of gamma used in HDR.

Both of these formats eventually have PQ applied to them.

“HDR10 PQ” pre-encodes the image using PQ gamma
“HDR10 scRGB” renders the image without gamma and the driver applies PQ
In the end, the 16-bit scRGB HDR mode should be your goto for higher quality. It might incur a couple % more GPU load than the inferior 10-bit mode.

Technically, scRGB gets converted to HDR10 before your display gets a signal, but results are better if this conversion is from 16-bit color to 10-bit.

[Branch Off Bush]

i use hdr scrbg with the default settings from the game that it has the paper whites and all that set to. Game looks phenomenal. And in areas of the desert in the badlands its's super bright almost like ray tracing is trying to brighten the scene because the sun is bouncing light off the sand.

[Kaldaien]

引用自 PainDoesntExist：

HDR10 PQ (10-bit)
uses half as much memory as scRGB
… can’t think of anything else good about it :stuck_out_tongue:
The PQ in this mode refers to Perceptual Quantization, it is a form of gamma used in HDR.

scRGB is linear, so the difference between 16-bit FP linear and 10-bit UNORM non-linear (PQ) is less than you'd think. There's 1 extra bit of mantissa in FP16 (11-bit mantissa), but the fact that the scale is linear dedicates a lot of the precision to the SDR (0.0 - 1.0) range :-\

[Massey08]

I came to see what the difference was here, just to make sure that my 8-bit w/dithering on HDR mode could be more compatible with one setting or the other. One thing I would like to remind everyone here of though, is the law of diminishing returns.

Color bit = 8 or 10 or potentially 16 bit as some claim (Never heard of it myself)
2 = number of options (binary, 0 & 1)
3 = number of primary colors

for 8 bit color we have 2^8^3 = 16,777,216 shades of color

for 10 bit color we have 2^10^3 = 1,073,741,824 shades of color

in the case of 16 bit, it's about 281 trillion colors.

after you pass 8bit into 10bit it becomes clear that there is a strong dropoff of effectiveness per shade added.

8bit w/dithering, to my knowledge, adjusts layers of lighting in the screen to simulate 10bit color. Even with this discount 10bit setting, I'm able to enjoy the display moreso than 8bit because issues with contrast and brightness are reduced. (lights don't blind out certain color blends as much, i.e. clouds are clearly divided from sunlight and the sky. Also fog isn't as blindingly thick with HDR on)

In the event that some of you have issues with display darkness when switching to HDR, try adjusting your screen brightness with Windows HDR color brightness scale, combined with using your screen's built in contrast and graphics software contrast to adjust it to your liking. I suggest a slightly lesser "Brightness" value and higher contrast, but thats my personal preference.

[Kaldaien]

The 16-bit color format is floating-point, so the number of colors is not 281 trillion :)

It's more akin to 11-bpc (8.6 billion) with 4-bit decimal precision for blending colors together. Funny enough, scRGB supports negative colors, if you were wondering what the remaining 1-bit was for :)

[Massey08]

引用自 Kaldaieℵ₀：

The 16-bit color format is floating-point, so the number of colors is not 281 trillion :)

It's more akin to 11-bpc (8.6 billion) with 4-bit decimal precision for blending colors together. Funny enough, scRGB supports negative colors, if you were wondering what the remaining 1-bit was for :)

Thanks for that, I really just wanted to point out how absurd it would be to have 16bit color and sacrifice performance to achieve it. Also, I wonder if scRGB is sRGB, which appears to be synonymous with 8bit with dithering. (From what I gather srgb hdr seems to not be true HDR, and lacks the same array of colors). On my screen it seems to make no difference either way, but I'll try scrgb for now.

Also thanks for that little fun fact on negative colors. edit: My initial impression of the added 1 bit that you mentioned earlier in this thread was that it was reserved for a similar function like dithering, but the idea that negative colors exist on srgb is pretty awesome. I skimmed over it but I did see that you clarified the 16bit color mentioned earlier on.

[Kaldaien]

scRGB is a combination of sRGB and HDR. The color primaries are the same as sRGB, gamma is not.

sRGB is the white inner triangle here

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/46/ScRGB.svg

Literally everything outside of the colored part of that image is imaginary colors. They designed it that way so that SDR content could be displayed in HDR without having to do colorspace correction. You can draw straight lines between the points of those triangles, and they're the same scale in all directions.

Rec 2020, on the other hand, requires complicated color correction.

[Khal-Doso]

Hello, I have the samsung neo qled 43, I wanted to know what values ​​to put on white paper and color mapping.