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Dota 2 >  Workshop > Nye's Workshop > Dota 2 Horde Mode > Discussions
Dota 2 Horde Mode
Description Discussions163 Comments1643 Change Notes
Diellan  [developer] Mar 5, 2016 @ 9:54am
v1.12 Discussion
Feedback or bugs specific to this particular version can go in the replies here.

1.12
Feature:
BETA FEATURE: BUILDING UPGRADES!
-- There is a new consumable item in the store, called "Building Upgrade".
-- Using this item on a tower will increase the building's level up to 10.
-- Towers have abilities that are gained as it levels
-- If a building cannot be upgraded (either due to being max level or not a tower), it will be healed

Heroes:
// Batrider
-- Enabled!
-- Increased damage and duration of Flamebreak DoT
-- Reduced cooldown and mana cost, and increased cast range of Flaming Lasso
-- Increased damage of Flaming Lasso aghanim's scepter
// Bloodseeker
-- Enabled!
-- Increased damage and reduced cooldown of Blood Rite
-- Thirst now grants flat damage and movespeed bonus per level
// Brewmaster
-- Enabled!
-- Changed recharge and mana cost of Thunder Clap
-- Changed recharge of Drunken Haze
-- Increased damage of Earth and Fire abilities
// Centaur Warrunner
-- Reverted the radii of his abilities back to vanilla
-- Reduced the damage dealt by his ultimate
// Clockwerk
-- Enabled!
-- Reduced duration and increased damage on most abilities
// Crystal Maiden
-- Fixed bug with Arcana Aura not giving her any mana recovery
// Earth Spirit
-- Enabled!
-- Increased damage of all his abilities
-- Reduced cooldown on several of his abilities
// Huskar
-- Enabled!
-- Capped Life Break damage to 2000 (3500 with scepter)
// Mirana
-- Reduced cooldown on Leap
// Necrophos
-- Enabled!
-- Capped Heartstopper Aura damage to 50 per second
-- Reduced Sadist mana and hp regeneration
-- Capped Reaper's Scythe damage to 3000 (4500 with scepter)
// Ogre Magi
-- Enabled!
-- Increased damage of Fireblast
-- Increased damage and reduced mana cost of Unrefined Fireblast
-- Increased damage and reduced cooldown of Ignite
-- Multicast is now 4 levels, of which the first level is granted for free at level 1
-- The first level only turns Ignite into an AoE
// Oracle
-- Enabled!
-- Increased damage and reduced cooldown of Fortune's End
// Slark
-- Enabled!
-- Replaced Pounce with Leap (shared with Mirana)
-- Dark Pact damage increased
-- Essence Shift altered to work on all units, has reduced duration, grants higher agility per rank
// Spirit Breaker
-- Increased movement speed of Empowering Haste
-- Changed Empowering Haste to grant extra speed to Spirit Breaker
-- Removed Empowering Haste's active effect
-- Reduced cooldown and changed damage scaling of Greater Bash
-- Increased radius of Aghanim's Scepter Nether Strike
// Tusk
-- Enabled!
-- Increased damage of Ice Shards
-- Increased damage and radius of Snowball
Items:
Aghanim's Regalia
-- Upgrade to Aghanim's Scepter
-- Made from scepter and two Ultimate Orbs
-- Grants +30 to all stats, +400 health, +300 mana
Building Upgrade
-- Consume on a target building to upgrade it
-- Towers learn abilities up to level 10, is healed if used on it again
-- Other buildings are healed
Dragon Javelin
-- No longer gives increasing amounts of strength and attack speed
-- No longer can hit towers with the extra spears (same as Cleave)
Radiance 2
-- Upgrade to Radiance, using a recipe and a Talisman of Evasion
-- Increases blind percentage and burn damage
Shiva's Armaments
-- Made from Shiva's Guard, Veil of Discord, and a recipe
-- Passive: Aura of -attack speed and -spell resistance
-- Active: Area of Effect movement slow and damage
Vladmir's Cuirass
-- Made from Vladmir's Offering, Assault Cuirass, and a recipe
-- Combines effects of both items
-- Stacks with Vladmir's Offering or Assault Cuirass (or Ring of Basilius or Ring of Aquila)
Last edited by Diellan; Mar 5, 2016 @ 9:55am
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Showing 1-15 of 27 comments
Vaxxvirus Mar 6, 2016 @ 12:36am 
A lot of cool new features! I will list my opinions here.

I suck badly with Batrider but he seemed fun. Get your feedback elsewhere, haha.
// Bloodseeker
Played a few games and he feels awesome.
-- Careful early games with Q can make you last longer in the lane.
-- Dagon with your boosted damage is immensely powerful for farm, I can't pass it up, but found it a waste to get the Death Stone on him. Just get for farming early, upgrade if needed.
-- Late game you are rewarded for being so squishy with large numbers of damage.
-- His E feels very odd and the damage feels useless. The speed might be good but you reach the cap very quickly. It seems like a waste of a level if you get any fast boots.
-- Capable of solo mid as far as I've seen, but that was Easy.
// Brewmaster
-- Will update with opinions when I have multiple games with this hero.
// Centaur Warrunner
-- I think everyone can agree with those simple nerfs.
// Clockwerk
-- Very fun hero to play. My favorite hero.
-- Level E for farming. Q may seem better but in practice its damage is low. Plus E is global, so you can farm bottom from another lane if you micro well, or assist others.
-- W is good for getaways.
-- Q is very weak but it stuns so it may be good for bosses or escapes.
// Crystal Maiden
-- Fixed, yay
// Earth Spirit
-- Same as Batrider. No good but he seems fun. E feels a bit weak.
// Huskar
-- I've played a few and his ult is okay.
-- W is surprisingly weak early and surprisingly strong with high attack speed, putting massive stacks on bosses.
-- Q is pretty good sustain early on. I wanna try it with STR boots.
-- The passive is pretty great for pushing towers. Love it.
// Mirana
-- Seems rewarding and decently balanced. Her ultimate still leaves her weak, though.
// Necrophos
-- Will update with opinions when I have multiple games with this hero.
// Ogre Magi
-- Will update with opinions when I have multiple games with this hero.
// Oracle
-- Will update with opinions when I have multiple games with this hero.
// Slark
-- Strong hero, very good versus strong creeps due to his passive granting high stacks. Building attack speed is wise to make yourself harder to kill through armor by AGI.
// Spirit Breaker
-- He just doesn't scale. The movespeed to damage ratio isn't helping past about 15 minutes.
-- Maybe his standard E having an AoE would help. Maybe a lift on his move speed cap would help. There are a lot of directions you could take here.
--Illusions have the aura from W and Manta makes me clear the map at ridiculous speeds with my clones. Fun but not much worth the price.
// Tusk
-- Will update with opinions when I have multiple games with this hero.

The items are really hard to give opinions on. I still hope to see a blink boot soon and a cheap form of magical lifesteal/sustain. (Urn is okay for this.)

Tower upgrades don't seem worth it, but I need to try it more. I'm always too afraid to lose that much farm early.

Also your patch notes on the Dota 2 client update cut off at "//Oracle"

EDITS:
Updated my Spirit Breaker entry.
Last edited by Vaxxvirus; Mar 6, 2016 @ 1:13am
#1
SiEgE Mar 6, 2016 @ 1:51am 
Not sure if bug or not, but seems that magic resist reducing aura of Shiva's Armament is not stackable with aura from Boots of Intelligence? Saw no effect icon on enemy creeps, or does that magic increasing effect works like Aether lens?
I think it would be better to remove Boots of Intelligence aura and replace it with something else, in that case.

2 Vaxxvirus
Movespeed bonus on E is okay. Considering Q gives +40% damage, its actually ~60 damage, which is way better than, for example, Slardar, who has skill that does +120 damage, but only once per 4 hits, which is actually THE SAME as having plain +40 damage per hit.

Dagon is sweet on everyone. So much burst damage saves the game.. I think it deserves AoE reduction(at 1-2-3 upgrade levels).

Earthspirit is awesome! So mobile! His W has pretty low cd and mana cost. He is definately a lane-only hero. R is kinda weak, when we're up to a late game. Big fire golems just feel nothing when I prolong my ulti on them with all my 6 rocks(even considering I had 2 magic resistance reducing items).

Built Spirit breaker with moonshards only. Bosses were unable to cast or attack, just getting shoved around, getting up the cliffs, dropping down to the river. Permanent stunlock. We we're trying to kill big centaur boss for like a minute and a half, he was able to cast his AoE stun only once. With Legion Commander's buff I had 1008 attack speed, I was also called a MADCOW.
Last edited by SiEgE; Mar 6, 2016 @ 7:42am
#2
Vaxxvirus Mar 6, 2016 @ 2:15am 
Originally posted by We're Under Siege! (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻:
Built Spirit breaker with moonshards only.
You madman. I'm going to do that now.
Last edited by Vaxxvirus; Mar 6, 2016 @ 2:16am
#3
Elnabo Mar 6, 2016 @ 2:16am 
Brew is definitlty strong, a passive crit and evasion is strong and he has a waveclear. So pushing tower is easy for him.

Tusk is my new favorite hero, good wave clear with snowball & shard, a pain in the ass with the sigil, but as someone said elsewhere the punch feel unrewarding.

And I believe SB is good a defending base through heavy cc but nothing more. I play him with Agh/Octarine/Shiva+/Travel/Radiance/AC/Shard and that let anyone clear the creep while they are stunned. (People are not really happy with a SB in hard, and you rely a lot on the spooky skeletons and bounty rune to get cash.
#4
TLP Mar 6, 2016 @ 6:09am 
So what if you get Shiva + Upgraded Shiva + Vlad's AC + Vlad's + AC + Basi + Aquila. With all the auras stacking, would it still be possible to die? :D
#5
SiEgE Mar 6, 2016 @ 7:51am 
Originally posted by TheLiquidPepper:
So what if you get Shiva + Upgraded Shiva + Vlad's AC + Vlad's + AC + Basi + Aquila. With all the auras stacking, would it still be possible to die? :D
basi+aquila+vlads wont allow you to stack them.
Though I just tried Doom with VladsCuirass+Vlads+Lithe boots. This was sweet! That would also do on Antimage(except for Lithe boots part), since his Q greatly benefits from all lifesteal auras.. that strong of an aura is actually a pocket Wraith aura!
Sadly lifesteal wont not stack higher than 32% :(

Upgraded shiva+Vlad's cuirass would be just more than enough to survive forever. Diellan actually made items that grant more than 15-20 armor! tis a glorious day!
Last edited by SiEgE; Mar 6, 2016 @ 7:57am
#6
Diellan  [developer] Mar 6, 2016 @ 9:15am 
VC isn't supposed to stack with Vlads and AC, but I had issues making that happen. So, for the time being... bask in the double auras.
#7
MatureCows Mar 6, 2016 @ 9:49am 
Idk why Necro has been capped.

At max his Aura deals 1.5%.
Too even reach the cap the creeps need to have 50/0.015 = ~3334 Hp
So for a long time he won't be reaching the cap, which makes this limitation seem unnecessary, given that he only deals magic damage and got no physical steroids.

So his lategame is limited anyways.
Killing towers also is nothing he is great at.
The only possible reasoning is bosses. But there are other heroes far superior when dealing with bosses and if really needed, the damage dealt to bosses can be reduced.
#8
Diellan  [developer] Mar 6, 2016 @ 10:39am 
The thing with Necro is that his aura generates no aggro, ignores all resistances (this is a lot bigger deal than you might think), and has a very large area. When I first ran him unchanged, I could ignore bosses entirely because they'd die by the time they made it thru the defending creeps (more so the early bosses than the late ones). There's a reason why Ancient farming Necro was (momentarily, and gamelosingly) popular.

That being said, I'm implementing GetDotaStats so that I can find out which heroes underperform and which overperform, and I'll gladly change things if necessary. As is, most hp% abilities are likely to get capped at some point in the future.
#9
SiEgE Mar 6, 2016 @ 11:03am 
Originally posted by Diellan:
VC isn't supposed to stack with Vlads and AC, but I had issues making that happen. So, for the time being... bask in the double auras.
That feel when it stacks..

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=639606305

Originally posted by MatureCows:
Idk why Necro has been capped.

At max his Aura deals 1.5%.
Too even reach the cap the creeps need to have 50/0.015 = ~3334 Hp
So for a long time he won't be reaching the cap, which makes this limitation seem unnecessary, given that he only deals magic damage and got no physical steroids.

So his lategame is limited anyways.
Killing towers also is nothing he is great at.
The only possible reasoning is bosses. But there are other heroes far superior when dealing with bosses and if really needed, the damage dealt to bosses can be reduced.
1% out of 66666 hp is around 600hp per second. Also, just keep creeps near clift for 100 seconds to kill them all.

Originally posted by Diellan:
The thing with Necro is that his aura generates no aggro, ignores all resistances (this is a lot bigger deal than you might think), and has a very large area. When I first ran him unchanged, I could ignore bosses entirely because they'd die by the time they made it thru the defending creeps (more so the early bosses than the late ones). There's a reason why Ancient farming Necro was (momentarily, and gamelosingly) popular.

That being said, I'm implementing GetDotaStats so that I can find out which heroes underperform and which overperform, and I'll gladly change things if necessary. As is, most hp% abilities are likely to get capped at some point in the future.
That aura does hp removal\pure damage, just make it magic and thats it I guess, or is it way harder than I think?
Last edited by SiEgE; Mar 6, 2016 @ 11:08am
#10
Diellan  [developer] Mar 6, 2016 @ 1:25pm 
Making it do magic damage is actually really easy, because it's already recreated and not the vanilla power (via the handy guys at the Spell Library). I'd rather leave it as is, though, because it's how people are used to the power behaving, and instead tweak Necro in other ways.

One thing I might do is make it so that Scepter increases the max damage. Currently, though, it's a free radiance (with more damage but no evasion).
#11
DankBudd Mar 6, 2016 @ 6:40pm 
having limited movespeed on bloodseeker makes me sad, and the dmg thirst gives is too small to really make a difference, its barely better than skilling stats.
#12
Vaxxvirus Mar 6, 2016 @ 11:14pm 
If we're talking about Necro, just tweak his early numbers. No farm means no aura-slamming-boss-fighting-wave-clearing dead man. I don't know why Sadist took such a nerf but it's pretty worthless from my experience so far. The Death Pulse could just have a bunch more of the skulls. It's too weak, too, though. His ult has a lot of value but not if he can't even walk toward the boss without melting.

also

Originally posted by DankBud:
having limited movespeed on bloodseeker makes me sad, and the dmg thirst gives is too small to really make a difference, its barely better than skilling stats.
I agreed on every point here, honestly.
- Is there a way to allow the % boosts to exceed cap, but not the movespeed from items? E.G. Bloodseeker with Yasha and BoT would be capped on speed with no abilities, but would move extremely fast if his Thirst could boost it past max, but not allowing for stupid speeds with all movespeed items. (522 from items max, THEN + bonus speed)
- Besides that, the damage is inconsequential. Didn't help me farm and didn't help me get around faster. So... The whole point of the ability is to do both of those things, if I understand your goal with it. Maybe instead of damage you'd be better off with something like a weaker nethertoxin. Whatever your decision I kinda think that ability is pointless.
#13
SiEgE Mar 6, 2016 @ 11:29pm 
2 DankBud and Vaxxvirus

Oh come on, guys! I already pointed out that thirst does the same damage as slardar's bash, when "averaged" from 25% chance to 100% chance. Thirst is powerful enough, balancewise.
Last edited by SiEgE; Mar 6, 2016 @ 11:31pm
#14
Vaxxvirus Mar 6, 2016 @ 11:30pm 
Bash also stuns, though.
#15
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