Is the American faction favoured and why?

[h8koN]

To me it seems like most of the decent players tend to favour the American side... It could just be a coincidence, but I find that most of the time, the Americans will always win. Are they stronger? Do the German side need some tweaking, tuning and overall love? What are your thoughts on this matter?

[Emme]

Publicado originalmente por DFC Chuck:

I do not agree with your assertion that BF5 is the definition of game balance.

I think you are confusing the idea of game balance with fast-paced arena shooters somehow. I don't quite understand how you're doing this, but it seems to be how your mind is working.

This is mainly about weapon balance and arcade shooter like BFV managed to have a nice balance but for the cost of authenticity. Same is what you are asking for when you want to nerf u.s. weaponry to death just because of the Kar98.

Publicado originalmente por DFC Chuck:

HLL's defining features that separate it from other games are it's accessibility and it's emphasis on communication and team co-operation. This is it's niche. The Battlefield series has been sliding towards fast-paced infantry-only combat for a long time, and sliding away from the coordinated squad movements that used to be the case around BF2. This is why I have no interest in that series anymore.

Neither do I, not even what I am talking about. You're missing the whole point!
And if this is it's niche then why all of this crying about the u.s. having semi-auto advantage?

Publicado originalmente por DFC Chuck:

If you want "authentic ww2", then there are many other games that work on filling this niche. This is not a rare box for games to tick.

It's not about what is already there, it's about what Devs 'n Bakers want this game to be. You're also missing the point here as you seem to simply not understand this simple little fact. Which makes the discussion completely obsolete tbh.

Publicado originalmente por DFC Chuck:

To shoot down your central assertion one more time: "Balanced" does not mean "Make it fast-paced like BF5".

You can not balance ww2 weapons in a non arcade game! This is my only assertion. Next point you're missing. Maybe something in your mind not working?

[[DFC] Chuck]

Why do you continue to conflate balance with arcade-y gameplay? Weapons can, and should, be balanced in a game. This does not mean they should be made more arcade-y and fast paced.

[Sleepy_Walker]

I feel the big thing is that the community has identified some possible paths for balance as we see it now. Nobody really knows how yet-to-be introduced factors will affect the balance. My question is if it is really so imbalanced that the devs need to make a change immediately or can they wait a bit for a few things to drop first?

I mean I see a lot of arguing and constructive comments about balance, but the current way of things is going to change due to other factors after the next update and perhaps again right after that.



Just so my stance is clear. I think 98k firing this slow is not the worst thing in the world. I also think that a slightly quickened fire rate is really a minor change that does little for the bigger role or effectiveness of the weapon. It is so minor that it could be done and almost nothing would change besides people being slightly less frustrated. Adjustable sights or being zeroed in to a longer range (I think it is roughly at 100m right now) would make the weapon far far better at this juncture.

(personally I think bullet penetration will pump up garand, gewher, BAR, STG, MGs, strafing run, and medics a lot. Pump up 98k a smidge. Reduce SMGs, pistols, and M1 carbine, if only because now they have less cover to hide behind and work almost the same.

Grass update will be almost the opposite effect, as it will be easier to get closer so long as you go slower.

Cover is getting weaker while concealment is getting stronger. That alone will be a big change.)

[Emme]

Publicado originalmente por DFC Chuck:

Why do you continue to conflate balance with arcade-y gameplay? Weapons can, and should, be balanced in a game. This does not mean they should be made more arcade-y and fast paced.

No you can't balance a semi-auto and a bolt-action rifle! Not without nerfing SA's to death or making Bolts unrealisticaly op! Both would result in hurting the authenticity of the game whether the Garand not having it's advantages as a semi-auto nor the Kar98 having it's disadvantages as bolt-action.

In a ww2 game this is always in conflict with each other, but it is what it is. And yet people still act like upset about. So how can someone not baking the game even demand this compromise from any baker? Again for you to note HLL was praised to be authentic / realistic. Most people around here are simply not interested in having a balance at the cost of that, because they simply don't mind it as it has been this way irl. So what else to get around this problem?

In the end what it means is when buying HLL you agree that SA's will still have the better ROF and the better handling like it was irl. So live with it or play game's like BFV that have unrealistic but balanced gunplay!

You could've find that in my initial post if you were able to sort things instead of making wild assumptions and twisting my words!

[Emme]

Publicado originalmente por Sleepy_Walker:

I feel the big thing is that the community has identified some possible paths for balance as we see it now. Nobody really knows how yet-to-be introduced factors will affect the balance. My question is if it is really so imbalanced that the devs need to make a change immediately or can they wait a bit for a few things to drop first?

I mean I see a lot of arguing and constructive comments about balance, but the current way of things is going to change due to other factors after the next update and perhaps again right after that.



Just so my stance is clear. I think 98k firing this slow is not the worst thing in the world. I also think that a slightly quickened fire rate is really a minor change that does little for the bigger role or effectiveness of the weapon. It is so minor that it could be done and almost nothing would change besides people being slightly less frustrated. Adjustable sights or being zeroed in to a longer range (I think it is roughly at 100m right now) would make the weapon far far better at this juncture.

(personally I think bullet penetration will pump up garand, gewher, BAR, STG, MGs, strafing run, and medics a lot. Pump up 98k a smidge. Reduce SMGs, pistols, and M1 carbine, if only because now they have less cover to hide behind and work almost the same.

Grass update will be almost the opposite effect, as it will be easier to get closer so long as you go slower.

Cover is getting weaker while concealment is getting stronger. That alone will be a big change.)

You're absolutely right! Buff the Kar if you need to, but it will stay a Kar! HLL needs to be feature completed before final tweaking. People are crying all the time about everything and do not have any patience to wait until this game hit's end of beta. Why balancing any weapon even if there's not the ballistics fully implemented yet?

[Sleepy_Walker]

Publicado originalmente por Emme:

You're absolutely right! Buff the Kar if you need to, but it will stay a Kar! HLL needs to be feature completed before final tweaking. People are crying all the time about everything and do not have any patience to wait until this game hit's end of beta. Why balancing any weapon even if there's not the ballistics fully implemented yet?

The best reason to balance the weapons along the way is because people are playing the early access game as... well pretty much a game. I know I do. I am just not sure that a balance pass should be done right now. I mean I could see a run done on the tanks, just because they will most likely change little in the near future and they kinda throw other things off. Even if it is just looking at fuel costs.

If the penetration and grass update come next big patch (fingers crossed, cause I want both and it sounded so close to complete), then I could see a small arms balance pass done soon after that.

I have my own opinions on how things could be balanced (some ideas I am sure some would be opposed to), but I can still have a really good time as the game is right now. *shrug*

[Emme]

Absolutely sharing these thoughts. This is exactly what I am thinking all the time and foremost in all of these balance discussions around here. The game is not that bad as a lot of people want it to be and in terms of balance I win a lot of matches even playing as axis. If there's ever been a promising ea title with Dev's that can do it right then it's HLL imo!

[[DFC] Chuck]

Please stop being willfully obtuse, Emme.

I have never said or implied that I wanted the rate of fire between the bolt action rifle and the semi-auto to be equal.

You are arguing against a hallucinated strawman, not my words.

Your angry rants are based on a false foundation. This is why I don't consider anything you say to be legitimate.

[h8koN]

Publicado originalmente por Emme:

Absolutely sharing these thoughts. This is exactly what I am thinking all the time and foremost in all of these balance discussions around here. The game is not that bad as a lot of people want it to be and in terms of balance I win a lot of matches even playing as axis. If there's ever been a promising ea title with Dev's that can do it right then it's HLL imo!

HLL is a great game so far even with its problems and like you mentioned, the dev team seem transparent with the community. But, there are some minor and major issues that needs addressing before the full release. This game is FAR from flawless.

[MaX-NOR]

It works fine now. Just unlock more wepond if you want some different. Rifles are great at long distances and with pistol up close you can make a stand on different ranges.

[Burrgon]

My genuine response would be that the factions (for the record I prefer the Germans personally) could be better balanced with what they already currently have:
-The K98 just feels broken at range half the time which needs fixed
-I think the M1 Carbine is a little too good at everything, especially now the rifleman gets it
-German tanks need beefed up or be of reduced cost than they are currently are
-Not sure how I feel about adding more automatics to the Germans, the second Rifleman class would be pretty good if pistols got a little bit of a buff

[Kael]

the germans simply need more equipment avaiable than the US.
Even in Reality the germans had more equipment than the US in general. Because of Beutewaffen or some other Stuff.

US: Smoke + Handgrenade
Germans: Smoke + Stiehlhandgranate + Geballte Ladung

Anti Tank Weapons?
US mostly Bazooka in Infantry

Germans:
Panzerfaust, Panzermine, Panzerschreck, Panzerjagdgewehr, Panzerbüchsen etc. etc.

You could fix the german side by giving them a better 'Defense' capability. Like building bunkers, razor-wire and many many other stuff.


About the K98k -> Yea it COULD bolt a bit faster. You can shoot it fast if you are experienced with it.
But even in RL the M1 Garand was better in near-fights.
The Problem is, is that the MG 42 cant be equipped on pickup. Or "planted" for other soldiers. In germany we have Lafetten where you can place the MG's on it and you can shoot them while you sit down and dont need to see the enemy. You simply have to 'get them in position' and you can shoot.


Its completly fine to have 'not so good' weapony on the german side. But you need stuff to compensate it.
Like:

Panzerfaust for Riflemen (not reloadable)
Entrenching on Pioneer (Yea , rename the Engineer plz. Engineers arent a thing in Wehrmacht)
Mortars

and so on.

[Tomus]

What you need is a main weapon that works - the KAR is inaccurate too slow and feels absolutely useless. I preferred it before when it was still worse than the Garand - as it should be - but still felt viable and useful. Now - unless I am very close I cannot land hits with the KAR as I can with the Garand.

Nobody is asking for the weapon to be as good as the US weapon - we just want it viable again.

[Kael]

You also have to remember that because the bad ingame performance you sometimes simply dont hit.

[Emme]

Publicado originalmente por DFC Chuck:

Please stop being willfully obtuse, Emme.

I have never said or implied that I wanted the rate of fire between the bolt action rifle and the semi-auto to be equal.

You are arguing against a hallucinated strawman, not my words.

Your angry rants are based on a false foundation.

Mate this is an open discussion for everyone and not a parade between you and me. So how is it my fault if you feel engaged by my posts? Just a reminder, you are the one who answered my initial post acting personaly affected!

I read your comments as I did with any other throughout the entire thread and I get the idea of your opinion based on what you said here. And even if I weren't reading your stuff, why acting the way you do yet when you're the one that immediately got triggered from my initial post starting this "personal debate" with me?

Again you are wrong assuming I would be angry in any way! And you're the one beeing completely obtuse. Don't kinda twist things up again as you seem to do all the time!

Not sure why you think that you would bother me in any meaningful way. All I do is simply answer posts. And I also don't know why it is so hard to just read the stuff that people write here and take it as it's been said instead of trying to twist things around until it fits to what you think that people should have said?!

I told you earlier there must be something wrong in your mind...

And my foundation is based on my personal opionion about what kind of a game HLL is and what the Dev's and Bakers plan it to be - against rantings from guys like you that somehow do not want to understand this.

Publicado originalmente por DFC Chuck:

This is why I don't consider anything you say to be legitimate.

Good! Then finally stop arguing with me if you're not interested and don't act like I would force you to do so!