The Dragon's Tooth Sword and The Rule of Cool

[LukeTheSp00k]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9n3DgvHL6o&list=PLPpGPVgHJ_Winlot5FY6JmcvKX0Bu0NCk&index=8

Glowy sword > logic and game balance, evidently.

[dirigibalistic]

Originally posted by TheFilthyCasual:

Glowy sword > logic and game balance, evidently.

Well... obviously.

[Francisè von Spitroast]

Aren't you that troll who doesn't know how to play the game and has no life and does nothing but make threads on why you think this game sucks?

[LukeTheSp00k]

Originally posted by Back Door Man:

Aren't you that troll who doesn't know how to play the game and has no life and does nothing but make threads on why you think this game sucks?

Someone's salty

[BOT Cecil]

Not sure what you mean with logic and game balance. It's a nano sword which can cut through pretty much anything. Where's the problem in that?

[LukeTheSp00k]

Originally posted by Sl1ngShot:

Not sure what you mean with logic and game balance. It's a nano sword which can cut through pretty much anything. Where's the problem in that?

The way its used as a plot MacGuffin is ludicrous (logic) and it's completely overpowered which negates the purpose of the other melee weapons and the melee skill (balance). Did you watch it? I explain that.

[BOT Cecil]

Originally posted by TheFilthyCasual:

Originally posted by Sl1ngShot:

Not sure what you mean with logic and game balance. It's a nano sword which can cut through pretty much anything. Where's the problem in that?

The way its used as a plot MacGuffin is ludicrous (logic) and it's completely overpowered which negates the purpose of the other melee weapons and the melee skill (balance). Did you watch it? I explain that.

It's not overpowered it's just powerful. You don't become invincible wielding it. It fits in the context of the game. And it doesn't negate the point of other melee weapons since it's a lethal melee. Killing npcs with it is noisy and attracts attention.

As for the plot, again there's nothing wrong with it. You uncover miss Chow's plot to turn the triads agains each other and prove it by bringing the sword. Then they make peace.

[LukeTheSp00k]

Originally posted by Sl1ngShot:

Originally posted by TheFilthyCasual:

The way its used as a plot MacGuffin is ludicrous (logic) and it's completely overpowered which negates the purpose of the other melee weapons and the melee skill (balance). Did you watch it? I explain that.

It's not overpowered it's just powerful. You don't become invincible wielding it. It fits in the context of the game. And it doesn't negate the point of other melee weapons since it's a lethal melee. Killing npcs with it is noisy and attracts attention.

As for the plot, again there's nothing wrong with it. You uncover miss Chen's plot to turn the triads agains each other and prove it by bringing the sword. Then they make peace.

The plot isn't the problem, the problem is the MacGuffin driving it (the sword). If you want an explanation why, again, watch the video. That's why I posted it.

Yes it is overpowered. There is no reason to use other melee weapons or even level up your melee skill once you have it because it kills things in 1-3 hits and breaks down doors. The other melee weapons might as well not exist.

The farthest they should have gone was the sword. The Nanosword breaks melee balancing and makes the other weapons redundant.

[BOT Cecil]

Originally posted by TheFilthyCasual:

Originally posted by Sl1ngShot:

It's not overpowered it's just powerful. You don't become invincible wielding it. It fits in the context of the game. And it doesn't negate the point of other melee weapons since it's a lethal melee. Killing npcs with it is noisy and attracts attention.

As for the plot, again there's nothing wrong with it. You uncover miss Chen's plot to turn the triads agains each other and prove it by bringing the sword. Then they make peace.

The plot isn't the problem, the problem is the MacGuffin driving it (the sword). If you want an explanation why, again, watch the video. That's why I posted it.

Yes it is overpowered. There is no reason to use other melee weapons or even level up your melee skill once you have it because it kills things in 1-3 hits and breaks down doors. The other melee weapons might as well not exist.

The farthest they should have gone was the sword. The Nanosword breaks melee balancing and makes the other weapons redundant.

Dude, it's a lethal melee that alerts everyone on a 20 meter radius when you kill someone. Totally useless for non lethal playthroughs. You still need the baton + melee skill + strength aug for those situations. Yeah, it makes the knife and the sword redundant but that's about it.

[LukeTheSp00k]

Originally posted by Sl1ngShot:

Originally posted by TheFilthyCasual:

The plot isn't the problem, the problem is the MacGuffin driving it (the sword). If you want an explanation why, again, watch the video. That's why I posted it.

Yes it is overpowered. There is no reason to use other melee weapons or even level up your melee skill once you have it because it kills things in 1-3 hits and breaks down doors. The other melee weapons might as well not exist.

The farthest they should have gone was the sword. The Nanosword breaks melee balancing and makes the other weapons redundant.

Dude, it's a lethal melee that alerts everyone on a 20 meter radius when you kill someone. Totally useless for non lethal playthroughs. You still need the baton + melee skill + strength aug for those situations. Yeah, it makes the knife and the sword redundant but that's about it.

The AI is too stupid for that to actually be an issue. It's Hong Kong, that's where you get the last of your augs. Cloak + speed/slient + DTS = win. It is useless for a non-lethal playthrough, but there's no real reason to do one of those other than artificial challenge.

[talgaby]

Or because, you know, it is a role-playing game and you are playing as a cop, not some murdering psychopath who thinks Doom is real life.

[LukeTheSp00k]

Originally posted by talgaby:

Or because, you know, it is a role-playing game and you are playing as a cop, not some murdering psychopath who thinks Doom is real life.

You're not a cop, you're a terrorist.

In any case, at least HR tripled your XP for not killing someone (though there was still no penalty for killing them). This game slaps you with dialogue exactly twice for kiling people (Liberty Island and Battery Park), and then never brings it up again. The idea there's a reason to go non-lethal besides personal roleplaying it false, the game doesn't care.

[BOT Cecil]

Originally posted by TheFilthyCasual:

Originally posted by talgaby:

Or because, you know, it is a role-playing game and you are playing as a cop, not some murdering psychopath who thinks Doom is real life.

You're not a cop, you're a terrorist.

In any case, at least HR tripled your XP for not killing someone (though there was still no penalty for killing them). This game slaps you with dialogue exactly twice for kiling people (Liberty Island and Battery Park), and then never brings it up again. The idea there's a reason to go non-lethal besides personal roleplaying it false, the game doesn't care.

Who cares?

This game was released in 2000, in a time when people didn't need achievements or other type of incentives to play a game in a certain way.

[LukeTheSp00k]

Originally posted by Sl1ngShot:

Originally posted by TheFilthyCasual:

You're not a cop, you're a terrorist.

In any case, at least HR tripled your XP for not killing someone (though there was still no penalty for killing them). This game slaps you with dialogue exactly twice for kiling people (Liberty Island and Battery Park), and then never brings it up again. The idea there's a reason to go non-lethal besides personal roleplaying it false, the game doesn't care.

Who cares?

This game was released in 2000, in a time when people didn't need achievements or other type of incentives to play a game in a certain way.

I don't play it non-lethal, and there is no actual gameplay reason for me to do so, then there is literally no reason to use any other melee weapon other than the DTS.

Edit: Better way to put it:

In any unbalanced game you can always say "Well I simply choose to use the inferior weapons for the challenege". Yeah, fine, whatever you want to do. It doesn't mean they aren't inferior.

[BOT Cecil]

Originally posted by TheFilthyCasual:

Originally posted by Sl1ngShot:

Who cares?

This game was released in 2000, in a time when people didn't need achievements or other type of incentives to play a game in a certain way.

I don't play it non-lethal, and there is no actual gameplay reason for me to do so, then there is literally no reason to use any other melee weapon other than the DTS.

Edit: Better way to put it:

In any unbalanced game you can always say "Well I simply choose to use the inferior weapons for the challenege". Yeah, fine, whatever you want to do. It doesn't mean they aren't inferior.

And in most games there's always that one weapon that's better than the rest. In this game, it's the nano sword. And the choice on how you want to play is not only for "unbalanced" games. It works for any game.

And one last thing. I hope when you say the ai is bad, you are playing on realistic. That's how I played it most of the time and I find it pretty difficult even with the sword.

[LukeTheSp00k]

Originally posted by Sl1ngShot:

Originally posted by TheFilthyCasual:

I don't play it non-lethal, and there is no actual gameplay reason for me to do so, then there is literally no reason to use any other melee weapon other than the DTS.

Edit: Better way to put it:

In any unbalanced game you can always say "Well I simply choose to use the inferior weapons for the challenege". Yeah, fine, whatever you want to do. It doesn't mean they aren't inferior.

And in most games there's always that one weapon that's better than the rest. In this game, it's the nano sword. And the choice on how you want to play is not only for "unbalanced" games. It works for any game.

And one last thing. I hope when you say the ai is bad, you are playing on realistic. That's how I played it most of the time and I find it pretty difficult even with the sword.

What I mean is that it's so overpowered compared ot all the other wepaons, so much so that you don't even need to spend points in the melee skill to make it effective, that only masochists and hardcore non-lethalers will ever not use it - it's just a no brainer to use this sword.

Technically, the sword (not the DTS, the regular one) is better than the knife - it makes the knife somewhat redundant unless you like attacking very quickly. It does more damage and can break down doors like the DTS. But it's not so powerful that you don't have to invest points into melee for it to be effective, especially since it swings rather slowly. There's still merit therefore to having the prod as well as the sword, and to putting points into melee if that's the build you want.

With the DTS? Don't need no points, don't need no other melee weapons, since the DTS has no downsides compared to other melee weapons, and to a very very high degree. I can just run around with the sword and put points into other things.

It's why I like the GMDX mod - the DTS was 'reverted' back to its original damage model (when DX first released, as I recall, the DTS was just marginally better than the begular sword - 20 damage per swing or something; then they patched it to do 100 damage) and only became the 1-hit killing machine it is now if you put points into melee. You can't have the best melee weapon in the game while just sinking points into your guns so you can do both, if you want your badass DTS you have to put in the XP.

And as far as I can tell, the only thing the difficulty level effects is the damage they do per shot.