why C++ redistributable with seemingly all games? could we see games with modern langauges after year 2000 and vulkan?

[Eccentric]

I noticed almost every steam game on steam includes a C++ redistributable. C and C++ are obsolete ancient 80's and 90's software programming environment. Its for single GPU and single CPU is 32bit and doesnt have protected memory or other features and should be considered slower/obsolete/less features and functionality. Modern programming languages like RUST/DHART/C# paired with Directx12 or the better choice VULKAN work with more cores more threads and out of order code execution native at compiler level and should run considerably faster.

The problem is the steam client itself and all its games appear as if they'd run on windows 95 or 98. But that OS is long done away with and abandoned and unsupported. Drivers and software arent meant to be made to run on windows 98 and certainly shouldnt be written in DOS (which windows 98 uses and is). So yeah just wondering if your app store could check latest industry standards with most features and force game devs to release in or update to or something to modern programming languages made after the year 2000 and modern features and functions. Windows ever since windows XP and windows Vista tried to move away from and get rid of DOS completely.. DOS is bad okay? Lots of game developers think that since the original doom game from the 90's only takes a few floppy disks and runs very fast on their new high end gaming computer when they double click doom.exe that C++ is the ultimate language and all they'll ever need and will outright refuse to learn that newer better things exist or pretend huge megacorporations didnt spend years and billions of dollars making better things. They'd rather bury their heads in the sand and cling to single core single GPU C++ and then spend months and years of their lives hand tweaking painstakingly revising and optimizing their code to make it pretend like its closer to a poor imitation of a modern programming language using software tools like openMP. Those are meant for say cable TV networks build in the 90's maybe have expensive hardware they're desperately trying to never replace as it currenctly still works and screwing around upgrading may be expensive or break it so they try to patch their old obsolete software to pretend its new and make it compatible with their legacy systems. If you look at doom eternals doomvulkan64.exe yes you do double click a doom exe and you may think its the exact same game as the one from the 90's but i would honestly like to believe there are some small barely differences in modern software vs old C++ and windows 98 compared with windows 10 ver 2004 or wolfenstein 3d vs wolfenstein youngblood. Is there even a way to get game developers to use the best and latest audio standards/software and better/best texture formats and to quit with all that lame compression packing cooking methods of their game files especially since it makes things way harder to mod them and probably slows stuff to a crawl and makes load times take 10x longer. Can you set standards for your store please so game devs will consider them seriously like uhh they get a discount for new programming code/language features or have to pay far more for C++ DOS rubbish in the year 2020? I understand it might be that intels 15 year old 10th generation of selling the same CPU design thats just a probably 50 year old AMD or military CPU design thats patent was changed so they can use it or was open sourced.. and same for nvidia's tech and hardware being all fake too and probably 50 year old AMD tech thats been patent changed or just poorly faked and imitated to the point its legal so maybe they cant actually run modern software newer than windows 98. But I'd love to see someone try it. Just because AMD has some of the smartest people on the planet MENSA members and mathematician Dr. Lisa Su and working with steven hawking and cray and IBM and make basically super computers for home use but all our softwares fake and DOS like C++ nonsense and people dont know what a computer is or looks like or how to use one unless they somehow bought genuine AMD by mistake or co-incidence. All the AMD laptops I've seen have been sabotaged by the product vendors. Their super fast laptops have awful SODIMM LPDDR4 RAM instead of real full bandwidth DDR4 and the number of USB or HDMI ports and the screen/display quality and such are intentionally poor on an equivalent fake overpriced intel garbage. So even if you bought the best computer you might not even know it with intel and nvidia giving away and handing out hardware for free and even paying people to take their hardware and the entire software industry seemingly corrupt as they are forever stuck 20-30 years in the past along with 50 year old AMD tech being thrown around by intel and nvidia like brand new top shelf products.. Overlays, 2d ray collision (rtx) and deep learning neural networks (DLSS) were all like 30 to 50 year old AMD tech that was made open source and intel and nvidia show it off like they're smart when they've probably not ever made or invented or developed a single thing in their lives. Nvidia's company is named after the goddess of envy buy a guy who was kicked out of AMD. I understand that all of russia and india have 386 and 486's or pentium III's or whatever nonsense and running windows 95.. but for those of us on a gaming platform like steam that sells games and we all have gaming PC's I'd love it if those games were made to run on real computers like AMD or at least use modern computer software.

[cSg|mc-Hotsauce]

Please use proper spacing. Walls of text is hard on the eyes of readers.

Go bug the game devs about it.

[Sazzouu]

Publicado originalmente por cSg|mc-Hotsauce:

Please use proper spacing. Walls of text is hard on the eyes of readers.

[...]

I took the time to dig through it... it was not worth the effort really.
OP obviously just crawled the web for "modern programmers practices" and some random buzzwords to try to make some sort of statement.

On this way he produced so many misconceptions such as languages and associated "good practices" having the upper hand in one department so they must have it in every department and so on and so forth. The thing that hurt me the most was literally the first paragraph saying stuff such as...

C and C++ are obsolete ancient 80's and 90's software programming environment.

or

Directx12 or the better choice VULKAN

You don't need to be that much of a computer scientist in order to tell that OP did not educate himself properly and just picked up some random stuff probably on NewEgg and Reddit and tried to debunk the "stupidity" that the biggest companies are running on for decades now after years of further research and experimenting...

Quintessential of this wall of text is "C++ old, C++ bad".

[cSg|mc-Hotsauce]

I'm wondering, where is the suggestion for Steam itself though?

[Sazzouu]

Publicado originalmente por cSg|mc-Hotsauce:

I'm wondering, where is the suggestion for Steam itself though?

Thats another misconception of his...
Since many Steam Games come with the "Common Redistributable" depot he assumes that Valve enforces Steam Games to be C++ based - at least partially
And that is his suggestion to be changed

[Satoru]

Your post is full of just techno dribble you must have read off of PC gamer while drunk and then threw up on your keyboard this drivel.

The idea that you’re even saying visual c++ is 32 bit only, and that you think that somehow Vulcan a GRAPHICAL API replaces visual C++ is just so astoundingly bad I’d laugh if “gamers” didn’t actually believe this nonsense. It also glosses over the actual complexities in implementing things like DX12/Vulcan like you’re just pushing a button in Unity or something

It also ignores the complexities of game development like you could just throw in RUST into a project and then see in horror as all your 3rd party tools you need to integrate don’t support RUST.

[ElvisDeadly]

Publicado originalmente por Eccentric:

Lots of game developers think that since the original doom game from the 90's only takes a few floppy disks and runs very fast on their new high end gaming computer when they double click doom.exe that C++ is the ultimate language and all they'll ever need and will outright refuse to learn that newer better things exist .

What?

[cinedine]

Wow, that a lot of nonsense. Paired with a bit of racism.
Basically nothing of what I skim read is based in this reality.

Fun Fact:
I started with Rust last week. Guess what I had to install. C++ Build Tools. :D

[Crazy Tiger]

OP seems to think that copy/pasta from BS tech sites has merit to be posted...

[Crashed]

Just want to point out the VC 2019 runtimes are 3 updates out of date; Steam is distributing version 14.24.28127 while the current is 14.27.29016.

The 2015 and 2017 runtimes are no longer needed to be distributed; the 2019 runtimes cover those versions too based on Microsoft's updated runtime update policy.

I personally host the runtimes on my own website for a program I develop, regularly updating the installers to point to the latest version every time VS2019 has a feature update.

[KeplersConjecture]

Publicado originalmente por Eccentric:

I noticed almost every steam game on steam includes a C++ redistributable. C and C++ are obsolete ancient 80's and 90's software programming environment. Modern programming languages like RUST/DHART/C# paired with Directx12 or the better choice VULKAN work with more cores more threads and out of order code execution native at compiler level and should run considerably faster.

VULKAN was originally written in C. Just goes to show that you really dont know anything.

[aiusepsi]

Publicado originalmente por Eccentric:

C and C++ are obsolete ancient 80's and 90's software programming environment. Its for single GPU and single CPU is 32bit

None of that is true.

and doesnt have protected memory or other features and should be considered slower/obsolete/less features and functionality.

"Protected memory" is an OS feature, not a language one. You're perhaps thinking of "memory safety" which is a different concept.

C and C++ are still pretty much the fastest languages out there. Rust is competitive, but they're still trying to catch up to C and C++, not overtake.

Modern C++ is very featureful; e.g. it's getting first-class coroutines in C++20, which is neat.

out of order code execution native at compiler level

No idea what this means. Out-of-order execution is something the CPU does internally, reordering instructions in a way that it thinks will make things faster. It's not something the compiler does!

I can't be bothered to go through the rest of the wall-o'-text line-by-line addressing the falsehoods, because it's full of them.

[Crashed]

Publicado originalmente por aiusepsi:

Publicado originalmente por Eccentric:

C and C++ are obsolete ancient 80's and 90's software programming environment. Its for single GPU and single CPU is 32bit

None of that is true.

and doesnt have protected memory or other features and should be considered slower/obsolete/less features and functionality.

"Protected memory" is an OS feature, not a language one. You're perhaps thinking of "memory safety" which is a different concept.

C and C++ are still pretty much the fastest languages out there. Rust is competitive, but they're still trying to catch up to C and C++, not overtake.

Modern C++ is very featureful; e.g. it's getting first-class coroutines in C++20, which is neat.

out of order code execution native at compiler level

No idea what this means. Out-of-order execution is something the CPU does internally, reordering instructions in a way that it thinks will make things faster. It's not something the compiler does!

I can't be bothered to go through the rest of the wall-o'-text line-by-line addressing the falsehoods, because it's full of them.

Pretty much, C/C++ is just one step above hardware-level ASM programming.

As mentioned above, runtimes like Vulkan will use C, likely with ASM modules in performance critical sections, as this has the lowest overhead. Driver packages will install any needed MSVC runtimes the driver DLLs depend on.

[Walach]

Ofcourse C++ is bad! Everyone should be coding directly in machine code!
I wonder why people stopped doing that... almost as if they switched to something easier, I wonder what that was... ;)

[Eccentric]

VULKAN is military tech from AMD its called MANTLE (the M is for military and the A was maybe astro or aeronautical i forget.. its a long acronym) MANTLE was military tech decades ago that was from AMD that was desperately sought by industry groups so they sold them small pieces of the technology and they used world famous military technology to create VULKAN over the top of safe for sale parts of MANTLE by "KHRONOS GROUP". But in order for AMD computers and AMD GPU's to function you will see on the packaging it says DX12 or VULKAN.. but reviewers of AMD GPU's like the rx 580 and vega or 5700xt will always test the GPU's video decoding performance with like Windows Media Renerer 7 or something and use DOS PROMPTS to run buggy open source X265 instead of whats written on the box "hardware HEVC decoding with DX12 or VULKAN" So if they were to instead test the GPU hardware HDR and hardware HEVC decoding with a purchased industry HEVC decoder codec software from microsoft for like $1 and using D3D11 Renderer with windows OS they would see video playback quality worlds better than ANYTHING nvidia have ever imagined. Best of all if you notice an RX 580 8GB OC card sapphire nitro+ can be bios flashed to undervolt and slightly overclock further can mine crypto currency etherium slightly faster than a GTX 1080 11GB OC card. And thats with ♥♥♥♥♥♥ criminals making crypto currency software thats probably still not written to run on an AMD computer. If you use software like Davinci resolve or adobe premiere you can get the openCL compute performance of say an RX290 the RX200 or RX300 series and an RX Fury card.. then compare it with the open CL compute performance of an RX580 card even though theres faster clock speeds newer GPU cores and when moving to VEGA designed for industry use SPECIFICALLY AIMED AT COMPUTE WORK with HBM GDDR6 memory and faster clocks and newer core it actually costs buttloads more has faster RAM and faster clocks and runs scorching hot with smaller micron nm size probably but its resolve and premiere and every other open CL app performance means it runs soo poorly in open CL that you're better off saving money and using an RX580 because app developers and software developers never ever figured out what a computer is and how to use one and that you MUST RUN MODERN SOFTWARE on modern hardware. Also even if the words you type in in modern programming languages sound the same or look the same or even type in the same function call name, its auto compiler level optimized for new hardware and the assembly code behind it is better optimized and newer and probably a lot lot faster. Why limit yourselt to a single CPU and single GPU when the CPU's and GPU's are designed for multitasked out of order code execution and parallelism but you running DOS software on them expect to be fast when all the software on the planet is faking to make intel and nvidia seem like actual products people should consider purchasing they're probably just faking multicores and hyperthreading maybe just a single big CPU and single big GPU for intel and nvidia call it words like ring bus and whatever 15 year old intel CPU design runs 80's software faster but when a 2 or 3 year old zen core runs MODERN software its absolutely definitely much faster.. so I'm angry that cavemen blow the dust off grandpa's learn to code book to learn how to program. You fools think you can teach the military and some of the smartest people on the planet like the AMD employees about computers and software you noobs?

[Black Blade]

Can you please link to your sources?
You write a lot, but it really sounds mostly like mambo jumbo that has no ground or truth to it