STEAM GROUP
Steam Client Beta SteamBeta
STEAM GROUP
Steam Client Beta SteamBeta
31,968
IN-GAME
87,438
ONLINE
Founded
January 8, 2013
All Discussions > Beta Feedback > Topic Details
Programmer Joe Dec 8, 2022 @ 10:38am
30
6
3
3
18
Ending support for -no-browser and -noreactlogin
This topic is about command line options in the Steam client. A few advanced users add command line options to change how their Steam client works. If you haven't done so, you can safely ignore this whole subject. For people who do use command line options, and specifically -noreactlogin or -no-browser, we would like to learn what you're using them for. If something isn't working for you without these flags, please reply to this thread and let us know.

As of a recent client beta update we are ending support for the -noreactlogin and -no-browser command line options in the Steam Client. We expect these changes to be released to all Steam users sometime in January 2023. This concludes the journey of replacing an old framework that we began with Steam Chat, continued with the redesign of the Steam Library, and will continue with new features.

Removing these options

The -noreactlogin option was added during the new login UI beta as a way to flip back and forth during testing. This reverts to the old UI and has the effect of disabling login confirmations in the mobile app and QR code login.

Most users who use this option do so because there was a brief window where it was incompatible with -login, and that was not yet supported with the new UI. For those users, support for -login was restored in September.

Less than 1% of Steam users run -noreactlogin, but do not use -login. If you have some other reason for using -noreactlogin, we would love to hear from you. Please reply below and let us know why you're using this option.

An even smaller number of users run Steam with the -no-browser option. We added this option in 2015 when we were working through compatibility issues with SSE2 and SSE3. It disables the "steamwebhelper" process entirely, and with it most of the Steam UI. The store, community, and library tabs in the client stop working. Friends list and chat are disabled. By the end of the current beta period we expect essentially all of the Steam client to require browser support.

If you are a person who typically runs with -no-browser, please post below and let us know why you're using this option. We are not going to support this mode going forward, but we do want to fix any bugs that are causing you to run in this mode.
< >
Showing 166-180 of 3,495 comments
RiO Dec 23, 2022 @ 9:52am 
Originally posted by Felice:
It's just a different skill set that web devs don't seem to be taught or don't usually self-prioritize
The problem is that most web devs aren't taught at all.
Within the software development profession, front-end development is one of the remaining areas that has a very large pool of self-taught developers active. Many from what was originally a web design position and are having trouble grasping further than the basic concepts of a foreach loop or if conditional branch. I knew a guy like that who would just zone out at the mere mention of the words 'class' or 'method' and balked at the notion of having to use source control solutions.

He was genuinely good at design, but the market forces these people to adapt and move into developer positions they are - sorry; cold hard truth - simply not qualified for.

Yet these are the very same people that are the most likely to reach for and grab frameworks like React or Vue, as for them it's simply the replacement for things like jQuery back around the turn of the century when jQuery was still the hip thing. For them - just like with jQuery - it's the lowest common denominator to "do what I want" and get to the finish in as straight a line as possible. And they're not going to be hindered by any form of knowledge of how many eggs they're breaking to make that particular omelet.

And that's why and how you get performance suckers. These people are essentially like cavemen who've just discovered fire; and you hand them nuclear power and expect them to use it wisely.

React is just about the worst of the bunch in that respect too. It's the C++ of web MV* app frameworks. It has so many footguns strapped to it, that it's damn near impossible to finish building anything with it without losing a toe or two to incidental self-introduced performance problems, unless you first internalize entire dissertations on how its updating mechanisms exactly work and are intimately familiar with all its ins and outs and do's and do-not's.

It's the one framework a novice should NEVER be using for production-grade applications cold-turkey. Yet conversely it's the most popular one and as such many novices are drawn to it to make their workload easier. Which - admittedly - it does. But, at the expensive of everyone else's experience with the final product.


Oh and btw. after bringing back up the old days and jQuery.
If you're in for a good laugh, pop open a dev console on the Steam community domain and try this:

> jQuery.prototype.jquery "1.11.1"

Yup. That's fossil gold[security.snyk.io].
Last edited by RiO; Dec 23, 2022 @ 11:07am
RiO Dec 23, 2022 @ 11:30am 
Originally posted by Felice:
I suspect the real problem is that we need to be able to ... I dunno what to call it, so I'll use a term from programming ... pre-compile the UI, i.e. to take the bare html/css and have a program figure out "okay so I can bake all of this stuff into one simple bitmap because it never actually changes" and thereby reduce the memory footprint and/or the rendering time.

That's what browser rendering engines internally already do.
The HTML document tree is not at all the same as the tree used to render the content. A lot of stuff gets merged (or split) based on its layout properties and by heuristics that determine whether it could be subject to particular types of change.

Modern CSS has specialized instructions to drive that splitting logic, for those cases where browsers get it wrong. Which happens, basically, in sporadic edge cases.

The problem with stuff becoming sluggish lies elswhere.

Firstly: JavaScript.
Tons of it and in particular the sick notion that everything has to be a "SPA" (bonus puke points if you actually pronounce it as a spa) with browser-side view-template rendering based on DOM diffing; observable data bindings; and tons more abstractions to plug all kinds of gaps and accelerate development and time-to-market.

Great for silly little small applets; limited-time offers or campaigns; and low-complexity line-of-business apps for form entry. Not so good for big long-term applications with performance concerns.

No; React isn't fast. In fact; all solutions based on virtual DOM have a breaking point where the sheer size of the sub-tree they have to diff starts weighing heavier than just invoking the HTML parser and replacing the entire thing whole-sale.

Case in point; just the other day I did this with a piece of logic that is meant to display mostly passive, non-interactive data. But a lot of it. A big list of items with lots of properties to display.

I kicked out the JS based view template rendering of individual listed items and replaced it with straight up pounding in raw HTML that came in pre-rendered from the server. So yes; HTML-in-JSON; one string of HTML per item in a JSON array. Ooh! Scary and bad, right? Except the end result was 30 times; thirty times faster and consumed a mere fraction of the RAM.


The second killer: animating HTML elements.
Animations are extremely expensive stuff. Browsers can't cope with predicting how or where something will move, unless you're precise about it. Moreover, it can't use hardware-acceleration to make it fast unless you keep to a very limited set of CSS properties to animate. Roughly: those that correspond to not messing with the boundaries of the render tree. (Remember that thing I mentioned before? Document tree != render tree. Here is where that matters.)

That means you can put a 2D or 3D transform on an element. And you can change its opacity. And that's it.
Changing its height? No. Changing its color? No. etc.

It requires very elaborate set-ups to pull of certain types of animation in a hardware-acceleration friendly manner. And most won't bother.
And then there are other types of animation, such as an in-flow fold-out needing to affect height, which basically can't be done wit hardware-acceleration ever.


And then the third killer is related to the second: animated content.
Specifically GIFs and other animated image formats.
Unironically an animated GIF avatar of 40x40 pixels would be several times slower and more resource-intensive to display than a WebM video based avater thrice the size.
Yes. Really. Not a joke.

But even then; you're supposed to do this stuff sparingly, because it can still place quite a load on a GPU to have to decode 20+ animated pieces of content simultaneously. Much heavier than hardware-assisted decoding of one Full-HD resolution movie clip, even. And e.g. Steam uses a lot of these things. Which taxes your system quite a bit.


The last one, and one of the more important ones:
the sheer size of the document that is loaded. Nothing kills a browser engine dead with more speed than a huge document tree and an infinite scrolling timeline. (Case in point: Reddit. Open 5 or 6 tabs and listen for your fans to spin up to full blast.)
But they're hip and engaging; so you've got to have that, right?
No matter that it makes the entire thing tank and stutter once you've scrolled down 5 desktop screen lengths due to the sheer volume and density of data smushed into that poor browser's face to handle...

And of course if you want double-the-money; double-the-fun, then pair #4 with #1 and client-side virtual DOM diffing of that entire thing kicking in with each mutation of the data and each additional 'page' loading and being appended when you scroll down far enough. Happy times!


--------------

Now, if you've followed along this far and have reached here, then you've probably also deduced that the Steam client pretty much ticks all the boxes here. I.e. it's sort of a perfect storm situation.
Last edited by RiO; Dec 23, 2022 @ 11:42am
Felice Dec 24, 2022 @ 2:14am 
Originally posted by RiO:
Now, if you've followed along this far and have reached here, then you've probably also deduced that the Steam client pretty much ticks all the boxes here. I.e. it's sort of a perfect storm situation.

Yeah, you pretty much outlined all of the problems that I was alluding to.

One of the other problems is of using canvas elements or effects that update every frame and cover the entire visible area. At that point, your webpage is basically an embedded game running at high framerate. Yesterday I was on some newspaper's website and I noticed Chrome was using about 10-15% of my RTX 3080 just sitting there with a static view. I resized the window and the usage went down with pixel count. From what I could tell, they were running some JS that was constantly re-rendering a blurred version of the background on every vsync, which on a 144Hz monitor was enough activity to register quite clearly.

If you give people hammers and don't teach them what a nail looks like, you end up with a lot of broken stuff.

The only solution will be regulations that force publishers to say how much power their apps or content consume. We do this with hardware, and we need to do it with software, or there will never be any accountability and thus no change.
Last edited by Felice; Dec 24, 2022 @ 2:26am
Daikatan Dec 24, 2022 @ 5:16am 
Thing is, such situation hurts not only people with outdated hardware that has too few ram, but also takes away a tool that allowed to reduce steam client ram usage for anyone.

Like, imagine playing new game that eats memory like crazy even if you have 32 gb, you still would try to free as much ram as you want for it, right? nobrowser launch option allowed it, now not anymore.

Though ofc its more dramatical for those with outdated weak hardware.
drugon Dec 24, 2022 @ 5:25am 
Actually I wasn't aware of this feature - a friend of mine just told me recently that it's going to be shutdown and described me what is it doing. Man if I only knew about this back then when I had problems with games that requires so much RAM (upgraded from 4GB to 8GB recently so now it's not that critical for me but still could have some use). Honestly it would be great to see it again - I'm sure I can increase performance of many games with it.
607й Dec 24, 2022 @ 5:28am 
The fact of the matter is that few people know about this function, otherwise more people would use it.
Crashed Dec 24, 2022 @ 10:17am 
Originally posted by Felice:
Originally posted by RiO:
Now, if you've followed along this far and have reached here, then you've probably also deduced that the Steam client pretty much ticks all the boxes here. I.e. it's sort of a perfect storm situation.

Yeah, you pretty much outlined all of the problems that I was alluding to.

One of the other problems is of using canvas elements or effects that update every frame and cover the entire visible area. At that point, your webpage is basically an embedded game running at high framerate. Yesterday I was on some newspaper's website and I noticed Chrome was using about 10-15% of my RTX 3080 just sitting there with a static view. I resized the window and the usage went down with pixel count. From what I could tell, they were running some JS that was constantly re-rendering a blurred version of the background on every vsync, which on a 144Hz monitor was enough activity to register quite clearly.

If you give people hammers and don't teach them what a nail looks like, you end up with a lot of broken stuff.

The only solution will be regulations that force publishers to say how much power their apps or content consume. We do this with hardware, and we need to do it with software, or there will never be any accountability and thus no change.
10-15% may be very misleading however, as your RTX card will throttle down when not under load. Also, when the Steam WebHelper is out of focus it should "sleep" and thus not consume GPU resources; if you do have problems simply close any Chat windows or disable the animated profile effects.
Finaryman Dec 24, 2022 @ 10:24am 
merry christmas everyone (even valve).
Alienz Dec 24, 2022 @ 4:52pm 
Used no browser ever since you forced the ad infested unusable BLOATWARE!. I don't care about anything other than playing my game, but you turned it into a social media induced piece of ♥♥♥♥ that has so much clutter that it takes forever to load.

If I cared about streamers I would be on twitch or youtube.

My inventory gets bombarded by items a lot of which I can't sell or delete creating a bunch of junk I can't do anything with or get rid of.

The store never loads for me with all the box art and the bright lights give me a migraine. I have been more willing to go to other stores and if I can't find the game there I will get the game by "other" means (so congradulatons on pushing me into piracy I guess? which is pretty ironic considering gaben wanted to try and combat piracy).

I don't care what is new or curators or inventory items I just want to be able to play the damn game. If I wanted to watch streamers I would much rather go on youtube or twitch than Steam.

I rarely use Steam and I will never spend money ever again on Steam since you forced this mobile induced UI on us and keep taking away useful tools like being able to skin the library now taking away a tool that very few know about but you can't stand people found a way around your bloated browser.

You say tell us why you are using these tools but if you have been paying attention these past 3 years you already know why. You has been given feedback about how bad this was for 3 YEARS but failed to and still fail to respond so no idea why I even bothered.

Valve has become so anti-consumer I should not even be shocked this is happening they are so petty.
rusty_dragon Dec 24, 2022 @ 5:11pm 
Originally posted by Alienz:
Used no browser ever since you forced the ad infested unusable BLOATWARE!. I don't care about anything other than playing my game, but you turned it into a social media induced piece of ♥♥♥♥ that has so much clutter that it takes forever to load.

If I cared about streamers I would be on twitch or youtube.

My inventory gets bombarded by items a lot of which I can't sell or delete creating a bunch of junk I can't do anything with or get rid of.

The store never loads for me with all the box art and the bright lights give me a migraine. I have been more willing to go to other stores and if I can't find the game there I will get the game by "other" means (so congradulatons on pushing me into piracy I guess? which is pretty ironic considering gaben wanted to try and combat piracy).

I don't care what is new or curators or inventory items I just want to be able to play the damn game. If I wanted to watch streamers I would much rather go on youtube or twitch than Steam.

I rarely use Steam and I will never spend money ever again on Steam since you forced this mobile induced UI on us and keep taking away useful tools like being able to skin the library now taking away a tool that very few know about but you can't stand people found a way around your bloated browser.

You say tell us why you are using these tools but if you have been paying attention these past 3 years you already know why. You has been given feedback about how bad this was for 3 YEARS but failed to and still fail to respond so no idea why I even bothered.

Valve has become so anti-consumer I should not even be shocked this is happening they are so petty.
Those are harsh words, but there is hard truth in them. It's ok, if Valve wants to attract streamers, influencers, kids who like shiny things, etc. But at the same time you should not leave behind other customers. Especially when problem can be solved by giving option of disabling bells and whistles for those who are not interested in them.

It's not healthy when bells and whistles get in the way of main, core purpose of Steam client: launching games. People have been asking for small more for a long time, but currently Steam mode still launches Electron bloat in background, even when user has started Steam client in small mode, and never switched to main more, nor launched any feature that requires Electron.
Last edited by rusty_dragon; Dec 24, 2022 @ 5:12pm
Finaryman Dec 24, 2022 @ 8:58pm 
Originally posted by Alienz:
My inventory gets bombarded by items a lot of which I can't sell or delete creating a bunch of junk I can't do anything with or get rid of.
u can turn them into gems, well it is not much, but then later to cash to buy games. if u r willing to do the little thing called converting them to gems.
Felice Dec 25, 2022 @ 5:46am 
Originally posted by rusty_dragon:
It's not healthy when bells and whistles get in the way of main, core purpose of Steam client: launching games. People have been asking for small more for a long time, but currently Steam mode still launches Electron bloat in background, even when user has started Steam client in small mode, and never switched to main more, nor launched any feature that requires Electron.
Yeah, I was really depressed to find out that Small Mode was nothing more than a cosmetic change. It doesn't suspend or kill any processes and doesn't seem to free up any resources.
Felice Dec 25, 2022 @ 5:55am 
Originally posted by Crashed:
10-15% may be very misleading however, as your RTX card will throttle down when not under load. Also, when the Steam WebHelper is out of focus it should "sleep" and thus not consume GPU resources; if you do have problems simply close any Chat windows or disable the animated profile effects.

I don't think much of you said here is actually correct.

I'm pretty sure the task manager is aware of what the CPU and GPU power stages are and accommodates them in the usage graph. Otherwise your usage would look like a ragged straight line.

Also, the webhelper is always out of focus when I check its resource usage, kinda by definition, since I use another app to check that.

The only thing I'll acknowledge is that, yes, obviously, the live GPU processor usage does depend on what's being actively rendered. However, the bloat we're talking about here is mostly to do with RAM and VRAM usage, though yes it's best if the client defaults to minimizing-to-tray during gameplay so that no active rendering outside of the game needs to be done.

(It actually kinda blows me away that this hasn't been a priority from day 1 of Steam. The best launcher to run your games should be the launcher where your games run best.)
Last edited by Felice; Dec 25, 2022 @ 5:57am
Amador Dec 25, 2022 @ 8:38am 
As many other users have said, Steam Client has became, year after year, a massive bloatware that steals resources from games, keep HDD awake and prevent them from cooling, etc.
It is notably bad at scaling with big libraries, with recurring crashes.

"-no-browser" (and maybe "-noreactlogin" ?) is a way to mitigate the problem.
Removing this option is anti-consumer.
Alienz Dec 25, 2022 @ 9:12am 
Originally posted by rusty_dragon:
Originally posted by Alienz:
Used no browser ever since you forced the ad infested unusable BLOATWARE!. I don't care about anything other than playing my game, but you turned it into a social media induced piece of ♥♥♥♥ that has so much clutter that it takes forever to load.

If I cared about streamers I would be on twitch or youtube.

My inventory gets bombarded by items a lot of which I can't sell or delete creating a bunch of junk I can't do anything with or get rid of.

The store never loads for me with all the box art and the bright lights give me a migraine. I have been more willing to go to other stores and if I can't find the game there I will get the game by "other" means (so congradulatons on pushing me into piracy I guess? which is pretty ironic considering gaben wanted to try and combat piracy).

I don't care what is new or curators or inventory items I just want to be able to play the damn game. If I wanted to watch streamers I would much rather go on youtube or twitch than Steam.

I rarely use Steam and I will never spend money ever again on Steam since you forced this mobile induced UI on us and keep taking away useful tools like being able to skin the library now taking away a tool that very few know about but you can't stand people found a way around your bloated browser.

You say tell us why you are using these tools but if you have been paying attention these past 3 years you already know why. You has been given feedback about how bad this was for 3 YEARS but failed to and still fail to respond so no idea why I even bothered.

Valve has become so anti-consumer I should not even be shocked this is happening they are so petty.
Those are harsh words, but there is hard truth in them. It's ok, if Valve wants to attract streamers, influencers, kids who like shiny things, etc. But at the same time you should not leave behind other customers. Especially when problem can be solved by giving option of disabling bells and whistles for those who are not interested in them.

It's not healthy when bells and whistles get in the way of main, core purpose of Steam client: launching games. People have been asking for small more for a long time, but currently Steam mode still launches Electron bloat in background, even when user has started Steam client in small mode, and never switched to main more, nor launched any feature that requires Electron.
It's also not good business if you are going to alienate the consumers who made steam so popular to begin with by adding so much ads and bloat. ]

That's the problem is they are not giving any option to disable the bloat/lights/ads. Atleast when we were able to make skins we could customize the library but Valve don't give a ♥♥♥♥ anymore outside of making money.

And before any corporate shill comes on to say "but they business and need to make money" they can make money without turning users to other stores by using anti-consumer decsions. Plus they have been making record profits so excuse me if I don't care about the ♥♥♥♥ they keep spewing.

All I want is to play my games without too much hastle which Valve is proven to be too complicated despite being a billion dollar company.
< >
Showing 166-180 of 3,495 comments
Per page: 1530 50

All Discussions > Beta Feedback > Topic Details
Date Posted: Dec 8, 2022 @ 10:38am
Posts: 3,495