Dota 2
Epic Boss Fight (Discontinued)
GFL Dec 26, 2016 @ 9:45pm
About Last Update ( 26 Dec )
Following the Thread from "Lenard".
I want to say that i agree with his suggestion about

1. "how we can upgrade shoemoney hammer into divine core"
Although most carry( that probably going to buy midas fury for wicked fury ) are useless before NG+ , and they probably play efficiently on using money and purchase midas fury as fast as they can so they can generate money and be not useless in the game before NG+,
not everyone knows that trick, and usually, most carry just spend their gold on damage items.

On the other hand, most mages who can clearly single-handedly dealing late boss starting from nyx until aether before NG+ is probably gonna buy divine core , and it will be helpful if divine core works like midas fury, so that not only carry can be helpful on purchasing midas fury, but mages as well

or tank ( divine armor ? i forgot the name )

2. "Vote system"
i agree that player should be able to see "how many people voting what difficulty"
but more importantly is player should be able what the difficulty is when we are deciding to pick what hero.
It helps a lot, since few of us tend to wait for the other to picks, and knowing what difficulty helps someone to iniate the pick, especially if we play on 3 party / 2 party member

3. "Elite passive"
I like how you made ellite passive, especially on legendary / epic difficulty.
I dont really mind getting the powerful elite passive.
That makes the game is harder, and we need to be more efficiently on reseting / using smoke of deceit so that we have enough lives to actually reset the game if the elites are too powerful

What i suggest is , giving the Extra space for Elite passive there are on the round.
Not only when the boss spawned, because if we play on legendary / epic , there's too many elite with 2 passive each , and it will be better if we can see all 8 boss's 2 passive skills and planned to kill which one first without the needs to actually click the boss 1 by 1 to see the skills first and then figure out which one we should prioritize to kill.

4. "Round Changes"
since 24 dec i think, old round 2 and 3 is now round 3 and so on.
That ruined old strategy for most players
Because the round now is less than the old update, means the gold for that specific round is now lower.
I dont know if it's intended to be like this, i'm just mentioning it here so if it's not intended, at least someone told you about it.

But , as for me , i like how it is now, new update like this means new challenge,
it's harder now, as we need to make most of our gold more efficiently than ever if you try to beat legendary impossible.

It's hard, but it's still doable, as we managed to beat the legendary impossible 7 lives last night ( 26 dec )

But, if we play on 3 lives, i haven't tested yet, but i think it requires a big amount of luck as to get the perfect elite passive each round , which almost makes it's imposible to win ( once again, it's only my opinion )

5. "Epic difficulty"
Thank you for bringing such incredible difficulty, haven't beat it yet for now, but sure will try to beat it soon.
Currently, I haven't think any suggestion yet for this

6. "Game just Stuck Bug"
Last time i play epic boss fight before 7.00 dota is probably 4 - 5 months ago
that time, i can't remember clearly about the bug where this bug appears

but i have a wild guess that 7.00 backpack mechanic, is the cause of this bug.
About backpack mechanic, read point 7, i will explain my experience and why i have that wild guess.

These are my experienced related to this bug :
a. We clear all enemies, no health bar showing boss that we hasn't killed yet, but the game just won't continue. We already killed 2 doom BTW. We waited like 5 min and still no luck.
We even tried to use bloodstone to kill ourselves and hoping the game will reset the round, but also no luck.
b. Enemies still there, we fail to kill them, and all players are dead. But the game wont reset. It just stuck. We already tried buying back, keep trying to kill the round, but we got overpowered. And eventually, all players have no buyback already, but still the game wont reset.
c. map is clear, no more enemy to be found anywhere on the map, it's not an invisible round, i think it's Necro round (i can't remember it clearly).
But the health bar shows that there's 1 boss that we haven't killed yet.
i use axe at that time, so i berseker call all edges of the map, in hoping with my big radius of berseker call , the Bugged necro would accidentally hit me , and i know that he's actually still on the map, but no luck. We just stuck there, can't continue. And we can't use bloodstone because 1 of the player is already DC , so eventho 4 of us use bloodstone, the DC one still alive and DC one doesn't have bloodstone.

My suggestion is, it would be very very helpful if we got a Voting button when we press any key on keyboard ( let's say F5 )
if all remaining players vote to reset manually, the game will give up the round
-1 lives, but the round should be reset. ( keep in mind that there's also a bug where one unlucky player sleep on the floor but he can still use force boots because he isn't actually dead , one way to make that player back on the feet again is to make monster aggro to him , then kill him until he can't use force boots anymore, then the next round he will be back on his feet )

7. "Backpack Mechanic"
a. dota2 has a mechanic where we can't use items on backpack ( i mean we can't click items on backpack )
but on epic boss fight, we kinda have cheats ( the system can revive us when we have rez stone on our backpack , not that we clicked the rez stone, but the system automatically revive us when we got rez stone on our backpack )

b. dota2 has mechanic where we need to wait 6 second before the item can be used when we transfer from backpack to inventory right?
well in epic boss, after i die, i transfer my rez stone to my inventory, and straight used divine core to reset its cooldown, and put it back to backpack before 6s

those 2 are my experiences on backpack mechanic with rez stone, once again it's only my opinion, i can't give any proof to back my wild guessing.

But if it's true, i hope you dont remove the backpack rez stone, instead you made so that Rez stone effect is changed.
when people die, instead of revive immediately, player can decide wether he wants to be revived or not by clicking the rez stone when he's dead.

if the rez stone on backpack, he needs to move it from backpack to inventory first, then wait 6s before he can press the rez stone.
if the rez stone on inventory, he can press the rez stone to revive himself.

8. "Asura Wand"
I dont know if anyone ever bring this up or not.
But, do you know that there's still asura wand? ( not asura staff )
Well i can't find asura sword ( not asura rapier ) since probably 3 - 5 months ago u decided to remove asura wand and asura sword from the game.
But, you can purchase asura wand by buying dimensional core + asura staff + asura wand recipe,
IF it's intended, the display text of asura wand is not the same as the actual damage.
it says you have base damage as 10000000000 damage, while actually u only get 100k damage or something

9. "Midas gold system"
Are we intended to get midas gold if the round ends while we're still dead? ( example : my team kill all monster but i am still dead )
because the text shows midas gold we receive is ( X ) + 0 when you are dead
( although if your team revive you , the +0 changed back to + the gold inteded to be )
Last edited by GFL; Dec 26, 2016 @ 10:00pm
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dopamine hunter Dec 27, 2016 @ 4:00am 
Originally posted by HowToUse:
1. "how we can upgrade shoemoney hammer into divine core"
Although most carry( that probably going to buy midas fury for wicked fury ) are useless before NG+ , and they probably play efficiently on using money and purchase midas fury as fast as they can so they can generate money and be not useless in the game before NG+,
not everyone knows that trick, and usually, most carry just spend their gold on damage items.

On the other hand, most mages who can clearly single-handedly dealing late boss starting from nyx until aether before NG+ is probably gonna buy divine core , and it will be helpful if divine core works like midas fury, so that not only carry can be helpful on purchasing midas fury, but mages as well

or tank ( divine armor ? i forgot the name )
The reason midas was a part of every class' specific path was because it used to basically be a mandatory because it gave team gold as opposed to personal gold, so having it so specific classes of heroes couldn't get midas hammer severely gimped the entire team. This is not the case any more and midas hammer is intended to be a greedy item that comes with risks, the longer you keep the midas hammer, the more gold it will generate, but the longer you're down one slot. The reason Midas Fury gives the passive effect to everyone is because it is a bad item. The upgrade is very cost inefficient and doesn't provide that much compared to Divine Core and Divine Armor; both very good items on their own. 7.00 actually benefited this playstyle as it is quite easy to just keep your midas hammer in the backpack and swap it in 6 seconds before the round ends.

2. "Vote system"
i agree that player should be able to see "how many people voting what difficulty"
but more importantly is player should be able what the difficulty is when we are deciding to pick what hero.
It helps a lot, since few of us tend to wait for the other to picks, and knowing what difficulty helps someone to iniate the pick, especially if we play on 3 party / 2 party member
The first one is more of a quality of life thing and not really necessary, but I do agree it is very important to know the difficulty during the pick phase and it did use to show that but valve broke that and the only way to get it back is remaking the hero selection which I will do one of these days. Having a vote counter might also be a temporary fix to this.

3. "Elite passive"
I like how you made ellite passive, especially on legendary / epic difficulty.
I dont really mind getting the powerful elite passive.
That makes the game is harder, and we need to be more efficiently on reseting / using smoke of deceit so that we have enough lives to actually reset the game if the elites are too powerful

What i suggest is , giving the Extra space for Elite passive there are on the round.
Not only when the boss spawned, because if we play on legendary / epic , there's too many elite with 2 passive each , and it will be better if we can see all 8 boss's 2 passive skills and planned to kill which one first without the needs to actually click the boss 1 by 1 to see the skills first and then figure out which one we should prioritize to kill.
There is no real way to do this neatly, but I could add some kind of "current elites alive" list to the quest dialog, I will see what I can do about this. This is a quality of life thing that I could add rather easily.

4. "Round Changes"
since 24 dec i think, old round 2 and 3 is now round 3 and so on.
That ruined old strategy for most players
Because the round now is less than the old update, means the gold for that specific round is now lower.
I dont know if it's intended to be like this, i'm just mentioning it here so if it's not intended, at least someone told you about it.

But , as for me , i like how it is now, new update like this means new challenge,
it's harder now, as we need to make most of our gold more efficiently than ever if you try to beat legendary impossible.

It's hard, but it's still doable, as we managed to beat the legendary impossible 7 lives last night ( 26 dec )

But, if we play on 3 lives, i haven't tested yet, but i think it requires a big amount of luck as to get the perfect elite passive each round , which almost makes it's imposible to win ( once again, it's only my opinion )
As with all changes, this is just something I have to grind out and play a lot of games with on various difficulties to rebalance it properly.

6. "Game just Stuck Bug"
My suggestion is, it would be very very helpful if we got a Voting button when we press any key on keyboard ( let's say F5 )
if all remaining players vote to reset manually, the game will give up the round
-1 lives, but the round should be reset. ( keep in mind that there's also a bug where one unlucky player sleep on the floor but he can still use force boots because he isn't actually dead , one way to make that player back on the feet again is to make monster aggro to him , then kill him until he can't use force boots anymore, then the next round he will be back on his feet )
These bugs have been the bane of my existence, they never happen in the workshop tools even though I constantly test, so all I can do to fix it are wild guesses. There is a console command (getdunked) to forcekill a player though. I guess I could add some kind some kind of a vote that just force kills every unit on the map for a refresh.

7. "Backpack Mechanic"
a. dota2 has a mechanic where we can't use items on backpack ( i mean we can't click items on backpack )
but on epic boss fight, we kinda have cheats ( the system can revive us when we have rez stone on our backpack , not that we clicked the rez stone, but the system automatically revive us when we got rez stone on our backpack )

b. dota2 has mechanic where we need to wait 6 second before the item can be used when we transfer from backpack to inventory right?
well in epic boss, after i die, i transfer my rez stone to my inventory, and straight used divine core to reset its cooldown, and put it back to backpack before 6s

those 2 are my experiences on backpack mechanic with rez stone, once again it's only my opinion, i can't give any proof to back my wild guessing.

But if it's true, i hope you dont remove the backpack rez stone, instead you made so that Rez stone effect is changed.
when people die, instead of revive immediately, player can decide wether he wants to be revived or not by clicking the rez stone when he's dead.

if the rez stone on backpack, he needs to move it from backpack to inventory first, then wait 6s before he can press the rez stone.
if the rez stone on inventory, he can press the rez stone to revive himself.
Well due to the backpack not existing it just checks if a player has a resurrection stone as opposed to if the player has a resurrection 'buff', so this is a pretty easy tweak.

8. "Asura Wand"
I dont know if anyone ever bring this up or not.
But, do you know that there's still asura wand? ( not asura staff )
Well i can't find asura sword ( not asura rapier ) since probably 3 - 5 months ago u decided to remove asura wand and asura sword from the game.
But, you can purchase asura wand by buying dimensional core + asura staff + asura wand recipe,
IF it's intended, the display text of asura wand is not the same as the actual damage.
it says you have base damage as 10000000000 damage, while actually u only get 100k damage or something
Weird, shouldn't be accessible I'll look into it.

9. "Midas gold system"
Are we intended to get midas gold if the round ends while we're still dead? ( example : my team kill all monster but i am still dead )
because the text shows midas gold we receive is ( X ) + 0 when you are dead
( although if your team revive you , the +0 changed back to + the gold inteded to be )
this is just visual because you don't have the midas buff when dead, but the game respawns you before you get midas gold so it all works fine.

Thank you for the feedback!
Last edited by dopamine hunter; Dec 27, 2016 @ 4:00am
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