Neverwinter Nights: Enhanced Edition

Neverwinter Nights: Enhanced Edition

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Zolvolt Oct 13, 2024 @ 12:07am
I thought a turn was shorter than a round
I've played this game for years and TIL that these "1turn" and "2turn" spells that I never use actually last 10 and 20 rounds and I'm dumb. Thanks for coming to my ted talk
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Showing 1-12 of 12 comments
zeeb Oct 13, 2024 @ 1:19am 
I have no idea why they made a turn shorter than a round, should be the other way around. I'm not talking about NWN specifically either, but D&D as a whole.

A turn in my mind is an individual's act, while a round in my mind encompasses everyone involved.

It's just weird.
Last edited by zeeb; Oct 13, 2024 @ 1:19am
Zolvolt Oct 13, 2024 @ 2:07am 
Originally posted by zeeb:
I have no idea why they made a turn shorter than a round, should be the other way around. I'm not talking about NWN specifically either, but D&D as a whole.

A turn in my mind is an individual's act, while a round in my mind encompasses everyone involved.

It's just weird.
Honestly yeah, Idk why we even needed "turns" in the nwn sense be a thing. Just put "10 rounds" "20 rounds" etc.
zeeb Oct 13, 2024 @ 8:03am 
Originally posted by Zolvolt:
Originally posted by zeeb:
I have no idea why they made a turn shorter than a round, should be the other way around. I'm not talking about NWN specifically either, but D&D as a whole.

A turn in my mind is an individual's act, while a round in my mind encompasses everyone involved.

It's just weird.
Honestly yeah, Idk why we even needed "turns" in the nwn sense be a thing. Just put "10 rounds" "20 rounds" etc.
Yeah, even seconds would've been better since it's not really "turn based" in that sense either.

Haha, but oh well.
Last edited by zeeb; Oct 13, 2024 @ 8:03am
jchaosmaster Oct 13, 2024 @ 8:38am 
I think for two small reason and a big reason. As i once stated if you have Legit friends and the module you could have up to 12 Allie NPC attacking at once which would be a cluster. I get that number because 4 with two summons up at once and planty of classes have summons along with item that provide. Second to help the game have a numerical progression as you increase your stats. where modern games have a hopefully a mecanical progression a numerical works well with all the different numbers in this game. Another reason i think for the Semi turn base is again how number driven the systems are.

While i agree it didn't have to be like this and it could have been a pure action game but doing that would lose the small amount of stra cheese there is in the game.
Nordil(Hun) Oct 13, 2024 @ 10:45am 
Originally posted by zeeb:
I have no idea why they made a turn shorter than a round, should be the other way around. I'm not talking about NWN specifically either, but D&D as a whole.

A turn in my mind is an individual's act, while a round in my mind encompasses everyone involved.

It's just weird.

Well my guess is because rounds are usually measured in minutes. Boxing and the like.
And turns were always you do something press enter and the turn ends:)
So they made one turn be 6 secs and one round be 10 turns:P
zeeb Oct 13, 2024 @ 1:31pm 
Originally posted by Nordil(Hun):
Originally posted by zeeb:
I have no idea why they made a turn shorter than a round, should be the other way around. I'm not talking about NWN specifically either, but D&D as a whole.

A turn in my mind is an individual's act, while a round in my mind encompasses everyone involved.

It's just weird.

Well my guess is because rounds are usually measured in minutes. Boxing and the like.
And turns were always you do something press enter and the turn ends:)
So they made one turn be 6 secs and one round be 10 turns:P
1 Round = 6 Seconds. 1 Turn = 10 Rounds.
Or have they switched it up yet again? Just goes to show how needlessly confusing it is.
Last edited by zeeb; Oct 13, 2024 @ 1:32pm
Ninja Oct 14, 2024 @ 9:09am 
Round is shorter than turn, Zeeb is correct. 1 round = 6 seconds. 1 turn = 10 rounds/1 minute. At least in NWN/3e.

I'm guessing this was done to try to simplify the numbers. You'd rather work with smaller values than larger. You wouldn't say 200 cents, you'd say 2 dollars, or whatever currency equivalent. Or copper, silver, gold, platinum coins in some D&D games. I'm not sure why 'round' and 'turn' were used originally.

Different editions use rounds and turns differently, though. I haven't played much 2nd Edition but the terminology and meanings were (I think): 1 round was 1 minute, and 1 turn was 10 rounds/10 minutes. And a 'segment' was 6 seconds. Your attack/action for the round/1 minute of battle was supposed to represent a longer battle between you and the enemy. If you were an archer and your action for the round was to shoot and hit with an arrow, the span of that 1 minute had your character doing various things that resulted in you hitting the enemy. They wanted it to feel like an all-out, chaotic, drawn out battle.

5e (Again, I think) is more in line what the OP is thinking, in that a turn is "shorter" than a round. A turn is whatever you decide to do as your action. There's no time associated with it. It's just "your turn". A round is 6 seconds, and when everyone executes their turn a new round starts. I guess a turn could be said as 6 seconds or less if you wanted to be specific. So if 5 people are in combat there's 5 turns in that round, and everyone's actions are technically going on pretty much simultaneously for 6 seconds (Give or take). In 5e they made combat/actions more streamlined in relation to time. I *think* this is the case anyway, but someone can correct me.
Modman Oct 14, 2024 @ 12:46pm 
In every edition before 3rd (except Basic), rounds were one minute long.

Even at six seconds, dungeons and dragons combat is an abstraction. 'Number of attacks per round' is actually intended as 'number of effective attacks per round'. In DnD, aside from declared actions, it is assumed you are engaged in exchanging blows, dodging, circling, resting, etc. However, none of the rest of that is 'effective', it just sets you up for the 'effective' attacks or actions you can attempt.

If that is a little abstract, then hit points are very abstract. They aren't a measure of your health, or at least not entirely. In fact, they are only a little bit health and the rest is actually... luck. Go back and read the description of hit points in the older editions. A person can't actually be struck all that many times by a sword and still walk around, not like how many people interpret DnD at least. If hit points were a measure of just health, then in DnD, almost all humans would have around four hit points. That means they are likely to be killed by a single sword stroke but may survive (1d8), and a single dagger may kill them but likely just wound them severely (1d4). However, as 'heroic figures', luck often turns what would have been a lethal strike into just a scratch, which is what hit points represent and why you gain them as you become more heroic (level up). What is even weirder is that in 5e, hit points are defined as 'how tough your character is in different situations' (PHB p.12). This implies that your character in 5e can actually let people jab them with spears then walk it off and be healed after just a short rest. That is bizarre, not heroic.

Honestly, DnD is a terrible system to try to adapt into anything other than an old school turn based simulator, as that is really the only type of game that rigidly enforces turn-taking. The game isn't intended to be used in anything remotely real-time. That said, the developers here did a decent job of trying to shoehorn an abstract turn-based game into a more literal real-time game, but it won't be perfect. No adaptation that isn't strictly turn based will ever be a faithful adaptation of DnD. Video games which create rules that work alongside the engine are actually far more enjoyable, and you don't have angry fans yelling at you online for not being completely faithful to their beloved ruleset. The Elder Scrolls games did this fairly well, as an example.

I digress. Turns and rounds are indeed confusing, with turns meant for non-combat and rounds meant for combat. Poor word choice. But, the developers of this game didn't actually come up with the names, they got them from 3e. Also, WotC abandoned 'turns' in 5e. We are kind of stuck with turns and rounds as this game specifically has a license for the 3e rule set, I believe.
wendigo211 Oct 14, 2024 @ 3:50pm 
It is D&D terminology, 10 rounds=1 turn. However, the devs could have simply called the turn/level spells, minute/level spells and avoided some confusion. It wouldn't work with hour/level spells (which are actually 2 minute/level spells) since a module maker can change the length of an hour.
Last edited by wendigo211; Oct 14, 2024 @ 4:18pm
Modman Oct 14, 2024 @ 4:45pm 
Originally posted by wendigo211:
It is D&D terminology, 10 rounds=1 turn. However, the devs could have simply called the turn/level spells, minute/level spells and avoided some confusion. It wouldn't work with hour/level spells (which are actually 2 minute/level spells) since a module maker can change the length of an hour.

Again, I don't think the devs could have renamed anything. They were using specifically the 3e DnD rules, and not some house variant with different terminology. Some spells in 3e have durations of turns/level. If you'd rather not play by 3e rules, then NWN2 has 3.5e rules, but I still think they have 'turns/level'.

Just for fun:

In ODND, there were no rounds, combat was even more abstract and initiative more important.

In 1st and 2nd ed, rounds were a minute long and turns were ten minutes long.

In basic, rounds were ten seconds long and there were no 'turns'. Well, you would take your turn in that ten second round, so there were normal turns.

In 3rd and on, rounds were and are the six seconds rounds. In 3rd through 4th, a turn was indeed a minute or ten rounds. In 5th, there's again no 'turns' as a unit of time, just normal turns.
Nordil(Hun) Oct 15, 2024 @ 12:24pm 
Originally posted by zeeb:
Originally posted by Nordil(Hun):

Well my guess is because rounds are usually measured in minutes. Boxing and the like.
And turns were always you do something press enter and the turn ends:)
So they made one turn be 6 secs and one round be 10 turns:P
1 Round = 6 Seconds. 1 Turn = 10 Rounds.
Or have they switched it up yet again? Just goes to show how needlessly confusing it is.

Might have confused them:)
When i play i know the difference, but was ages ago last i booted up the game:)
Mordaedil Oct 19, 2024 @ 6:12am 
In AD&D, a turn "in the dungeon" lasts 10 minutes. In combat, turn is further divided into 10 melee rounds. Rounds are divided into 10 segments. A turn is 10 minutes, a round was 1 minute and a segment was 6 rounds.

For AD&D 2nd edition, they dropped segments and moved this down. The reference to turns in NWN is a holdover from 2nd edition, it is no longer used in 3rd edition onward, only using rounds to refer to 6 seconds and minutes to refer to... Well, minutes. And 10 minutes and hours etc.
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Date Posted: Oct 13, 2024 @ 12:07am
Posts: 12