USER reviews for steam support

[EmotionallyBroken]

because quality of support matters

for clarification, I mean for individual issues, though an overall rating is an interesting idea too that could probably benefit valve greatly, and their company image if they had that as a resource for decision making about their support performance.

EDIT:
This thread is NOT here for the purpose of talking about me, I am not a review system
This thread is NOT here for the purpose of trying to disagree with everything (including yourself) for the sake of creating conflict and going off topic.
This thread is NOT here for the purpose of projecting that everyone is attacking people simply for sharing an experience they've described.

This is not here to create conflict, this is here to suggest creating a review system for people to read and make constructive actions to improve the support of steam and steamclient.
Thats it, thats all its about. No fighting required. No malice required, its not a fight, stop trying to make it a fight.

[MrL0G1C]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από DC-GS:

...
Valve on the other hand is just honest in not asking someone who dont know how to run a business about how to run a business.

No-one's asking for the opportunity to tell Valve how to run their business, we're asking for a customer service feedback option.

[MrL0G1C]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Start_Running:

Blah blah blah etc

Blocked, not interested, you're too much of a Valve fanboy who's game it is to find reasons to dismiss every suggestion no matter how petty or irrelevant those reasons are and it looks to me like you're mostly here to stir up trouble.

[Pscht]

And someone giving feedback (if it's not 100% positive) does that in the hopes of changing things. If you are posting something just to vent, where's the point? You could just as well write on the stall of a local public toilet.

[DC-GS]

Could you give an example of what kind of feedback they could ask for, which doesnt have any influence on how they run their business = which wont chage anything about they handle support?
This feedback should still have some value, else it will waste everybodies (customer and Valve) time.

[MrL0G1C]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από DC-GS:

Could you give an example of what kind of feedback they could ask for, which doesnt have any influence on how they run their business = which wont chage anything about they handle support?
This feedback should still have some value, else it will waste everybodies (customer and Valve) time.

It's a matter of scope, the way your post is phrased makes it sound like the suggester wants to control all aspects of Valve's business.

Steam suggestions are a way for people to make suggestions about Steam, all of these suggestions could be viewed as someone telling Valve how to run it's business. So Valve is literally asking people how to run it's business and you're coming here to a forum telling people in direct contradiction to the purpose of the forum that effectively they shouldn't be making suggestions.

[Judgmental Amaterasu]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από MrL0G1C:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από DC-GS:

Could you give an example of what kind of feedback they could ask for, which doesnt have any influence on how they run their business = which wont chage anything about they handle support?
This feedback should still have some value, else it will waste everybodies (customer and Valve) time.

It's a matter of scope, the way your post is phrased makes it sound like the suggester wants to control all aspects of Valve's business.

Steam suggestions are a way for people to make suggestions about Steam, all of these suggestions could be viewed as someone telling Valve how to run it's business. So Valve is literally asking people how to run it's business and you're coming here to a forum telling people in direct contradiction to the purpose of the forum that effectively they shouldn't be making suggestions.

Except you, as usual, have this weird concept that suggestions are some how magically except from counter arguments from other users. At this point you should block literally everyone that does anything other than stroke your ego.

[MrL0G1C]

No, I'm just sick of all of the fallacious arguments, there are too many people that frequent steam suggestions with the mindset that they have to object to almost every suggestion with reasons that are either absurdly trivial and as such irrelevant or are non sequiturs or are invalid in other ways because they lack sound reasoning.

Like for example you're not here commenting on the suggestion now, you're just here attacking me.

I had a solid point that we are literally here to tell Valve how to do their business and since you had no answer to that strong valid point you attacked me instead using false assumptions and weasel words.

[nullable]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από MrL0G1C:

No, I'm just sick of all of the fallacious arguments, there are too many people that frequent steam suggestions with the mindset that they have to object to almost every suggestion with reasons that are either absurdly trivial and as such irrelevant or are non sequiturs or are invalid in other ways because they lack sound reasoning.

Well to be fair a lot of users have half-baked ideas. They want something just so because it sounds good to them. But they don't really understand the whole issue, or the consequences. And they're often not really open to the idea that the details they're ignoring matter as much or more than the idea they have.

Users don't like being challenged by their peers. If they're ideas can't stand up to a little scrutiny then... whose fault is that?

[Mad Scientist]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από MrL0G1C:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Edifier:

um I've seen plenty of topics over the years complaining about Steam support. No one was banned in them.
Because the people complaining didn't insult or threaten to kill the support people.

But you know if you plan to do insult and threaten to kill the support people Moderators have a good reason to ban you.

There is no censorship to the extreme here.

Inflammatory much? I resent the insinuation that I insulted or threatened to kill the support people. And people here can't tell the difference between a fact, a criticism and an insult. Like so many here you seem to be trying to cause trouble.

I don't believe they're talking about you, I've seen people threaten to harm or kill mods and support alike, so I believe they're generalizing that some people have done such and thus deserved their bans, which is just another example of why the idea is not great.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Crazy Tiger:

Have you ever thought about why companies in the past used those "idea bins"? Not to actually collect all the great ideas, but to give people the idea that their input matters. Some companies used it legitimately, sure. Most just threw it all in the thrash.

Customer feedback is just like that. Some will genuinely want the feedback. Most just want to give the customers the idea that their input matters and do nothing with it but let it flow into an inbox that auto deletes.

Having been in a reputable company, we almost never implemented anything anyone suggested and those things were largely ignored, if ever. The frontliners/support cared, the executives didn't give a single care.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Tito Shivan:

Been both sides of the support line (Not in Steam, lol) and know how useless CS rating services can be.

Every CS service has its own metrics to gauge productivity

CS Ratings are almost entirely useless because people with an attitude usually leave reviews, for the wrong person for starters, and the issue was almost always something that is "refuse to support the individual" for wanting help with competitor products, threatening staff, or threatening legal stuff which we know automatically means they can only talk to certain people due to such kind of threat. It took people ceasing support, informing their superiors what happened, that it had nothing to do with them etc; a time waster.

There was a great side to it too which when you have a maxed positive rating, keeps your boss far away from you, the whole "don't bother them ever if you want good ratings to come in for the business especially when people say they will buy more because of how great the service review is". Though that was a very specific kind of business, on here, I doubt there would be any value to such a system. We all know how not well this would go for Steam due to people being angry about things like refunds, bans, game / vac bans, trade bans etc; most of which would be user error/fault and in many instances not something Support can even deal with or resolve.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από MrL0G1C:

No, I'm just sick of all of the fallacious arguments, there are too many people that frequent steam suggestions with the mindset that they have to object to almost every suggestion with reasons that are either absurdly trivial and as such irrelevant or are non sequiturs or are invalid in other ways because they lack sound reasoning.

Like for example you're not here commenting on the suggestion now, you're just here attacking me.

I had a solid point that we are literally here to tell Valve how to do their business and since you had no answer to that strong valid point you attacked me instead using false assumptions and weasel words.

You're not being "attacked", quite frankly moving the discussion to attempting to say you're a victim is not how you suggest or discuss something. There are flaws in your opinion, which people are pointing out. Those flaws may come across as personal/targeted or that you're being 'attacked', but they're pointing out things that cannot be ignored, which often is when people take a stance that cannot be defended or to uphold the suggestion.

For example, if you're to basically say some people frequent the area too much, or that they don't like ideas often - that could be seen as 'attacking' them, which I would say is hypocritical. That's why you take on the subject in a more logical, factual basis than emotional.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Snakub Plissken:

Well to be fair a lot of users have half-baked ideas. They want something just so because it sounds good to them. But they don't really understand the whole issue, or the consequences. And they're often not really open to the idea that the details they're ignoring matter as much or more than the idea they have.

Users don't like being challenged by their peers. If they're ideas can't stand up to a little scrutiny then... whose fault is that?

It's more that they want it, as to why it sounds good to them. Largely, it does not benefit the community, Steam itself, and often they become overly uncivil when challenged on the idea or why it may not work, is a waste of time/resources etc as they only want what they want, with no thinking of why it's not a good idea, redundant (a lot of those lately) or the other reasons.

[EmotionallyBroken]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από MrL0G1C:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από EmotionallyBroken:

a life time of experience would lead me to doubt the latter statement there:)

The problem is that metrics that encourage faster throughput of tickets don't encourage good quality support which is why I agree there should be some level of feedback regarding whether the support was satisfactory or not. That should include asking whether the support correctly comprehended what you said in the support ticket(s) because they certainly didn't read and comprehend my support tickets said correctly in the past.

I had a guy respond to a comment saying ive tried a dozen things including reinstalling the OS , and one immediate response was "try restarting steam".

I think this alone strongly highlights the need for reviewing the state of support and the results it is producing. Im glad to see im not the only person to see the dire( based on what ive seen) need for improvement.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Start_Running:

The conclusions are spot on going by what can be seen on the forums.
You will always get an answer from Steam support. The answer will always be the correct answer. It may not be the answer the customer wants to hear, but it is the right answer.

You actually believe this?

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Snakub Plissken:

Well to be fair a lot of users have half-baked ideas. They want something just so because it sounds good to them. But they don't really understand the whole issue, or the consequences.

Lack of communication doesnt help either, though I cant imagine a multi BILLION dollar business having any reason not to have decent support able communicate in reasonable time about simple issues, with something like "We cant afford real technicians" . (Not saying I heard that but, but thats the only reason I could think of for not having the level that should be there,) I can see staff putting time and energy into things, maybe even more than they can handle (again a company this huge shouldnt have that kind of shortage) to me what it looks like from what I can see is a serious management shortcoming.

a simple feedback system (That actually gets read an applied PRACTICALLY and not merely to boost ratings[Yay I "solved" this problem in less 7 minutes by telling them to restart and dropped their connection,look how fast and effective I am]) is only going to help.

[Mad Scientist]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από EmotionallyBroken:

I had a guy respond to a comment saying ive tried a dozen things including reinstalling the OS , and one immediate response was "try restarting steam".

Users are not Support, and I've seen awful suggestions of "reinstall the OS" from standard users, which people think is a magic fix-all rather than trying to resolve the issue, but the main point remains: Users are not members of Support. Support doesn't even post on the forums.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από EmotionallyBroken:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Start_Running:

The conclusions are spot on going by what can be seen on the forums.
You will always get an answer from Steam support. The answer will always be the correct answer. It may not be the answer the customer wants to hear, but it is the right answer.

You actually believe this?

I am still very curious as to why exactly you personally want to 'review' Support.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από EmotionallyBroken:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Snakub Plissken:

Well to be fair a lot of users have half-baked ideas. They want something just so because it sounds good to them. But they don't really understand the whole issue, or the consequences.

Lack of communication doesnt help either, though I cant imagine a multi BILLION dollar business having any reason not to have decent support able communicate in reasonable time about simple issues, with something like "We cant afford real technicians" . (Not saying I heard that but, but thats the only reason I could think of for not having the level that should be there,)

You can personally believe that's the "only reason" even when clearly illogical, have you seen the Stats page for Steam Support? This isn't some small operation with a handful of people doing thousands of tickets a day, this is hundreds of thousands per day. Every time people don't get what they want, it's always "billion dollar company" as a blanket excuse as to why they should do something.

First; The automation resolves a fair amount of issues or handles refund denials well, so Support can handle more important matters easily/more quickly
Secondly; What do you consider "reasonable time" for "simple issues"? What was the issue, specifically? You're being overly vague which brings the question for details. Look at the support stats, given the number done and number waiting, this is entirely reasonable.

How many Techs do you think they should have? Also, why should they have Techs rather than general Support members? Again, what was/is the exact issue you were or are having?

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από EmotionallyBroken:

I can see staff putting time and energy into things, maybe even more than they can handle (again a company this huge shouldnt have that kind of shortage) to me what it looks like from what I can see is a serious management shortcoming.

There would likely be far less tickets and thus faster response time if users stopped wasting their time from not reading things, getting assistance from Devs/other users for a specific game hub rather than presuming Support will support non-valve games, stopped giving away their logins and asking/demanding their items be restored from being stolen, etc.

It's mostly a user shortcoming issue, not a management shortcoming issue.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από EmotionallyBroken:

a simple feedback system (That actually gets read an applied PRACTICALLY and not merely to boost ratings[Yay I "solved" this problem in less 7 minutes by telling them to restart and dropped their connection,look how fast and effective I am]) is only going to help.

Factually, it's a massive waste of time to even have for the most part and is largely not helpful. The start to a workers day shouldn't be dealing with false/bad/ill-informed negative reviews rather than supporting people that need help rather than want to throw anger at people that are there to help which again, is a massive time waster and largely detrimental to the speed of service.

[Edifier]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από MrL0G1C:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Edifier:

um I've seen plenty of topics over the years complaining about Steam support. No one was banned in them.
Because the people complaining didn't insult or threaten to kill the support people.

But you know if you plan to do insult and threaten to kill the support people Moderators have a good reason to ban you.

There is no censorship to the extreme here.

Inflammatory much? I resent the insinuation that I insulted or threatened to kill the support people. And people here can't tell the difference between a fact, a criticism and an insult. Like so many here you seem to be trying to cause trouble.

When you claim that the things you'd say would get you banned I can only assume you'd be breaking a lot of rules. Because that's what gets you banned on these forums.

But in my time seeing people complaining about Steam support they have rarely if ever been banned for doing do.

People here can tell the difference between criticism and insults. Which is why a lot of topics on why someone hate Steam support are allowed to be open.


Either way if you let people review Steam support you'd probably find a majority liking it. They deal with 200 000+ tickets or so per week maybe and the few who complain about it being a problem are dwarfed by these numbers.
https://store.steampowered.com/stats/support

[Tito Shivan]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από EmotionallyBroken:

a life time of experience would lead me to doubt the latter statement there:)

'Productivity' isn't the same as 'customer satisfaction'.
And customer support is one of those works where not every customer can be satisfied while doing correctly your job.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από 76561198034530531:

No-one's asking for the opportunity to tell Valve how to run their business, we're asking for a customer service feedback option.

Such feedback services are mostly rubbish and mainly used for people to vent their frustrations.

[crunchyfrog]

Sorry, but this is an utterly useless feature.

Go look at Metacritic, just the user reviews on any game. You will see a number of "normal" straight up reviews and a metric ♥♥♥♥ ton of 0 and 10. Because people are usually hyperbolic and ridiculous.

They will either get a bee in their bonnet and simply complain "worst company ever" unfairly or do the same in the opposite directiom.

You can't glean anything useful from that and it will just generate more aggro unnecessarily.

[MrL0G1C]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Tito Shivan:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από EmotionallyBroken:

a life time of experience would lead me to doubt the latter statement there:)

'Productivity' isn't the same as 'customer satisfaction'.
And customer support is one of those works where not every customer can be satisfied while doing correctly your job.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από 76561198034530531:

No-one's asking for the opportunity to tell Valve how to run their business, we're asking for a customer service feedback option.

Such feedback services are mostly rubbish and mainly used for people to vent their frustrations.

No-one is suggesting that every customer could be satisfied but if customer service op1 has twice as many satisfied customers as customer service op2 then that's probably something worth taking a closer look at for the senior staff.

Just because other companies implement rubbish feedback systems doesn't mean Valve has to. Also, what is wrong with letter people vent their frustrations in a systematic and controlled manner, surely that'd help with customer satisfaction levels overall.

I personally think feedback should be mainly metrics only, any text part should be kept as short as a tweet. Feedback should not be public, I don't agree with that aspect, people would ham it up too much if their reviews were public.