As a german coomer, what exactly happened that caused the ban on ero-games?

[REDMVGE]

I never bought many H-games, but there were 2 that interested me that are due out in the next months. Now however, no matter which game it is, it just states "not available in your country". I tried googling it, trying to figure out if there was a new law passed recently, but there simply wasn't. This seems to be a steam only thing and I want to know why, so please if any if you fine folk out there know, share your information :)

As a hint: saying "germany requires strong age verification" doesn't count as this has been the "law" for ages and never once was enforced. Hell, even twitter would be banned here if that was the case...

[cSg|mc-Hotsauce]

https://steamcommunity.com/discussions/forum/10/3004429475616220808/

You can read through that a bit.

Or this... https://steamcommunity.com/discussions/forum/1/1746720717332802764/

Or this... https://steamcommunity.com/discussions/forum/0/5544461758367362223/

[crunchyfrog]

The common thing where people tend to get this round their neck is that they conflate law with marketing.

What I mean is that they assume ALL decisions as to whether to make a game available is down to the legal situation precisely. It often isn't, as companies tend to very much err on the side of caution.

So it ain't Valve anyway, as only the publishers can decide what happens to their games.

BUt what they do is they are not going to be well versed with individual laws, so they'll simply think to avoid potential litigation or issues, they'll just hold off making it available.

[kitt]

Първоначално публикувано от crunchyfrog:

The common thing where people tend to get this round their neck is that they conflate law with marketing.

What I mean is that they assume ALL decisions as to whether to make a game available is down to the legal situation precisely. It often isn't, as companies tend to very much err on the side of caution.

So it ain't Valve anyway, as only the publishers can decide what happens to their games.

BUt what they do is they are not going to be well versed with individual laws, so they'll simply think to avoid potential litigation or issues, they'll just hold off making it available.

thats just plain wrong.

Steam is the Store who COULD offer the means but THEY decide not to. Steams message when clicking a Title which is blocked is also false.

It literally says that the Game is not ALLOWED in my Country, thats just wrong, false, a lie, call it whatever.

[Satoru]

If you have a law it’s a law. Not being “enforced” is irrelevant. Are you personally going to compensate Steam when the German government sues Steam? No? The feel free to tell your government to repeal the law

[Mad Scientist]

The other threads on the subject clearly state something is in-the-works, but these things take time especially in an existing infrastructure. Anything other than that is a temporary solution.

See this:

Първоначално публикувано от cSg|mc-Hotsauce:

https://steamcommunity.com/discussions/forum/10/3004429475616220808/

You can read through that a bit.

Or this... https://steamcommunity.com/discussions/forum/1/1746720717332802764/

Or this... https://steamcommunity.com/discussions/forum/0/5544461758367362223/

:qr:

[cinedine]

Първоначално публикувано от Satoru:

If you have a law it’s a law. Not being “enforced” is irrelevant. Are you personally going to compensate Steam when the German government sues Steam? No? The feel free to tell your government to repeal the law

Except no law has changed. The only thing that changed is the KJM getting more aggressive with websites not having the required technical means to verify age. Which, btw doesn't seem to fuzz anyone with Steam as they arte selling USK rated games without verification for years.

[Satoru]

Първоначално публикувано от cinedine:

Първоначално публикувано от Satoru:

If you have a law it’s a law. Not being “enforced” is irrelevant. Are you personally going to compensate Steam when the German government sues Steam? No? The feel free to tell your government to repeal the law

Except no law has changed. The only thing that changed is the KJM getting more aggressive with websites not having the required technical means to verify age. Which, btw doesn't seem to fuzz anyone with Steam as they arte selling USK rated games without verification for years.

It’s amusing all the people who insisted that “Nazi games are fine” and shouldn’t be censored because it’s not being enforced, works all the way up until, you know, it is

Again if Germans don’t like the consequences of their laws they’re free to complain to their government about it.

[cinedine]

Първоначално публикувано от Satoru:

Първоначално публикувано от cinedine:

Except no law has changed. The only thing that changed is the KJM getting more aggressive with websites not having the required technical means to verify age. Which, btw doesn't seem to fuzz anyone with Steam as they arte selling USK rated games without verification for years.

It’s amusing all the people who insisted that “Nazi games are fine” and shouldn’t be censored because it’s not being enforced, works all the way up until, you know, it is

Again if Germans don’t like the consequences of their laws they’re free to complain to their government about it.

Maybe read the thread linked.
Germans are perfectly happy with their laws. What they are not happy with it Steam blanketly removing their legal right to purchase games because they are too lazy to offer a working age verification - something that (a) hasn't fuzzed them until now and (b) still doesn't bother them when it comes to selling rated games.

[Mad Scientist]

Първоначално публикувано от cinedine:

Първоначално публикувано от Satoru:

It’s amusing all the people who insisted that “Nazi games are fine” and shouldn’t be censored because it’s not being enforced, works all the way up until, you know, it is

Again if Germans don’t like the consequences of their laws they’re free to complain to their government about it.

Maybe read the thread linked.
Germans are perfectly happy with their laws. What they are not happy with it Steam blanketly removing their legal right to purchase games because they are too lazy to offer a working age verification - something that (a) hasn't fuzzed them until now and (b) still doesn't bother them when it comes to selling rated games.

You mean that age verification they said is in the works, several times in one of those threads per supports responses to people? Temporary solution was what they did, until the update is released.

[crunchyfrog]

Първоначално публикувано от kitt:

Първоначално публикувано от crunchyfrog:

The common thing where people tend to get this round their neck is that they conflate law with marketing.

What I mean is that they assume ALL decisions as to whether to make a game available is down to the legal situation precisely. It often isn't, as companies tend to very much err on the side of caution.

So it ain't Valve anyway, as only the publishers can decide what happens to their games.

BUt what they do is they are not going to be well versed with individual laws, so they'll simply think to avoid potential litigation or issues, they'll just hold off making it available.

thats just plain wrong.

Steam is the Store who COULD offer the means but THEY decide not to. Steams message when clicking a Title which is blocked is also false.

It literally says that the Game is not ALLOWED in my Country, thats just wrong, false, a lie, call it whatever.

Except you are wrong.

THe fact is as stated. Valve CANNOT state terms for products that they do not own. That's as clear as crystal.

I'm sorry you don't understand basic IP rights, but that's your problem not mine.

[Satoru]

Първоначално публикувано от cinedine:

Първоначално публикувано от Satoru:

It’s amusing all the people who insisted that “Nazi games are fine” and shouldn’t be censored because it’s not being enforced, works all the way up until, you know, it is

Again if Germans don’t like the consequences of their laws they’re free to complain to their government about it.

Maybe read the thread linked.
Germans are perfectly happy with their laws. What they are not happy with it Steam blanketly removing their legal right to purchase games because they are too lazy to offer a working age verification - something that (a) hasn't fuzzed them until now and (b) still doesn't bother them when it comes to selling rated games.

Everyone 'insisted' that Nazi games were fine because 'the law wasnt enforced' or 'it didnt apply' when it VERY CLEARLY DOES. Again if Germans dont like the consequences of what their laws do and do not say, then they should change their laws to provide ACTUAL protections and clarifications under law. Right now there are none. Other than 'well we pinky promise not to actually do something if you make a game with nazis in it'. Which is why steam always censored games in Germany because 'we pinky swear its not a problem' isnt a protection

[crunchyfrog]

Първоначално публикувано от Satoru:

Първоначално публикувано от cinedine:

Maybe read the thread linked.
Germans are perfectly happy with their laws. What they are not happy with it Steam blanketly removing their legal right to purchase games because they are too lazy to offer a working age verification - something that (a) hasn't fuzzed them until now and (b) still doesn't bother them when it comes to selling rated games.

Everyone 'insisted' that Nazi games were fine because 'the law wasnt enforced' or 'it didnt apply' when it VERY CLEARLY DOES. Again if Germans dont like the consequences of what their laws do and do not say, then they should change their laws to provide ACTUAL protections and clarifications under law. Right now there are none. Other than 'well we pinky promise not to actually do something if you make a game with nazis in it'. Which is why steam always censored games in Germany because 'we pinky swear its not a problem' isnt a protection

And that is precisely why publishers will take a look at that and think "hmm, better be on the safe side, so we won't release there".

That's the point I was making when certain people say "but the law doesn't say this". Conflating the point between the law and publisher's decision is never going to end well.

Well said, Satoru.

[cinedine]

Първоначално публикувано от Satoru:

Първоначално публикувано от cinedine:

Maybe read the thread linked.
Germans are perfectly happy with their laws. What they are not happy with it Steam blanketly removing their legal right to purchase games because they are too lazy to offer a working age verification - something that (a) hasn't fuzzed them until now and (b) still doesn't bother them when it comes to selling rated games.

Everyone 'insisted' that Nazi games were fine because 'the law wasnt enforced' or 'it didnt apply' when it VERY CLEARLY DOES. Again if Germans dont like the consequences of what their laws do and do not say, then they should change their laws to provide ACTUAL protections and clarifications under law. Right now there are none. Other than 'well we pinky promise not to actually do something if you make a game with nazis in it'. Which is why steam always censored games in Germany because 'we pinky swear its not a problem' isnt a protection

Who the ♥♥♥♥ is talking about "Nazi games"?! What are you even trying to say?

Първоначално публикувано от crunchyfrog:

And that is precisely why publishers will take a look at that and think "hmm, better be on the safe side, so we won't release there".

Well said, Satoru.

Except he doesn't even know what this thread is about and no studio had any hand in it. Valve removed every game tagged as mature that doesn't have an USK rating from the search results in Germany.
And fun fact: you can perfectly well still add them to your cart and purchase from the wishlist.

Valve has unilaterally removed the store pages from view for Germans and Austrians.

[Muppet among Puppets]

I mention it again:

a newspaper giving away a free game
had the proper age verification set up.

Something that steam could do and its as easy as sending an email to a verified post office run email account of a person who is verified 18.

And because its an official post office service, it might cost a "letter fee" for the email. The user can opt in to pay these pennies.

[Muppet among Puppets]

Първоначално публикувано от Satoru:

Which is why steam always censored games in Germany because 'we pinky swear its not a problem' isnt a protection

Steam made localized versions of their games so they could advertise them all over the place. Remember well the hl2 advertising. Every day.

My favorite was when they advertised l4d2, and there were censor blocks on screen when things happened. What they actually censored was the censorship effects. The game was unstandable visually, because it was rather a ghostbuster game and ghosts disappeared in thin air
BEFORE their shadow did !

That does not mean you have to play this broken