Tsar Stone Nerf

[JackBaldy]

So how are we supposed to gather Tsar stones now on a single character to have a complete set of Tsar armor and Tsar weaponry? Curious.

[EzPaz(Niyaniya's dog)]

you dont, you gather them with multiple playthrough.

[JackBaldy]

Originally posted by CrazyPazzy:

you dont, you gather them with multiple playthrough.

Explain the process because I'm not sure you've done the math.

[Ivara Ara]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-v1R0-xjUlk&list=WL&index=65&t=0s

[JackBaldy]

Originally posted by Ruben T:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-v1R0-xjUlk&list=WL&index=65&t=0s

You realise that I'm talking about this very specific thing that you linked and how it was nerfed in the upcoming patch that is currently in the beta branch of this game? O.o... o.O... Why bother posting if you're not even going to bother to read even the slightest bit? Curious.

[Dharc]

just create a new character, run to the graveyard - grab the tsar stone and trade it over with split screen / co op

thats basically as fast if not faster than having to sleep for 7 days per tsar stone

[Ivara Ara]

Originally posted by JackBaldy:

Originally posted by Ruben T:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-v1R0-xjUlk&list=WL&index=65&t=0s

You realise that I'm talking about this very specific thing that you linked and how it was nerfed in the upcoming patch that is currently in the beta branch of this game? O.o... o.O... Why bother posting if you're not even going to bother to read even the slightest bit? Curious.

And how do you expect everyone to keep updated on everything, first off it is a experimental build, not fully released yet. Hence you can still farm it before it gets changed, and you keep forgetting that multiple chars is a thing. Everything can be farmed with multiple chars.

Maybe next time don't be a tool and act normally?

[JackBaldy]

Originally posted by 刀卄卂尺匚:

just create a new character, run to the graveyard - grab the tsar stone and trade it over with split screen / co op

thats basically as fast if not faster than having to sleep for 7 days per tsar stone

So the answer to an unreasonable change is to splitscreen cheese? Seems legit.

Originally posted by Ruben T:

And how do you expect everyone to keep updated on everything, first off it is a experimental build, not fully released yet. Hence you can still farm it before it gets changed, and you keep forgetting that multiple chars is a thing. Everything can be farmed with multiple chars.

Maybe next time don't be a tool and act normally?

The thread with the patch notes is literally stickied on the very same forums that you're utilizing. Furthermore, the thread title is strictly speaking about Tsar Stone *Nerf*. There's a keyword there. The slightest bit of reading comprehension would lead to believe that there was some kind of change.

Hell, the opening post clearly indicates that there's some change. So even if you somehow managed to miss the stickied thread with the patch notes, all you have to do is read a little. But that's asking too much of you, right? Maybe next time, you try reading a little. Even if it hurts the few brain cells that you have left.

But wait, there's more. You literally posted in the stickied thread with the patch notes. Apparently you didn't even bother reading them. This is hilarious.

[LOG3]

Sorry if Im wrong, just and Idea: maybe its possible to put the tsar stones in the legacy chest and collect them with a new character? Would be a legit way

[carl]

Originally posted by LOG3:

Sorry if Im wrong, just and Idea: maybe its possible to put the tsar stones in the legacy chest and collect them with a new character? Would be a legit way

That's how I think the devs intended it. If you want to do it the legit way that's not abusing the splitscreen trading it's very tedious as you need atleast 3 playthroughs to get the full armor set as there are only 4 legacy chests per playthrough and the chestpiece alone costs 6x stones (you can only get 5 max per playthrough without abusing the Tsar ghost farm). This really needs a revision.

[rasabt]

yeah, my thinks they need to rethink this patch.
i don't quite get the thought process behind this change...are you supposed to cheese/abuse the co-op?
even legacy chests would be an unreasonable hassle.
Outward is not a mmo or a competative-online-arena-BR-shooter.
powergrind is kinda part of the allure of these games, no matter if it's Gothic, Risen, Elex, Form Software games...what have you, heck even Immortal Unchained (probably the hardest of the bunch) know this.
it's an experimental branch so i hope they do listen to player-feedback.

[JackBaldy]

I have to agree with the previous two posts. It's obvious the legacy system is not what it was supposed to be given that it's much more convenient and easy to just use the readily available split-screen method to trade items. And there are remnants of what may have been in the form of that skill tablet that is not usable in the game among other interesting tidbits found if one looks a bit further. :Cough: Character retirement and legacy levels. :Cough:

In any case, lets say that you were to forego utilizing the split-screen method. You can only attain 5 Tsar stones per playthrough without the ghost respawning. You need a total of 11 for the armor set alone. 14 for all the weapons and the shield. That's a total of 25 Tsar stones if you want a complete collection. And given that there's really not much in the way of progress, collecting items is something that can keep you busy.

But this is just not all that feasible. You can send over 4 Tsar stones via the Legacy system to one character. This character can craft the Tsar armor and the Tsar boots. Then they can send over those pieces over to another character via the Legacy system. This character can craft the
Tsar helmet and have 3 Tsar stones left over. That's enough for 3 one-handed weapons/shield or 1 two-handed weapon and 1 one-handed weapon/shield.

In the end, the total number of Tsar stones that were utilized is 14. All that trouble and it still falls quite short given that you need a total of 25 Tsar stones to have a complete collection.

Reasonably speaking, no one in their right mind will go through this hassle to not even get a complete collection when you can just split-screen cheese. But why are developers making design choices that encourage doing this when previously that was not the case? This boggles my mind and I just cannot agree with this decision.

Not to mention, are they completely oblivious to the fact that split-screen exists and that people will use it to circumvent their very questionable decisions? Path of least resistance and all. :Shrugs:

[Siliarus]

Originally posted by JackBaldy:

I have to agree with the previous two posts. It's obvious the legacy system is not what it was supposed to be given that it's much more convenient and easy to just use the readily available split-screen method to trade items. And there are remnants of what may have been in the form of that skill tablet that is not usable in the game among other interesting tidbits found if one looks a bit further. :Cough: Character retirement and legacy levels. :Cough:

In any case, lets say that you were to forego utilizing the split-screen method. You can only attain 5 Tsar stones per playthrough without the ghost respawning. You need a total of 11 for the armor set alone. 14 for all the weapons and the shield. That's a total of 25 Tsar stones if you want a complete collection. And given that there's really not much in the way of progress, collecting items is something that can keep you busy.

But this is just not all that feasible. You can send over 4 Tsar stones via the Legacy system to one character. This character can craft the Tsar armor and the Tsar boots. Then they can send over those pieces over to another character via the Legacy system. This character can craft the
Tsar helmet and have 3 Tsar stones left over. That's enough for 3 one-handed weapons/shield or 1 two-handed weapon and 1 one-handed weapon/shield.

In the end, the total number of Tsar stones that were utilized is 14. All that trouble and it still falls quite short given that you need a total of 25 Tsar stones to have a complete collection.

Reasonably speaking, no one in their right mind will go through this hassle to not even get a complete collection when you can just split-screen cheese. But why are developers making design choices that encourage doing this when previously that was not the case? This boggles my mind and I just cannot agree with this decision.

Not to mention, are they completely oblivious to the fact that split-screen exists and that people will use it to circumvent their very questionable decisions? Path of least resistance and all. :Shrugs:

Uff, reading on how you are supposed to get that (I am nowhere near that far in game yet) I was thinking I would probably just end up getting as many as I can with one toon and cheat the rest with debug mode if I wanted to play with that set. Otherwise I wouldn't bother getting it at all and just play around something else.

[Kluxx]

Originally posted by JackBaldy:

Reasonably speaking, no one in their right mind will go through this hassle to not even get a complete collection when you can just split-screen cheese. But why are developers making design choices that encourage doing this when previously that was not the case? This boggles my mind and I just cannot agree with this decision.

Not to mention, are they completely oblivious to the fact that split-screen exists and that people will use it to circumvent their very questionable decisions? Path of least resistance and all. :Shrugs:

Hit the nail on the head. This change to prevent farming tsar stones is a little silly as the gear itself is not always best in slot for even melee character builds. (except the shield) This sort of change makes tsar stones extremely rare to the point where its near impractical to get tsar gear without exploiting the debug console/split-screen.

They are turning what was already tedious farming with sleeping/respawning and making it so you must jump through more hoops for the same payoff.

This really just seems like a nerf to force the legacy system (at least in theory), but I think that is too much of an ask for a relatively underwhelming reward compared to other strong items. (THAT ARE MUCH EASIER TO OBTAIN) This just doesn't make much sense imo and couldn't agree more with the above poster.

Sure, the tsar gear isn't that bad, but they really didn't need a nerf with their acquisition because again, you can earn other strong artifact gear with comparable or even superior (i.e. faster and more elemental damage) stats. (durability is the main thing tsar has going for it) Sure, you may not have as high physical damage/resistances, but at least you won't move and attack as slow. In my view, the tsar armor is not strong enough in a relative sense for making it harder than it already is to obtain. (already requires a time-sink, this change just makes it impractical to go for)

Just my 2 cents.

[JackBaldy]

Originally posted by Kluxx:

This really just seems like a nerf to force the legacy system (at least in theory), but I think that is too much of an ask for a relatively underwhelming reward compared to other strong items. (THAT ARE MUCH EASIER TO OBTAIN) This just doesn't make much sense imo and couldn't agree more with the above poster.

If they are really trying to force people to utilize the Legacy system, one has to wonder if they realise that it's relatively trivial to utilize split-screen for a myriad of shortcuts. Even if they are stubborn about keeping this in the patch when it goes live, do they realise how easy it would be to circumvent this, even on consoles?

Like someone already mentioned in this thread, start a new character, have your main character join in with Gaberry Wine (Which is not the hardest thing to obtain and all you would need is 25 total), and run over to the tombstone. You can run past nearly everything if not everything without ever engaging in combat and with your main character more than likely being of higher strength, things should be trivial in Chersonese should the need arise.

Grab the Tsar stone, rinse and repeat until you have 25. But why are they forcing people to go through these absurd hoops instead of providing a reasonable alternative? Beats the hell out of me.

[Tymon]

At most, you can get 5 Tsar stones per character now. And considering the weapons and armor cater to basically only a single play style (Tanky and slow but hard hitting physical melee build only) I find it absurd that it is that much work to make, myself. Thankfully, I've made every Tsar armor piece and every weapon and shield and honestly find them to be garbage, the change doesn't bother me one bit. However... For people who do go for this play style it's a huge slap in the face. But what really gets me personally is that the tsar stuff isn't even some universal best of everything armor and weapons. Why is it easier to get relic weapons which honestly if you compare buffs+infusion+their base speed greatly out DPS tsar stuff? Only thing you can truly say is the best of everything is the shield since it has the highest impact reduction+infinite durability.