Valheim's Fatal Flaw?

[Bullwinkle]

I'm trying to give this game a fair chance. I'm about 10 hours in, and I'm enjoying it quite a bit. But I just did some research on leveling bows, and one dude said it takes 1000 arrows to get from level 24 to 36. Another dude said it takes 350 arrows to get from level 83 to 84. That got me thinking about how I spent an entire game day running circles around my shack to increase my run skill, which I managed to raise to level 18, and the day I spent swimming in circles just to raise that skill.

So I have a question for the experienced players: does this game degrade at higher levels into just shooting rocks, running/swimming circles, punching/clubbing trees, etc? Seems like this game encourages you to spend a lot of time doing things that aren't fun. But I'm so new, I can't really know yet. What do y'all think?

[Cake for Mumm-Ra]

Publicado originalmente por Weaver:

Sparrows numbers are incorrect, the skill effect is much more impactful.
For instance each lvl of a weapon skill increases damage by 1%, so skills are super important, literally doubling your damage. Furthermore bows draw 1% faster per skill level, meaning at 100 you can Insta fire a full draw/perfect aim, meaning almost no stamina use as well.
A high skill archer can spam a rain of arrows while running around and have stamina left in the same time it takes a low skill one to fire a couple times and run out of stamina standing in place.
With Sprint you move up to 20% faster with 50% less stamina drain at 100 vs 1, and Jump you jump 1% further/higher per lvl.
So skills are as big a factor as gear.
That being said largely you shouldn't bother actively training them up, as they'll increase naturally through play. It's not essential to grind them, just like it's not essential to max out your gear currently.

Well, I stand corrected. I guess it's a matter of playstyle preference. I prefer to ignore skills and thinking about how to maximize damage, etc., but if what you're saying is true then I can totally appreciate people who do want to power level for those big gains.

[Quineloe]

Publicado originalmente por Sir Sparrow:

*You wake up*
*The ground was shaking*

Easily circumvented by working out on an island somewhere without a workshop.

[Atma]

Publicado originalmente por Weaver:

Publicado originalmente por Bullwinkle:

Thanks for the thoughtful replies! Only 40% more dmg with max skills sounds like max skill isn't so important. Good to know the late game doesn't fall apart from this.

I'm pleased with the results I got from power leveling run and swim at start of game, but it sounds like later on it isn't so important.

It's 100% more damage not 40%.

This is not entirely accurate.

The damage maximum is limited by the base damage of the weapon which occurs at level 75. Further leveling only increases the minimum damage.

Your 90 damage sword isn't suddenly going to be 180 damage because you have 100 skill level.

[Sir Sparrow]

Publicado originalmente por Atma:

Publicado originalmente por Weaver:

It's 100% more damage not 40%.

This is not entirely accurate.

The damage maximum is limited by the base damage of the weapon which occurs at level 75. Further leveling only increases the minimum damage.

Your 90 damage sword isn't suddenly going to be 180 damage because you have 100 skill level.

Well, the wiki's pages on skills are not completed yet, so it's hard to know for sure. It's said there that damage is increased by 0.6% per level for swords and stamina drainage is lowered by 0.3%. And I assume that this goes for other weapons also, since...why would it not? The base damage...'numbers' are the almost the same for almost all weapon types, so it wouldn't make much sense if some weapons would gain more advantages for leveling than others.

[Nerd.Gamer.Dave]

I'm over 200 hours in and never once even cared about leveling up. A level 4 bronze sword kills most enemies in the first 3 biomes with 2-3 swings regardless of any skill value.

Worrying about leveling up skills is NOT what this game is based on.

[The Big Brzezinski]

I beat all five bosses solo, and never once worried about my skills. They did not grant me any new capabilities as they increased. They just weren't important.

Preparation, planning, and patience are what make you truly powerful in Valheim. There's a reason why the cover art is a scene of guys sitting around a fire, not a battle scene.

[Humpenstilzchen]

You don´t need to do any of this, just play the game and the skills you use will go up on their own. Don´t destroy the fun of the game by hardcore grinding skills.

[Atma]

Publicado originalmente por Sir Sparrow:

Publicado originalmente por Atma:

This is not entirely accurate.

The damage maximum is limited by the base damage of the weapon which occurs at level 75. Further leveling only increases the minimum damage.

Your 90 damage sword isn't suddenly going to be 180 damage because you have 100 skill level.

Well, the wiki's pages on skills are not completed yet, so it's hard to know for sure. It's said there that damage is increased by 0.6% per level for swords and stamina drainage is lowered by 0.3%. And I assume that this goes for other weapons also, since...why would it not? The base damage...'numbers' are the almost the same for almost all weapon types, so it wouldn't make much sense if some weapons would gain more advantages for leveling than others.

While the wiki is always going to be subject to some discrepancy due to being a wiki, you can pretty easily test this yourself in game using the console.

When looking at the tooltip for your equipped weapon, there is the base damage of the weapon and the expected damage based on your skill level to the right of that.

This is a screenshot of a character with level 8 Polearms skill using an Atgeir:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2450690961

This is a screenshot of the same character with level 100 Polearms skill:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2450711803

You can see that even at 100 skill, the expected damage does not exceed the base damage of the weapon he is holding.

It doesn't double your damage, it increases the min-max damage output, but caps at the base damage of the weapon you're using.

[ZDE]

People complaining about losing 5% of skill ... When my character dies, I delete him and start a new one (on the same map, all bases are there etc...) The big pain is losing the map. But hey, I shouldn't have die. But you can play the game the way you like... there is a console that can help you with that.

[Sir Sparrow]

Publicado originalmente por Atma:

Publicado originalmente por Sir Sparrow:

Well, the wiki's pages on skills are not completed yet, so it's hard to know for sure. It's said there that damage is increased by 0.6% per level for swords and stamina drainage is lowered by 0.3%. And I assume that this goes for other weapons also, since...why would it not? The base damage...'numbers' are the almost the same for almost all weapon types, so it wouldn't make much sense if some weapons would gain more advantages for leveling than others.

While the wiki is always going to be subject to some discrepancy due to being a wiki, you can pretty easily test this yourself in game using the console.

When looking at the tooltip for your equipped weapon, there is the base damage of the weapon and the expected damage based on your skill level to the right of that.

This is a screenshot of a character with level 8 Polearms skill using an Atgeir:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2450690961

This is a screenshot of the same character with level 100 Polearms skill:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2450711803

You can see that even at 100 skill, the expected damage does not exceed the base damage of the weapon he is holding.

It doesn't double your damage, it increases the min-max damage output, but caps at the base damage of the weapon you're using.

Yep, that much I know. In that case it's just a comparison of your 'lowered' (compared to weapon's max base damage) damage on level 1 and your damage on level 100 and measuring how big the difference is.

[Atma]

Still limited by the weapon you're swinging of course, but I imagine you could do some dps tests using against mobs or objects to show potential gains based on skill level.

I don't really have the inclination or time right now to do that lol.

Was more just trying to show that it's not just a straight "you do double damage at max skill level" relationship, because it might be confusing for someone who just reads 1% damage per skill level.

Just wanted to show that it's still capped by the base damage of the weapon you're holding.

[Sir Sparrow]

Publicado originalmente por Atma:

Still limited by the weapon you're swinging of course, but I imagine you could do some dps tests using against mobs or objects to show potential gains based on skill level.

I don't really have the inclination or time right now to do that lol.

Was more just trying to show that it's not just a straight "you do double damage at max skill level" relationship, because it might be confusing for someone who just reads 1% damage per skill level.

Just wanted to show that it's still capped by the base damage of the weapon you're holding.

Oh well it's much more easy. You take the 'lowered' lvl 1 damage (14-27), find the arithmetic mean ((14+27)\2 = 20.5) and compared to the 'normal' weapon damage at lvl 100 ((38+45)\2 = 41.5) aaaand yea, the difference is a bit more than 100%.

[TGC> The Games Collector]

eh, I just smack a few rocks to get everything to level 10.
It's good enough at that point, and levelling it by smacking a few enemies around is more effective anyway. You get more exp from that.

Most useful skill to level up might be the bow, since you can draw faster, but that's about it.

Generally Skill only gives a tiny bonus.

[I-Chi]

Publicado originalmente por TGC> The Games Collector:

Most useful skill to level up might be the bow, since you can draw faster, but that's about it.

Generally Skill only gives a tiny bonus.

If we can draw the bow in half the time, we increase our DPS by 100%.

***

Playing normally, i.e. without explicitly e.g. running against the wall to increase the run skill, the skill penalty on death means, on average, a player who dies less will have higher skills. I.e. skill level is a reflection of how good the player is, not how much time spent in game.

[Rungar]

i think the game would be better without any "skills" to level up. They just aren't needed. I beat all 5 bosses and i looked at the skills page maybe 3 times.