Are imports and exports totally broken?

[WingedArc]

So I did a test once I noticed that my city had excess of plenty of things but did not export anything when I build dock yards and cargo rail ports (The cargo rail ports so so badly designed by the way 1 track dead end who the heck thought of that) and even air ports but no exports happened,

So I decided to do a test on sandbox mode, Place only a rail yard down, hook it up and set up a route and again all that happened is despite not needing anything imported the game just decides to import 222 tonnes or random stuff every time the train comes back in.

Why there is no need for anything, I have also noticed that for some reason the industry in the area tend to just treat the cargo terminals, docks ect as if it is a warehouse for no reason, that is so dumb if they want a warehouse let us build them or zone them... But that would mean at least be giving us the ability to control what gets built in our industrial zones where as right now we just need to pray they build what we need, but that is a rant for a different day.

-Thanks for reading!

[anti678]

When I first placed my cargo train terminals they weren't doing anything for me. Now they are moving lots of goods in and out of my city for me. I also really like the warehouses. When I zone new industrial buildings near my cargo train, they will pull resources straight from that warehouse which saves a lot of time and reduces my overall traffic pretty decently.

As for the cargo harbor, I don't really have a use for it yet so I haven't really tested it. My cargo trains are keeping up with the demand pretty well so far.

Are these things "broken"? As in, do they not work at all? I haven't seen any evidence to support this yet except for hearsay. Which isn't strong evidence at all. In fact, all evidence I have witnessed personally, suggests the opposite.

If I had to guess, I would say that maybe your city just doesn't need a cargo train terminal yet. Or maybe you haven't given it enough time to work that into your cities system.

[c0hKaine]

You're correct. Export/Imports will even supplant your existing services should they be more convenient than your own. Import/Exports are probably the weakest and most unfounded mechanic in the game. Who are these connections? Do they have a population, statistic? Nothing. Because its fake.

[archonsod]

Originally posted by WingedArc:

So I did a test once I noticed that my city had excess of plenty of things but did not export anything when I build dock yards and cargo rail ports

They'll export if they can make more money doing so than selling locally. Simply having some excess isn't necessarily sufficient; Export prices are low to begin with, plus the transport cost along the export route is taken into account. Assuming the surplus is down to excess production it'll eventually build to the point the local prices drop low enough that exporting is worthwhile, but depending on the particular good it can require thousands of tons stockpiled (and assumes no increase in demand for said good in the meantime).

I have also noticed that for some reason the industry in the area tend to just treat the cargo terminals, docks ect as if it is a warehouse for no reason

Apart from the fact that cargo terminals are rather well known for their sizeable warehouses?

[Stealthy]

Originally posted by archonsod:

Originally posted by WingedArc:

So I did a test once I noticed that my city had excess of plenty of things but did not export anything when I build dock yards and cargo rail ports

They'll export if they can make more money doing so than selling locally. Simply having some excess isn't necessarily sufficient; Export prices are low to begin with, plus the transport cost along the export route is taken into account. Assuming the surplus is down to excess production it'll eventually build to the point the local prices drop low enough that exporting is worthwhile, but depending on the particular good it can require thousands of tons stockpiled (and assumes no increase in demand for said good in the meantime).

I have also noticed that for some reason the industry in the area tend to just treat the cargo terminals, docks ect as if it is a warehouse for no reason

Apart from the fact that cargo terminals are rather well known for their sizeable warehouses?

Yes. Exports are not automatic by any means, very much for the reasons you mentioned. But this doesn't prevent people from calling it "broken" when they haven't actually learned how they work. City up to 75 - 80k does rarely produce that much stuff that exports in large quantities make sense, especially with the commercial bug that shows endless demand and people build lot of consumption in their own cities keeping the local prices high.

Not enough customers complaint is actually related to availability of goods to sell, and those tell that there is a short supply on these items driving the local price for them or their raw materials high up, which then reduces the changes to export even further. Will be interesting to see if situation changes when they fix that commercial bug.

[AchoKaracho]

Originally posted by Stealthy:

Originally posted by archonsod:

They'll export if they can make more money doing so than selling locally. Simply having some excess isn't necessarily sufficient; Export prices are low to begin with, plus the transport cost along the export route is taken into account. Assuming the surplus is down to excess production it'll eventually build to the point the local prices drop low enough that exporting is worthwhile, but depending on the particular good it can require thousands of tons stockpiled (and assumes no increase in demand for said good in the meantime).

Apart from the fact that cargo terminals are rather well known for their sizeable warehouses?

Yes. Exports are not automatic by any means, very much for the reasons you mentioned. But this doesn't prevent people from calling it "broken" when they haven't actually learned how they work. City up to 75 - 80k does rarely produce that much stuff that exports in large quantities make sense, especially with the commercial bug that shows endless demand and people build lot of consumption in their own cities keeping the local prices high.

Not enough customers complaint is actually related to availability of goods to sell, and those tell that there is a short supply on these items driving the local price for them or their raw materials high up, which then reduces the changes to export even further. Will be interesting to see if situation changes when they fix that commercial bug.

I can confirm that
At first I thought nothing was being exported.
That's not the case.
After I switched on developer mode and looked at the whole system for several hours, I noticed everything you wrote.
Companies that reported “too few customers” didn’t have enough goods to sell in half of the cases.
After I built a new industrial area nearby, including a freight station, the complaining stopped because enough goods from other industrial areas were transported there by train into the new freight station.
The only people who still complained were the bars.
After further industrial areas were opened up, without me building any more businesses, the companies began to export goods via the freight station.
At the beginning only small quantities, now up to 200 tons of different goods.

[OZZO]

It's at least partially working.
I still need to see the breakdown of my payments to the outside world per product but some things have been certainly sorted by the devs since launch.
Now it feels that there are some glitches still but overall there is some sense.

[Stealthy]

Originally posted by OZZO:

It's at least partially working.
I still need to see the breakdown of my payments to the outside world per product but some things have been certainly sorted by the devs since launch.
Now it feels that there are some glitches still but overall there is some sense.

But you won't get the payments though. You get taxes from the profits companies make. And even if they export, it doesn't mean that it will affect your tax income.

[OZZO]

Originally posted by Stealthy:

Originally posted by OZZO:

It's at least partially working.
I still need to see the breakdown of my payments to the outside world per product but some things have been certainly sorted by the devs since launch.
Now it feels that there are some glitches still but overall there is some sense.

But you won't get the payments though. You get taxes from the profits companies make. And even if they export, it doesn't mean that it will affect your tax income.

Unfortunately, there is not enough data to confirm or deny this in the game. I really would like to see the numbers how my imports and exports convert into money, and not just tons. The goods probably don't have the same cost, so it would be good to know where the big ticket items money-wise.

And how much money do I pay or receive for outsourced services, etc.

[Stealthy]

Originally posted by OZZO:

Unfortunately, there is not enough data to confirm or deny this in the game. I really would like to see the numbers how my imports and exports convert into money, and not just tons. The goods probably don't have the same cost, so it would be good to know where the big ticket items money-wise.

And how much money do I pay or receive for outsourced services, etc.

Goods of any kind are never yours, value of them is irrelevant to you in that sense. You can try to track it from taxes certain industries pay, but that's about all you can do. Of course in statistics you see trade value for each product, maybe that helps a bit?

Again, goods price won't be big tickets for you. You can only tax companies which may or may not make profit and thus may or may not pay taxes.

[icedude94]

Originally posted by Geist:

Originally posted by Stealthy:

Goods of any kind are never yours, value of them is irrelevant to you in that sense. You can try to track it from taxes certain industries pay, but that's about all you can do. Of course in statistics you see trade value for each product, maybe that helps a bit?

Again, goods price won't be big tickets for you. You can only tax companies which may or may not make profit and thus may or may not pay taxes.

Hey stealthy you tested more of that stuff, can you tell me if reducing taxes for lets say oil industry will make oil imports from other cities cheaper for my producing industry as well? or does it only affect my own raw oil extracting industry?

Changing tax only affects the profits on your oil extracting industry. Honestly people should stop focusing on trying to get tax revenue from raw material extractors. They bring in very little money compared the actual factories selling manufactured goods or the commercial zones doing the sales.

[mikelleh63]

I believe most people havent looked too deep. I have about zero exports also, but I know why. I have a reasonable amount of industries, but am moving to a more tech economy with Offices. As shown below, I have almost no exportable items other than Immaterial Goods, which is software, requiring no shipping. If you think exporting is broke, go into your production tab and see how much surplus youi have of anything. Now how much deficit on consumer goods? Here is what mine looks like....it isnt broken.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3084262900

[Stealthy]

Originally posted by Geist:

Hey stealthy you tested more of that stuff, can you tell me if reducing taxes for lets say oil industry will make oil imports from other cities cheaper for my producing industry as well? or does it only affect my own raw oil extracting industry?

It won't make imports cheaper, but it allows you to balance your industry to match your city's demand. And it also helps to keep companies profitable as less of their monies are taken out as taxes.

For example, when you get "not enough customers" on commercial, check the type of goods it sells. Let's say it is food. Now, reduce taxes on food industries or even subsidy them. Then zone a little bit more commercial. Now these new companies are food industries or old ones expanding and soon your commercial will have enough goods to sell and complaint goes away.

Yes, it is very counter-intuitive to use "not enough customers" as a notification when that is caused by the lack of goods to sell. In a way it is of course correct, why would customers come to an empty shop? But it would be more helpful to players to get the real reason behind the customer shortage.

[Stealthy]

Originally posted by Geist:

I don't want to get tax rrevenue from it I hoped that I could make imports cheaper because I don't want to produce localy (the largest oil field is directly under my downtown area... )

Well, this can work with reduced taxes, as I explained earlier. Companies retain more of their monies and that makes them more wealthy. And when they are wealthy, they are doing ok. So in a way you compensate more expensive goods to them via tax rebates. Happens in real life too.

[AchoKaracho]

Originally posted by OZZO:

Originally posted by Stealthy:

But you won't get the payments though. You get taxes from the profits companies make. And even if they export, it doesn't mean that it will affect your tax income.

Unfortunately, there is not enough data to confirm or deny this in the game. I really would like to see the numbers how my imports and exports convert into money, and not just tons. The goods probably don't have the same cost, so it would be good to know where the big ticket items money-wise.

And how much money do I pay or receive for outsourced services, etc.

You can check the import/export tab
if i remember correct its in outside connection