Turn-based RTS

[Marfig]

A what?

[never]

Publicado originalmente por Marfig:

Publicado originalmente por DevildogFF:

Many, not just myself, have described Warhammer 40K: Gladius as a turn-based RTS game

What is wrong with "turn-based strategy"? Is that so bad? By the same stick should I name Fantasy General II a turn-based RTS? No base building... but who cares? We can always stretch the meaning of things a little bit more. You'll agree!

"Turn-based strategy" is such a broad term it doesn't really mean much. Civ and Xcom are both TBS but don't have much in common. By saying "turn-based RTS" he narrowed it down to a point where both TBS and RTS players should have a good idea what the gameplay is like. Even though the term is contradicting itself it does deliver the message.

[Vazilii]

Hilarious
So do we have any Real time TBS games I wondered?

[Mr.Kill]

The only possible way I could accept the turn-based RTS is if you really stretched it to mean turn-based Dawn of war. But I mean RTS games have plenty of diplomacy. Empire Earth 2 was all about diplomacy and trading in FFA game. And boat loads more RTS games have diplomacy settings clearly changeable during the game.

[CyMonk]

exactly. stuff like "diplomacy" or "base building" are optional attributes of a game and not mandatory criteria of the genre definitions.

[Tragic]

Publicado originalmente por Vazilii:

Hilarious
So do we have any Real time TBS games I wondered?

exactly... what BS,. RTS has to be real-time.. that is what makes it a realtime strategy game. I get what they are saying about the things you do as a player in the game.. but what groups them is NOT base building, or the combat or any of that,.. the grouping mechanism is that it is real-time.

Saying Gladous is a Turnbased RTS is just fucking stupid.

Publicado originalmente por Mr.Kill:

The only possible way I could accept the turn-based RTS is if you really stretched it to mean turn-based Dawn of war.

yeah.. there was a time a lot more of those game had real-time combats with a over arching "turn based" map... kinda like Total War. Though I would consider these kind of things as completely separate moduals. TW Warhammer is pretty integrated, but DoW is basically a dynamic level select.

PS - Just as DoW was mentioned... Sisters of Battle are in the new 40K Game coming out soon!

Publicado originalmente por never:

"Turn-based strategy" is such a broad term it doesn't really mean much. Civ and Xcom are both TBS but don't have much in common.

So is Starcraft, Dota and DoW2... but they are all RTS. That is why there are these things called sub-genres.

When you group concepts this is how it is done.. broad strokes.. that thin into specifics.

[BobbyBullets]

Publicado originalmente por Tragic:

Saying Gladous is a Turnbased RTS is just fucking stupid.

What if I said always spelling the word does as "dose" is fucking stupid?

Lay off the personal attacks.

I'm not the only person that has attempted to describe GLADIUS in this way, as many of the Discord community and r/4Xgaming community have done the same thing. It's describing the gameplay of what you'd expect from most REAL-TIME STRATEGY GAMES, only it's in a turn-based format. I explained myself well enough.

But Tragic, you've got to cut that personal attack shit out or I'm just gonna be done with you.

[BobbyBullets]

Publicado originalmente por CyMonk:

exactly. stuff like "diplomacy" or "base building" are optional attributes of a game and not mandatory criteria of the genre definitions.

Many people don't feel the need to judge 4X games simply by their adherence to the 4 Xs. If you did that, far too many games would fall into the 4X category.

Starcraft 2:
You eXplore your map.
You eXpand your bases.
You eXploit the resources.
You eXterminate your enemies.

So you're saying Starcraft 2 is a 4X game?

4X games are much more than those simple words. And many people prefer to call them "empire builders", as that's a bit more accurate. But 4X is the name that stuck. That's why Oliver wrote a great rubric on what 4X games *really* are. Most would agree that diplomacy, empire-building, and much more would need to be present for a 4X game to truly meet the understood definition of what you'd expect when firing up a 4X game.

Hell, even PROXY STUDIOS, the DEVELOPERS OF GLADIUS, said that Gladius isn't really 4X in a recent AMA on their Discord and that Zephon was their venture back to a traditional 4X formula and SPECIFICALLY MENTIONED diplomacy as one of the key features.

[Tragic]

Publicado originalmente por DevildogFF:

Publicado originalmente por Tragic:

Saying Gladous is a Turnbased RTS is just fucking stupid.

What if I said always spelling the word does as "dose" is fucking stupid?

Lay off the personal attacks.

I'm not the only person that has attempted to describe GLADIUS in this way, as many of the Discord community and r/4Xgaming community have done the same thing. It's describing the gameplay of what you'd expect from most REAL-TIME STRATEGY GAMES, only it's in a turn-based format. I explained myself well enough.

But Tragic, you've got to cut that personal attack shit out or I'm just gonna be done with you.

It is fucking stupid. just as a bunch of people say it dose not make it any less stupid. A lot of people say the earth is flat.. it is still a stupid thing to say.

You can't say something is like something apart form the very thing that makes it that way. "Water is wet and flows down a hill, but rocks are sorta like water as they also roll down hills"... so lets call it water-rocks... A realtime game has to be realtime.. anyone saying the opposite is misguided at best. How is this even a conversation?

And for the record, saying something is stupid is in no way a personal attack, despite how you took it. I never mentioned anyone and I only spoke of the idea not of an individual. Your inference is not my responsibility.

And.. for the record... it is also ridiculous to say "do not attack people" and in the same exact sentence make fun of my crippling dyslexia that makes it nearly impossible for me to see spelling errors that are not underlined with red squiggly lines as my brain literally can not see the difference even on repeat prof reading. I get it was a joke and do not give a shit, but that is the kind of hypocrisy that seems... . . disingenuous.

[Nasarog]

I'll jump in for a sec. I think if the profanity was dialed back, it would be less of a personal attack...

[Tragic]

yeah.. I do swear a lot in real my real life as well. I try to tone it down on forums but I forget that some people still consider swears as offensive and not just the same as a word like "man" or "ummm" or something. I'll try to keep and eye on that more.

[Nasarog]

Publicado originalmente por Tragic:

yeah.. I do swear a lot in real my real life as well. I try to tone it down on forums but I forget that some people still consider swears as offensive and not just the same as a word like "man" or "ummm" or something. I'll try to keep and eye on that more.

I had to dial back my swearing after my kids were born, but that's not why I said it. Usually, when you use a swear to accentuate your point, it gets taken out of context.

So, we try not to swear.

[wany1981]

Turn-based RTS
hmmm
https://store.steampowered.com/app/294860/Valkyria_Chronicles/

You take turns... you move in Real time and gets shoot real time... and it's strategy game.
Just not a 4X game.

[Martok]

Personally, I consider Gladius a 4x, albeit an entirely war-centric one. But I can easily understand why Rob (and anyone else) might see it as a "turn-based RTS" instead; there are similarities aplenty.

[Nasarog]

Publicado originalmente por wany1981:

Turn-based RTS
hmmm
https://store.steampowered.com/app/294860/Valkyria_Chronicles/

You take turns... you move in Real time and gets shoot real time... and it's strategy game.
Just not a 4X game.

I love this series!!!

[Tragic]

Publicado originalmente por Nasarog:

Publicado originalmente por wany1981:

Turn-based RTS
hmmm : Valkyria_Chronicles/
You take turns... you move in Real time and gets shoot real time... and it's strategy game.
Just not a 4X game.

I love this series!!!

I also love this game series.. but how exactly is it "real time"...

you have a squad face off against another squad... each squad has a turn one after the other... you wait for the entire squad to do their actions, then the next squad has a go.. in your squads turn (round) you use action points on each unit to make unit moves... you can stop, start, select... in any order, to move your units in your turn and even jump between units mid action point spend. There is a overwatch auto fire thing if you move into the radius of a enemy...

So how exactly is that "real-time"... it is 100% a turnbased tactic game.