[Updated] Suggestions for a better Steam Achievements System

[Ciocolici]

EDIT: I started this topic to discuss improvements to Steam’s achievement system, but instead, I’ve been told that I should hate myself for enjoying achievement hunting, that I have no life, that I’m an AI, or that I have some kind of psychological disrder, all because I suggested changes to a feature that some of us care about.

I invested too much time in responding and explaining why these features wouldn’t affect those uninterested in achievements, and it exhausted me because everything I said was ignored. I guess when people dislike something, what you say doesn’t matter.

I’ll leave this topic here for anyone interested in the subject and hope that if someone from Steam sees it, they take what’s valuable from it and leave out what isn’t.

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My original post was a bit different, simpler, I guess, just listing what I thought would improve the Steam Achievements system, comparing with PS or XBox. Unfortunately, there was too much negative feedback, and I was even accused of cheating in my achievement hunting simply because people disapproved of my wishlist. I don’t really understand the hate, as all I want are QoL (quality-of-life) improvements to the system. If any of these features interfere in any way with your experience as someone who doesn’t care about achievements, I’m sorry, that’s not my intention. My goal is only to improve the existing achievement system for those who love achievement hunting, no matter how small that percentage of Steam users may be.

So, I decided to edit my post, reorganizing my wishlist, adjusting the tone, and explaining why I think each suggestion would be a valuable QoL feature. I also removed any text that had the wrong tone or wasn’t directly connected to my suggestions. I’m doing this purely for my own sake, to know that I gave my constructive feedback on the achievement system. Maybe it’ll be helpful to Valve or someone. Who knows?

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1. SAM & Achievement Spam Games

Before suggesting anything else, I think we can all agree that SAM (Steam Achievement Manager) should not exist. Any QoL feature we add has little value while SAM is still around. No matter how you look at it, achievements should not be unlockable with a simple tool. In my eyes, that’s cheating, period.

I don’t know exactly how achievement manipulation works on Steam or what it would take to patch SAM, but if it’s possible to disable it without reworking the entire achievement system, I think we need that ASAP. Some people compare this to syncing achievements from another platform or using an older save file, but that’s not the same. In those cases, you’ve earned the achievements before, and games/devs actually support syncing them.

I’m also aware that some games allow achievements to be cheated using mods or other methods. That’s a more subjective issue, depending on how the achievement system is affected. But no matter what, this is a different discussion than SAM, which is a direct, universal tool for unlocking achievements instantly.

Third-party websites like Steam Hunters can detect achievements unlocked with SAM, but I don’t know how they do it, whether it’s automated or manual. If they can detect it, Steam should be able to as well, right? Instead of banning people (which seems to scare a lot of people), Steam could simply lock those achievements back.

Then, there are games that exist purely to hand out dozens or even hundreds of achievements just for launching the game, the so-called "Achievement Spam Games." These could be a major problem if a point-based achievement system is introduced. A possible fix would be assigning very low point values to achievements in these games. More on the points system in a moment.

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2. Unobtainable Achievements

One reason people use SAM is to get 100% in games with achievements that are no longer obtainable. I hate when I can’t complete a game I love because of one missing achievement. But I also hate when I work hard for an achievement, only for it to be removed the next day by the developer (looking at you, 150+ removed CSGO achievements).

We need a system for this. Let players report unobtainable achievements. If an achievement is confirmed to be unobtainable, remove it from the game’s achievement list. But allow those who previously earned it to keep it. Give it a special rarity or a unique category like Hall of Fame or Feats of Strength (as seen in WoW’s achievement system).

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3. A Point System for Achievements

I’d love to see a point system for achievements. I know this would be difficult, given Steam’s massive game catalog, but an automated system could help. It could work by assigning point values based on achievement rarity.

For example, a game could be required to have a certain percentage of achievements in each rarity tier, with a max cap per category. Any excess achievements would be worth little to no points, preventing Achievement Spam Games from exploiting the system.

I’d love to have a point total displayed next to my profile, similar to the points on Steam Hunters.

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4. A “Platinum” Achievement for 100% Completion

This is another personal wish of mine. I know not everyone wants it, and I understand that Valve prefers to leave these decisions to developers. But I think it would be great to have a final "Platinum" achievement that pops up when you earn every other achievement in a game, something like “Congrats, you got everything!”

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5. Rewards for Achievement Hunters

Steam has the Steam Points Store, but many people forget it even exists. I think it would be great to earn Steam Points as a reward for every 1,000 or 2,000 achievement points. The rewards wouldn’t even need to be large, just small milestone bonuses.

Another cool reward idea would be achievement-based badges. We already spend money to craft Steam badges or trade for Steam trading cards, so why not have a permanent badge that levels up based on our achievement hunting progress? Of course, for this to work, SAM would need to be dealt with first.

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6. Leaderboards

A simple achievement leaderboard would be nice. Nothing too complex. There are already great third-party options like Steam Hunters, but having an official Steam leaderboard would be amazing.

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7. Better Achievement Comparison with Friends

I’d love to see an improved UI for comparing achievements with friends. Nothing too big, just something like what GOG has, where you can instantly see the percentage of achievements each friend has earned when you open a game's page in your library.

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8. Separate Main Game Achievements from DLCs

Not everyone wants this, and I understand that implementing it could be difficult (or maybe not?). But I think it would be a good addition.

Some players enjoy the base game but dislike certain DLCs, or simply don’t want to complete all of them. Why force them to? There could be separate completion percentages, like 100% (Base Game) + 0% (DLC1) + 5% (DLC2), allowing players to choose whether they want to count DLCs toward completion.

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I’m a bit jealous of the PlayStation trophy-hunting community, and I think there’s huge potential for Steam to build something just as engaging. I love achievement hunting, and I believe these suggestions could make it a better experience while bringing more people into it. I also understand that not everybody cares about achievements, or loves the current system (which I do as well, but I think it could be better), however, I’m also sure that none of my suggestions would interfere with your/their experience.

Let me hear your thoughts! Show Steam that the PC community actually cares about achievements!

[Ben Lubar]

Ciocolici a écrit :

Ben Lubar a écrit :

There's no difference as far as Steam's code is concerned.

Completely incorrect.

SAM is not part of Steam’s internal achievement logic. It’s an external tool that exploits a lack of verification checks. Steam could easily implement server-side validation, unlock timestamps, or anomaly detection without breaking legitimate achievements.

Saying "there's no difference" is like saying "if we ban aimbots, shooting mechanics will stop working."

When a game wants to unlock an achievement, it calls this function:

https://partner.steamgames.com/doc/api/ISteamUserStats#SetAchievement

and then to commit the change it calls this function:

https://partner.steamgames.com/doc/api/ISteamUserStats#StoreStats

That's it. One string that gets mapped to a dword index and a bit index and nothing else.

What "server-side validation" are you expecting Steam to implement? Literally the only information Valve gets sent is "the achievement at bit 3 of stat 27 in appid 123450 was earned".

When someone uses an aimbot in a multiplayer shooter game, the server receives information about where the player was and was aiming every frame and can cross reference that against where the other players were and where the map geometry was and what the other players were doing.

Steam knows nothing about what causes a game to unlock an achievement. That's entirely handled by the game's internal logic. And SAM just says "hi, I'm [this game]".

You could try to restrict what programs are allowed to say "hi, I'm [this game]", but that would mainly just make life harder for modders and game developers like me and make SAM take a fraction of a second longer to start up because it needs to rename some files. As long as personal computers are allowed to run video games, you can't guarantee that something hasn't been modified.

[Ciocolici]

Mr. Smiles a écrit :

it really comes down to the "cheating" issue, which does not, and will never have a solution.

Cheating in online games hasn’t been “solved” either, yet anti-cheat systems exist and constantly improve. Should we just give up and let people wallhack in CS2?
Piracy hasn’t been “solved,” but companies still take steps to minimize it. Should they just stop enforcing copyright?
Fraud exists in digital marketplaces, but Steam still has measures against scam accounts. Should they just stop caring?

Saying "cheating will always exist, so don’t try to improve the system" is the laziest possible take. Just because you can’t stop 100% of cheaters doesn’t mean you shouldn’t make it harder for them.

Mr. Smiles a écrit :

So good luck with fixing society and human nature

Oh wow, Steam adding basic integrity checks is now equivalent to fixing all of human nature? Amazing leap of logic there.

Mr. Smiles a écrit :

Honey nut cheevos.

"I don’t have a real argument, so let me just throw in a joke to act like I don’t care."

Brian9824 a écrit :

They are actually quite small staff wise, and it does indeed cancel other options.

This is a misrepresentation of how development works.

Steam has multiple teams working on different features. Improving achievements doesn’t suddenly pull resources away from things like anti-cheat, UI updates, or Steam Deck support. Valve has a history of working on niche features (VR, trading cards, Big Picture Mode, Steam Points), why should achievements be the one thing they completely ignore? If achievements are so unimportant that they should never get updates, why do Xbox, PlayStation, and third-party Steam sites all put effort into them?

This "one hour spent here means one hour lost elsewhere" argument is oversimplified to the point of being meaningless.

Brian9824 a écrit :

Basic logic. If you spend x amount of hours doing something then that is X amount of hours you could have spent doing something else

Basic logic is also realizing that companies don’t operate on a single-task system.

By this logic, Valve should never work on anything niche or non-essential. Yet, they constantly do. Game companies don’t pause all development to focus on one thing at a time. Steam has dedicated engineers for different features, not every dev who works on achievements would otherwise be improving security, for example. This is like saying improving Steam Chat meant Steam couldn’t improve anti-cheat, it’s a false trade-off.

Ben Lubar a écrit :

That's it. One string that gets mapped to a dword index and a bit index and nothing else.

That’s the problem, and it’s exactly what needs improvement.

Just because Steam currently doesn’t validate achievements doesn’t mean it can’t.
Other platforms do track achievement unlocks with timestamps, ordering, and verification logic. Steam is behind the curve, not incapable. If third-party sites already flag suspicious achievements, Steam could easily improve on that with built-in pattern recognition, time analysis, or flagging unlock anomalies.

Ben Lubar a écrit :

What "server-side validation" are you expecting Steam to implement?

Simple: basic sanity checks.

• Order validation – Flag unlocks that don’t follow progression (e.g., getting a final boss achievement before the tutorial).
  
• Time-based validation – Detect mass unlocks that happen in seconds.
  
• Historical verification – Compare playtime with unlock timestamps to flag unrealistic unlock speeds.
  
• API request validation – Recognize when an achievement is manually triggered instead of naturally earned.

This is basic anti-cheat logic, other platforms use it, Steam doesn’t because they never bothered.

Ben Lubar a écrit :

You could try to restrict what programs are allowed to say "hi, I'm [this game]", but that would mainly just make life harder for modders and game developers like me

This is a false equivalence.

Mods don’t work by triggering achievements with API calls, they work by modifying game logic. The goal isn’t to block all external access, but to prevent achievement unlock abuse. Games like Destiny 2, Warframe, and The Division track player progress via external servers. Steam could introduce optional verification tools for developers who want to prevent achievement manipulation.

This isn’t about “banning all modifications”, it’s about closing an obvious exploit that makes achievements meaningless.

[cinedine]

Nx Machina a écrit :

It is a discussion forum and on the other thread you pointed out why the suggestion was flawed with regard to consoles.

https://steamcommunity.com/discussions/forum/10/592889567447690609/#c592889669725748

I didn't point out why the suggestion was flawed. Also, there are several suggestion in both threads, not just one single one you could consider "flawed". Improving or providing UI elements is a whole lot different than asking for a Steam points for achievements is a whole lot different than asking to handle unobtainables.

My very first sentence "No it isn't" is a direct reply to the quoted statement that PSN is more rewarding/respecting towards completionists. Which I still say: no, it isn't. It has the same flaws as the Steam system. There are some things it does better, like giving people a platinum trophy milestone to work towards to, it does some things worse, like not having any way to remove broken trophies.
Regarding Platinum trophies: *I*, me for myself, do not get the importance of. I consider myself more of a completionist. The platinum trophy just marks completing a subset of the available trophies, so it holds no value for me, myself, me personally. There has been several suggestions in the community about a platinums for substantial DLCs or even a higher tiered trophy for achieving 100 % completion. However, I do not berate people for going after the plat and call it a day. I get that people rather want that "core game" done without spending extra money and it does provide a nice capstone on this journey. Does it mean I don't want them on Steam? Hell, no. There are troves of people wanting them - so more power to them.

Providing a better interface for achievements would be an easy win for Steam, satisfying a lot of customers. "Achievement hunters" and "completionists" might be fringe groups, but the general gaming population actually likes getting achievements. They like getting rewards for rewards. They like rising in ranks or comparing with their friends or showing off to them. It's almost as if gamers like gamification and a good natured competion. Absolute Shocker! Most people just don't go particularly out of their way to beat games on the hardest settings, grinding out numbers or playing game modes they don't enjoy.
Another frequent suggestion is also getting an achievement or marker for games you have completed the story on.

You know who has the best achievement system on PC currently (apart from LIVE games?) Epic. By simply doing some of the things that this thread and many more over the past years are asking for. It's just that it's criminally underused by the game on the platform.

[Start_Running]

Steam owns the platform yes. But the Game and the acheivements in them are the dev/pubs and as said. If the dev/pubs canm't be assed...why should steam?

It's bead business to have more interest in someone else's product than they have have in it.

[Ciocolici]

Start_Running a écrit :

If the dev/pubs canm't be assed...why should steam?

Because Steam is the platform owner.

It’s Steam’s job to provide infrastructure, not individual developers. Xbox and PlayStation don’t leave achievements entirely up to devs, they have platform-wide standards, better UI, and features like progress tracking. If Steam ignored things just because devs didn’t care, we wouldn’t have Trading Cards, Cloud Saves, or anti-cheat.

By this logic, Valve should just shut down Steam Support too, because if devs don’t care about customer issues, why should Steam?

Start_Running a écrit :

It's bead business to have more interest in someone else's product than they have have in it.

That’s literally how platforms work.

Steam relies on third-party games, but that doesn’t mean they shouldn’t improve their own ecosystem. Epic, Microsoft, and Sony all enhance their achievement systems, even though individual devs handle game content.

Better achievement tracking = better engagement = more people playing games for longer = more money for Valve. Steam investing in its own achievement infrastructure is just smart business.

[Brian9824]

Ciocolici a écrit :

Steam has multiple teams working on different features. Improving achievements doesn’t suddenly pull resources away from things like anti-cheat, UI updates, or Steam Deck support.

Never claimed it did, it seems you aren't reading what I post. If someone spends 50 hours working on achievements that is 50 hours they can't spend on other features that are more important.

I mean thats basic logic really, so the fact that it has to be explained that if you spend time doing X you can't have spent that same time doing Y well......

[Start_Running]

Ciocolici a écrit :

Start_Running a écrit :

If the dev/pubs canm't be assed...why should steam?

Because Steam is the platform owner.

And?
DOes a landlord give two ♥♥♥♥♥ abiout whether or not you're getting paid well? No.
It's not their stuff. And there's a firm rule in business. DOn't touch other people's stuff. If things go right you don't get paid, and if things go wrong you get sued by the owners for mishandling their stuff.

That's why Valve and many other operate by simply providing tools and letting the dev/pubs do what they feel is best for their community and their product.

Ciocolici a écrit :

It’s Steam’s job to provide infrastructure, not individual developers.

ANd the ifrastructure is there for all of this. dev/pubs just have to use it., Dev pubs can secure their cheevos if they choose. by any number of means the might decide upon.

They can assign point values, create leaderboards, and so forth, but only for their games.
This can already be done. Most dev/pubs don't because it's really not worth their time. They literally don't care if you bother to get the cheevos. THey don't care how many you get.

They have your money already. WHether or not yoyu go for 100% is your business and your business alone and if you need externalities to go for cheevos..then you're not really an achievemwent hunty. You're a "Ding Chaser"

Ciocolici a écrit :

Xbox and PlayStation don’t leave achievements entirely up to devs—they have platform-wide standards, better UI, and features like progress tracking. If Steam ignored things just because devs didn’t care, we wouldn’t have Trading Cards, Cloud Saves, or anti-cheat.

And their cheevos get cheated just as much as anywhere else.. fancy that.

Ciocolici a écrit :

By this logic, Valve should just shut down Steam Support too—because if devs don’t care about customer issues, why should Steam?

Steam support deals with issues regarding the steam client. If you come to support with issues not on their list..they will direct you to the appropriate parties..usually the dev/pubs.

It's bead business to have more interest in someone else's product than they have have in it.

That’s literally how platforms work.
[/quote]
Not really. Console platforms have a co-licensing arrangement with dev/pubs.
Here's a simple way to think about it. Games don't have cheevos because of steam. STeam has cheevos because the games dev/pubs bring have cheevos.

Better achievement tracking = better engagement = more people playing games for longer = more money for Valve. Steam investing in its own achievement infrastructure is just smart business.

Valve makes the same amount of money whether you play a game for 1 hour or 1000hours. Which is the same amount of money they make if you play 0 hours. Once you buy the game. Valve literally couldn't care less if you're engaging with it. Same for most devs...especially if the game is single player.

dev/pub that desire to maintain engagement can dio the work to tart up their cheevos.

[AROCK!!!]

cinedine a écrit :

AROCK!!! a écrit :

I click on the thread in order to make known my opinion on just how worthless and what a waste of resources they are, and that I want studios to spend their money on the core game, not participation trophies.

So you are just insufferable? Same breed as vegans commenting under a Beef Wellington recipie how disgusting it is to eat animals or vice versa? Do you go to chruch each Sunday to let people know that their time could be used more productive instead of holding an imagenary friends convention?

People enjoy stuff I don't. How unfair!

Also newsflash: development isn't a zero-sum game. You can have people working on several different things at the same time or even sequentially. Achievements are usually one of the last things added. You don't have less features nor content because they exist.

How would Steam having an better option to compare your achievements to friends or introducing a platinum trophy hurt you anymore than them working on a broadcast feature nobody ever used?

ahhh...I see. I have an opinion about something, but since you don't like my opinion, and the fact that my points are valid, I am "insufferable".

My opinion on achivs is not even in the same ball park as vegans in meat discussions, or religious activities, and those comments are a text book example of a false equivalence, and a deflection.


Developers have set budgets for making games, and as such a portion of said budget is spent on achivs.

What seems to go over your head, is that achivs are a "niche" thing, and that has been verified by numerous developers, which in my opinion makes it a waste of resources (time and money) that should be spent on the actual game, and that all these things you and certain others want amount to nothing more than a reward for getting a reward.

I've said this multiple times, as have others, but it seems it's just not getting through to you.

[Mad Scientist]

AROCK!!! a écrit :

ahhh...I see. I have an opinion about something, but since you don't like my opinion, and the fact that my points are valid, I am "insufferable".

There must've been some sort of youtuber going on about "Steam needs achievement updates" since OP made 2 identical threads in a short period of time, and a few others recently made threads on it.

Unless they overhaul achievements, which is completely unnecessary because of a niche, overly-vocal community like the win7 crowd, I don't see achievements ever meaning anything, which they already don't outside of achievement hunter websites not even remotely affiliated with Steam. Rather they not try to act like consoles where people focus on digital trophies over enjoying the game.

[AROCK!!!]

Mad Scientist a écrit :

AROCK!!! a écrit :

ahhh...I see. I have an opinion about something, but since you don't like my opinion, and the fact that my points are valid, I am "insufferable".

There must've been some sort of youtuber going on about "Steam needs achievement updates" since OP made 2 identical threads in a short period of time, and a few others recently made threads on it.

Unless they overhaul achievements, which is completely unnecessary because of a niche, overly-vocal community like the win7 crowd, I don't see achievements ever meaning anything, which they already don't outside of achievement hunter websites not even remotely affiliated with Steam. Rather they not try to act like consoles where people focus on digital trophies over enjoying the game.

I have to say, based on these excessively long posts they are making, not to mention multiple thread creations, their obsession with achivs may be an actual psychological issue such as ADD or even OCD.


I could understand if achivs were actually a challenge, and more importantly, interesting, but the vast majority are simply mundane "busy work" tasks.

I played one of the Terminator games and got all but 3 of the achivs, just by playing the game.
One I did not get requires I play a different mode, another was for killing a Terminator with an electric knife (which I did not care about) and the 3rd was for unlocking (lock picking) a door in one of the destroyed cities. This door was just tha, a door and frame standing in a pile of rubble. WhyTF would I spend time unlocking a door that leads to literally nowhere? As I said, mundane busy work.

In another game I received an achive for completing the tutorial, which BTY could not be skipped.

[Mad Scientist]

AROCK!!! a écrit :

I have to say, based on these excessively long posts they are making, not to mention multiple thread creations, their obsession with achivs may be an actual psychological issue such as ADD or even OCD.

Or just use of AI, lol.

AROCK!!! a écrit :

I could understand if achivs were actually a challenge, and more importantly, interesting, but the vast majority are simply mundane "busy work" tasks.

Payday 2 had a neat bit where you actually had to do some challenging achievements to unlock gear, but the issue is anyone could use sam and just unlock it all. Most Devs just do "you completed chapter 1", "you completed chapter 2" etc; easy stuff literally "achieved" by merely playing the game with little effort.

AROCK!!! a écrit :

In another game I received an achive for completing the tutorial, which BTY could not be skipped.

an achievement for doing the tutorial, they might as well just give it for loading the game so people can see how many players actually launched the game, lol. Might be their version of "how many people play past the boring tutorial of how to move your character and basic controls in most games".

[AROCK!!!]

Mad Scientist a écrit :

AROCK!!! a écrit :

I have to say, based on these excessively long posts they are making, not to mention multiple thread creations, their obsession with achivs may be an actual psychological issue such as ADD or even OCD.

Or just use of AI, lol.

AROCK!!! a écrit :

I could understand if achivs were actually a challenge, and more importantly, interesting, but the vast majority are simply mundane "busy work" tasks.

Payday 2 had a neat bit where you actually had to do some challenging achievements to unlock gear, but the issue is anyone could use sam and just unlock it all. Most Devs just do "you completed chapter 1", "you completed chapter 2" etc; easy stuff literally "achieved" by merely playing the game with little effort.

AROCK!!! a écrit :

In another game I received an achive for completing the tutorial, which BTY could not be skipped.

an achievement for doing the tutorial, they might as well just give it for loading the game so people can see how many players actually launched the game, lol. Might be their version of "how many people play past the boring tutorial of how to move your character and basic controls in most games".

I was thinking AI as well.


Every now and then I see achivs that appear to be interesting, but it's rare.

Killing floor had one..Highlander. The issue though, was the achiv was the same regardless of the difficulty level you got it on, so the ones that did it on beginner had the same achive as those that did it on Hell on Earth...no distinction whatsoever.


The tutorial achiv just goes to show how little developers care about them. In that game there were also the, mined X amount of mineral A, then B, then C, and so on. basically just things that would happen regardless as you play the game.

[KalGimpa]

Ciocolici a écrit :

Start_Running a écrit :

If the dev/pubs canm't be assed...why should steam?

Because Steam is the platform owner.

It’s Steam’s job to provide infrastructure, not individual developers. Xbox and PlayStation don’t leave achievements entirely up to devs—they have platform-wide standards, better UI, and features like progress tracking. If Steam ignored things just because devs didn’t care, we wouldn’t have Trading Cards, Cloud Saves, or anti-cheat.

By this logic, Valve should just shut down Steam Support too—because if devs don’t care about customer issues, why should Steam?

Start_Running a écrit :

It's bead business to have more interest in someone else's product than they have have in it.

That’s literally how platforms work.

Steam relies on third-party games, but that doesn’t mean they shouldn’t improve their own ecosystem. Epic, Microsoft, and Sony all enhance their achievement systems, even though individual devs handle game content.

Better achievement tracking = better engagement = more people playing games for longer = more money for Valve. Steam investing in its own achievement infrastructure is just smart business.

i cheat in single player games all of the time

usually after i play through it once but sometimes just to make it fun

if they tie achievements to anything that i cheat at

and that bothers you

too bad

those achievements are there for you to feel whatever good feel it gives you

and more power to you if you like them

i do not play games for the achievements attached to them

and do not care at all if they are there

so, give me a way to remove them

do not tie any kind of improvement to profiles (or anything) for getting them

and you can have at it

better leader boards

better ways to display them or something

quality of life stuff for steam, i get

hell, if they find a way to mark that i used sam, i would be cool with it

for those that feel the need to compare

but me cheating in my single player games

including using sam to stop the damn pop ups i could not turn off

is a me thing

edit:

by improvement i mean things like more friends or anything like that

improvement to display the achievements and the like i get

[cinedine]

AROCK!!! a écrit :

ahhh...I see. I have an opinion about something, but since you don't like my opinion, and the fact that my points are valid, I am "insufferable".

No, not having a different opinion. Going into a topic you despsie just to let everyone know you despise it. Cool. That's not what a discussion is nor what some rational human being would to IRL. Live and let live.

Also no, your points are not valid. Again: implementing achievements does not take away development time. You do not have to make a choice between achievements and another feature or piece of content. You don't have the same people working on their implementation that could fix a major bug instead. They are already treated as an afterthought by most studios, something that is done when eveything else is finished. Games without achievement support don't feature more content, aren't more complex, more challenging, more polished or in any way better than games that do support achievements.

AROCK!!! a écrit :

I could understand if achivs were actually a challenge, and more importantly, interesting, but the vast majority are simply mundane "busy work" tasks.

The vast majority of most game is just "busy work". Running through a level to a boss, gathering items or skilling up, maintaining metres, clicking through dialogues ... not everything needs to be a challenge for the R3AL GAM3RZZZ (tm).

You don't get achievements. We get it. It's fine. And you will never get it because you are not the slightest interested in doing so. That's also fine. But no need to let everyone know every chance you get.
I feel deeply sorry that achievements have stolen your girlfriend in the past. Maybe it's time to get over it?

Also regarding the niche feature: games still implement multiplayer modes that are DOA. Even multiplayer only games implement modes and maps that barely anyone will ever touch. Accessibility features are niche. Certain languages are niche.
FFS, a game's ending can be considered a waste of development time as only a quarter to a third will ever get to it.
And it's not even like anybody is talking about game developers. The topic is mostly about Steam providing a better feature set for a subset of their customers who enjoy said feature. To improve the platform for them. Partial increase of the satisfaction of parts of you customer base eventually equals an increase in the overall experience for everyone.

You can work on solving the Mac issue. You can work on providing better discoverability on the point shop. You can work on providing better moderation tools. Streaming OSTs, supporting more local currencies, making a new Steam controller, improving the discovery queue ... they can do all of that eventually and don't have to decide one or another.
Hm, they implemented a way to not have the notification pop up anymore. I really wonder what got delayed or axed for finally catering for the small group of people who got positively annoyed be that. We still don't have Half-Life 3 because of it!!!

The point of making a suggestion is to tell them what you'd like to see them working on. Nobody in their right mind demands somebody at Valve dropping everything they're doing right now and work on their suggestion.

I ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ hate the general attitude on these forums. This constant need to one-up another, spreading negativity and dragging everything and everyone down.

[Ciocolici]

Brian9824 a écrit :

Ciocolici a écrit :

Steam has multiple teams working on different features. Improving achievements doesn’t suddenly pull resources away from things like anti-cheat, UI updates, or Steam Deck support.

Never claimed it did, it seems you aren't reading what I post. If someone spends 50 hours working on achievements that is 50 hours they can't spend on other features that are more important.

I mean thats basic logic really, so the fact that it has to be explained that if you spend time doing X you can't have spent that same time doing Y well......

By this logic, Valve should never improve Steam Deck compatibility, VR support, or the Big Picture UI, because 'those hours could be spent on something more important.' That’s not how software development works. Different teams handle different features. If you’re going to argue against achievement improvements, at least come up with a real reason.

Start_Running a écrit :

Ciocolici a écrit :

Because Steam is the platform owner.

And?
DOes a landlord give two ♥♥♥♥♥ abiout whether or not you're getting paid well? No.
It's not their stuff. And there's a firm rule in business. DOn't touch other people's stuff. If things go right you don't get paid, and if things go wrong you get sued by the owners for mishandling their stuff.

Yes, if the landlord profits from your success. Valve isn’t just a neutral landlord; they run the entire platform. They already enforce standards in other areas (anti-cheat, refunds, cloud saves). Why is it suddenly different for achievements?

Start_Running a écrit :

Ciocolici a écrit :

It’s Steam’s job to provide infrastructure, not individual developers.

ANd the ifrastructure is there for all of this. dev/pubs just have to use it., Dev pubs can secure their cheevos if they choose. by any number of means the might decide upon.

That’s exactly the issue. No standards = inconsistency. Consoles enforce proper achievement systems, Steam doesn’t. PlayStation and Xbox don’t ‘just provide tools’; they ensure a working system.

Start_Running a écrit :

They can assign point values, create leaderboards, and so forth, but only for their games.
This can already be done. Most dev/pubs don't because it's really not worth their time. They literally don't care if you bother to get the cheevos. THey don't care how many you get.

Plenty of devs do, but they also know Valve doesn’t enforce anything. If Valve had better tools and consistency, more devs would integrate achievements properly, just like they do with cloud saves or anti-cheat.

Start_Running a écrit :

and if you need externalities to go for cheevos..then you're not really an achievemwent hunty. You're a "Ding Chaser"

Not an argument. People enjoy games differently. Who are you to decide what’s a valid way to play? Some enjoy competition, others enjoy collecting. Let people play how they want.

Start_Running a écrit :

Ciocolici a écrit :

Xbox and PlayStation don’t leave achievements entirely up to devs, they have platform-wide standards, better UI, and features like progress tracking. If Steam ignored things just because devs didn’t care, we wouldn’t have Trading Cards, Cloud Saves, or anti-cheat.

And their cheevos get cheated just as much as anywhere else.. fancy that.

False. Exploits exist everywhere, but consoles actively combat them.

Start_Running a écrit :

Ciocolici a écrit :

By this logic, Valve should just shut down Steam Support too, because if devs don’t care about customer issues, why should Steam?

Steam support deals with issues regarding the steam client. If you come to support with issues not on their list..they will direct you to the appropriate parties..usually the dev/pubs.

Yes, and before refunds existed, they didn’t handle refunds either. Valve expanded Steam Support when it made sense. If better achievement handling improved engagement, why wouldn’t they do the same?

Start_Running a écrit :

Not really. Console platforms have a co-licensing arrangement with dev/pubs.
Here's a simple way to think about it. Games don't have cheevos because of steam. STeam has cheevos because the games dev/pubs bring have cheevos.

That’s a meaningless distinction. Consoles also rely on devs, yet they enforce achievement standards. Steam just lets anything happen with zero oversight.

Start_Running a écrit :

Better achievement tracking = better engagement = more people playing games for longer = more money for Valve. Steam investing in its own achievement infrastructure is just smart business.

Valve makes the same amount of money whether you play a game for 1 hour or 1000hours. Which is the same amount of money they make if you play 0 hours. Once you buy the game. Valve literally couldn't care less if you're engaging with it. Same for most devs...especially if the game is single player.

dev/pub that desire to maintain engagement can dio the work to tart up their cheevos.

Wrong. More playtime = more engagement = more store visits = more DLC sales = more microtransactions. Steam literally profits from player retention.

And if Valve set better standards, they would. Just like how Valve enforces cloud saves, refunds, and anti-cheat, a better achievement system would lead to better developer integration.

AROCK!!! a écrit :

Developers have set budgets for making games, and as such a portion of said budget is spent on achivs.

What seems to go over your head, is that achivs are a "niche" thing, and that has been verified by numerous developers, which in my opinion makes it a waste of resources (time and money) that should be spent on the actual game, and that all these things you and certain others want amount to nothing more than a reward for getting a reward.

I've said this multiple times, as have others, but it seems it's just not getting through to you.

By this logic, Steam should also remove trading cards, profile showcases, and community market support, since those are also 'niche' features. Yet, Valve invests in them because they drive engagement and profit. Achievements do the same. Achievements are part of the user experience, just like UI, accessibility settings, or controller support. Good implementation enhances the game; bad implementation frustrates completionists. It's not about 'wasting resources,' it's about using them correctly.

"You just want rewards for getting rewards"... Not really. The suggestions were about better tracking, UI improvements, and standardization, not free stuff. Even if rewards were added, what's the issue? Steam already gives points for purchases, so clearly, incentives exist.

"I've said this multiple times(...)"...... Because repeating something doesn’t make it right. Achievements being 'niche' doesn’t mean they shouldn’t be improved, just like how Steam improved things like cloud saves and refunds over time. If Valve sees potential value, they’ll act on it, whether you personally care or not.

Mad Scientist a écrit :

There must've been some sort of youtuber going on about "Steam needs achievement updates" since OP made 2 identical threads in a short period of time, and a few others recently made threads on it.

Claiming I made this thread because of some YouTuber is not only dismissive but also insulting. If you had actually read the topics instead of making baseless assumptions, you would know that I created this second thread because I felt the first one relied too much on console comparisons and had arguments that were too short, which led to confusion and negativity from people like you. But it turns out that no matter how I frame the discussion or what arguments I provide, some will always respond with the same hostility.

Mad Scientist a écrit :

Unless they overhaul achievements, which is completely unnecessary because of a niche, overly-vocal community like the win7 crowd, I don't see achievements ever meaning anything, which they already don't outside of achievement hunter websites not even remotely affiliated with Steam. Rather they not try to act like consoles where people focus on digital trophies over enjoying the game.

I’ve already explained countless times why that logic doesn’t hold up, giving multiple examples of other niche Steam features that are still supported. If you actually want an answer, you can find it easily in the previous replies.

AROCK!!! a écrit :

I have to say, based on these excessively long posts they are making, not to mention multiple thread creations, their obsession with achivs may be an actual psychological issue such as ADD or even OCD.


I could understand if achivs were actually a challenge, and more importantly, interesting, but the vast majority are simply mundane "busy work" tasks.

I played one of the Terminator games and got all but 3 of the achivs, just by playing the game.
One I did not get requires I play a different mode, another was for killing a Terminator with an electric knife (which I did not care about) and the 3rd was for unlocking (lock picking) a door in one of the destroyed cities. This door was just tha, a door and frame standing in a pile of rubble. WhyTF would I spend time unlocking a door that leads to literally nowhere? As I said, mundane busy work.

In another game I received an achive for completing the tutorial, which BTY could not be skipped.

This is the second time you’ve thrown insults instead of actually discussing anything. It’s just straight-up toxic. I won’t bother replying to anything you say from now on.

But FYI: I get it, you hate achievements, they’re your mortal enemy or whatever. But this thread is about improving the system for people who enjoy them. If you don’t care about it, maybe go make a thread about something you do care about instead of wasting time here.

But hey, I’m probably wasting my words on a troll anyway.

Mad Scientist a écrit :

Or just use of AI, lol.

AROCK!!! a écrit :

I could understand if achivs were actually a challenge, and more importantly, interesting, but the vast majority are simply mundane "busy work" tasks.

Payday 2 had a neat bit where you actually had to do some challenging achievements to unlock gear, but the issue is anyone could use sam and just unlock it all. Most Devs just do "you completed chapter 1", "you completed chapter 2" etc; easy stuff literally "achieved" by merely playing the game with little effort.

AROCK!!! a écrit :

In another game I received an achive for completing the tutorial, which BTY could not be skipped.

an achievement for doing the tutorial, they might as well just give it for loading the game so people can see how many players actually launched the game, lol. Might be their version of "how many people play past the boring tutorial of how to move your character and basic controls in most games".

Oh, so I’m an AI now? Sure, why not. Say hello to ChatGPT.

Not everyone enjoys the same things in games. Some people love speedrunning, others grind for skins, some spend hours in photo mode, and some enjoy collecting achievements. Fun is subjective, and that’s the point. This thread isn’t about convincing you that achievements are fun, it’s about improving the system for those who do enjoy them.

KalCuey a écrit :

those achievements are there for you to feel whatever good feel it gives you

and more power to you if you like them

i do not play games for the achievements attached to them

and do not care at all if they are there

Fair enough. If improvements to achievements don’t affect you, then there’s no issue with discussing them for those who do care. The whole idea is to refine the system in a way that benefits achievement hunters while not interfering with those who don’t engage with them. Things like better tracking, leaderboards, and improved UI don’t impact players who ignore achievements, so there’s no downside.

cinedine a écrit :

The point of making a suggestion is to tell them what you'd like to see them working on. Nobody in their right mind demands somebody at Valve dropping everything they're doing right now and work on their suggestion.

I ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ hate the general attitude on these forums. This constant need to one-up another, spreading negativity and dragging everything and everyone down.

This pretty much sums it up. I started this topic to discuss improvements to Steam’s achievement system, but instead, I’ve been told that I should hate myself for enjoying achievement hunting, that I have no life, that I’m an AI, or that I have some kind of psychological disorder. All because I suggested changes for a feature some of us care about. What a welcoming community.