So I heard you like elevated levels

[chrisbors]

My god so far 75% of the first zone maps bring a whole new mearning to "I HAVE THE HIGH GROUND ANAKIN"
Does it ever get better? Its starting to get no fun constantly getting maps where I'm just getting pummelled from super high up while I'm struggling to get my units up there before my healer and/or mage is dead.

[Conan The Librarian]

Chrisbors-

I would like to point out that with the exception of one passive which gets a “high ground” bonus, there is no difference between high and low ground.

[chrisbors]

Uhhh. There is a huge advantage if my entire team is very low on the map, while the entire enemy team is high up where i cant target them with my units because of elevation. I'm not talking about stat increases, I'm simply talking about the difficulty of reaching all those archers/mages/gamblers that are very high up on the level compared to mine.

[Conan The Librarian]

Originally posted by chrisbors:

Uhhh. There is a huge advantage if my entire team is very low on the map, while the entire enemy team is high up where i cant target them with my units because of elevation. I'm not talking about stat increases, I'm simply talking about the difficulty of reaching all those archers/mages/gamblers that are very high up on the level compared to mine.

It’s the same whether it’s up or down—vertical values for both movement and attacks are EXACTLY THE SAME whether up or down. If you “cannot reach them” then:

1. If you have boots available, give them to your melee heroes to be able to jump up more or get there faster.

2. Utilize ranged and magic heroes yourself.

All the tools the AI has and all the rules are the same.

The fact that “they’re over there” and “you’re over there” isn’t an asymmetrical situation—same rules.

[chrisbors]

lol

[Persownage]

lol

[Lasci]

To answer your question: No. You're right in that the early game is filled with stages that have you starting at the bottom of a height disadvantage, but as you progress the maps become a bit more flat or the starting positions more even. That said, there are definitely instances where you're going to be surrounded or put in a disadvantageous position.

It's worth mentioning that Fell Seal is really forgiving when it comes to height discrepancies, though. There are no line of sight or height penalties for ranged attackers other than the vertical allowance of attacks, which affects both those who have the high ground and those who don't. Additionally, it's very easy to raise the jump capability of your characters -- there are several boots accessories that you can craft in the party menu or buy from shops, and you can put more than one of these on a character to further increase their jump range.

[Tuidjy]

Originally posted by Lasci:

There are no line of sight or height penalties for ranged attackers other than the vertical allowance of attacks, which affects both those who have the high ground and those who don't.

There is actually a passive ability which gives you a significant advantage for attacking from higher ground. But apart from that, you are right, having the higher ground would not help anyone without that passive.

[OnlyOffensive]

most maps, especially patrols odds are against you. Thats the point, you are playing against AI, so it needs a bit of advatage.

[Sdric]

I have to disagree a bit with you Conan. Resting Giants is a good example - you cramped up and the jump requirements are relatively high to progress vertically near the starting zone. As a result you're forced to move down a narrow path which makes you more vulnerable to AoE, while your opponent has far less jump high requirements and can move more free in his starting zone. The opponent can spread and position its units more freely.

As the open poster is talking about starting maps he might not have access to that many good jump height+ items.

P.S. @chrisbors it will be getting better, but most maps will remain a bit rigged against you. You're free to replay maps as you like, so leveling or playing for fun will be without any hindrances for you :)

[Dorok]

Well Conan comments are still valid, you are pinpointing another aspect, it's that terrain design matter and for many it's nothing symmetrical. But it's not a matter of being at bottom or top, with the only exception of pushing to make fall, or if your characters or many enemies have the passive skill giving a bonus for heights.

I understand the problem of combats design that led dev to not give a bonus to height but through one passive skill. Even XCOM2 choose that simplification too.

It's still a complexity/tactical element removed, but it would probably require wider maps, longer ranges.

[lavexis]

resting giants !

wait till you reach the fire temple on at least hard mode
that map was tough for me

[Conan The Librarian]

My point is that it has nothing to do with “high / low ground” in itself. Terrain is terrain yes, but the fact that it’s “high” in itself doesn’t mean anything in comparison to if it were “low”. I just want to dispel this myth about the “high ground” that some people mention.

[Dorok]

Originally posted by lavexis:

resting giants !

wait till you reach the fire temple on at least hard mode
that map was tough for me

Well this map was somehow tougher, but not a spike like few could have been. It's possible I lost it once the first time, and lost another time during patrols, like one out of three, when usually it's more none. Difficulty level could influence it, I play at Veteran.

In that map I found easier not bother climb to enemies. Also a trap when you use long range is move them too far. If I remember well I tend build a solid roster with good healing abilities and at least one long range preferably two. I favor less mages, like one but also with healing or support abilities.

[chrisbors]

Ah some actually helpful responses. Thanks Sdric that's what I was kinda hoping for :)

[Dorok]

Well I'm not sure it's a that good option to have all team equipped to jump high then weakened a bit on some other aspects, and then move up the whole team to assault enemies.

It should be easier to use bottom as a base until you killed a few enemies, From this base you can move up a bit at the right, and there's a good position to hold with a long range, at right, isolated behind a tree.

You can also expand a bit at bottom left without to move up much.

Once some enemies are killed it's easier to move up.