MG's need some std. ADS zoom

[Spitzer_DK]

Currently the MGs are little too limited by their lack of standard ADS zoom (i.e. zoom without holding down shift), which makes them too ineffective at range.

Historically MGs were more capable of maintaining a "no go" zone, as an MG'er had just an easy of a time seeing a target as a regular rifleman - MG'ers didnt somehow have worse eyesight after all ;)

Since you're aiming for historical accuracy & realism (premise of the game as pr. you the devs), then I think you need to address this.

MG's need to become a bit more prominant (powerful) in their presence, as they were/are in real life, and giving them at 1/2-3/4rds the std. ADS zoom of the normal rifles ingame will help with that.

EDIT: Just noticed that for some 'god knows why' reason this only applies to German MG's ingame, the US M1919 MG gets regular ADS zoom + shift zoom. So, unless it's a bug, it would appear the devs decided to selectively nerf the German MG class here.

[Cylixx]

Or remove all zoom because it's stupid.

[Hal]

Originally posted by Cylixx:

Or remove all zoom because it's stupid.

I'm sick of people pretending they don't have a 1.25x Zoom when they squint their eyes.

[DrunkBunny94]

You have it the wrong way around.

The zoom isn't stupid it's the only way we can get both an accurate visual of objects far away as well as having some peripheral vision.

Like someone 100m irl is about the size of 1 of my thumb joint when I stretch out my arm - but in-game he's tiny like a grain of rice, because you are visualising 90-120FoV on a monitor that is taking up maybe 30-40 your FoV but the. If you played at 30-40FoV constantly thing would feel weird and slow because you lack your peripheral vision.

The "zoom" is supposed to replicate what you would actually see irl while when you are moving the game zooms out to give you better awareness.

[Cptn_Miller]

mg's need a lot of work

been like this for a long time, don't expect much... like actually being able to set it up reliably.

[[Imp] Doggo]

MG's in WWII were mostly used as a weapon of suppression. Killing someone was just a side effect.

They were often fed with tracer ammunition, so the gunner wouldn't need to use a scope/rail w/e to aim. Just spray and adjust.

[Spitzer_DK]

Originally posted by Panzerkadsn:

MG's in WWII were mostly used as a weapon of suppression. Killing someone was just a side effect.

They were often fed with tracer ammunition, so the gunner wouldn't need to use a scope/rail w/e to aim. Just spray and adjust.

Incorrect, machine guns were infact the main infantry killers on all sides if we're talking just small arms and don't include other weapon systems. So to claim that they were meant merely to suppress is quite simply false, when in actuality that was actually the side effect, and a logical one.

Also MG's are fed with tracer ammunition mainly because this allows you to "walk in" the bullets on targets at range more easily, esp. at night where iron sights are difficult to use. Tracers have other benefits as well, which you could refer to as beneficial side effects, such as being able to light flammable materials on fire, and being useful for marking/directing fire at targets for other weapons.

Served as a section MG'er myself back in the 2000's, and used the MG3, and I can assure you it's meant to kill anything you can see and only suppress that which you cannot see - and as such it very much emplores your enemy to stay hidden. In other words it's a killing machine, one of the best, hence why it's been in use till now. Come into its line of fire within 300 m, and you're as good as dead if the gunner is a seasoned one. The thing spurts out 20 bullets a second, and deployed on its bipod it doesn't have any issues with muzzle climb (recoil goes straight back, and the gun vibrates, that's it), so it's easy to hold the target within the cone of fire.

Long story short, in real life the LMG or GPMG is effective at "suppressing" the enemy for a reason, because they know that if they venture out where it can see you, you're mostly likely soon to be leaving the realm of the living = it's meant primarily to kill, a lot, and very quickly, period.

[wmd24]

As a young Infantry weapons squad leader back in day I can assure you machine guns kill, they have range, rate of fire, penetration, and when mounted deadly accuracy. As per WWII I suggest reading Hein Severloh's service memoir, WN62: A German Soldier's Memories of the Defense of Omaha Beach Normandy, June 6, 1944.

A typical German squad had a three man MG42 team, Allied M1919 Browning MGs were not deployed at the squad level, so there were a lot fewer of them. In game play people moan about how under gunned the Germans are but in reality I think the Germans actually had the upper hand because of their utilization of the MG42, which was a very effective doctrine. I would like to see MGs with some bigger nuts in the game, fewer for the US, and more for the Germans. Although this could jack up the game play, we have a good balance right now. But, if we were to experiment maybe make them crew served.

[Benny]

MG42 in this game is amazing, one of my favourite weapons of all time. I can play a round and dig in and get some amazing kill streaks at massive range with it (tap fire for those pixels moving in the distance at longer range) = Dink, dead. The thing with an MG is having a good spot with a good offensive team pushing that you can sit behind and pick the enemy team off and suppress. Its all about the prime spot with the MG its a totally different play style. On the flip side if your on the defending team you need that same recipe, that hole or window you can just rain hell from. You also need to learn to move if they realise where the hail of bullets is coming from, wait, locate the enemy and not just sit there spraying giving and your'e self away. As the MG you are not the front line you are the fear of death for the attackers that lets your team move in.


Filthy Camper achievement completed with MG42 :) only 6% of players have it. Only class i play in the game. Also helps having a full squad of friends on coms. Coms are key in this game.

[Roninman]

Originally posted by Panzerkadsn:

MG's in WWII were mostly used as a weapon of suppression. Killing someone was just a side effect.

They were often fed with tracer ammunition, so the gunner wouldn't need to use a scope/rail w/e to aim. Just spray and adjust.

Actually they were main infantry carried weapon for amount of kills they made. Second war mortars. Main issue here is lack of suppression from MG fire though and lack of weapon sway from opposing side.

[Pan_de]

This is the first thread though that says MGs need a buff, when literally everyone complaining that they are too strong even at range.

[Medryn]

Originally posted by Spitzer_DK:

Originally posted by Panzerkadsn:

MG's in WWII were mostly used as a weapon of suppression. Killing someone was just a side effect.

They were often fed with tracer ammunition, so the gunner wouldn't need to use a scope/rail w/e to aim. Just spray and adjust.

Incorrect, machine guns were infact the main infantry killers on all sides if we're talking just small arms and don't include other weapon systems. So to claim that they were meant merely to suppress is quite simply false, when in actuality that was actually the side effect, and a logical one.

Also MG's are fed with tracer ammunition mainly because this allows you to "walk in" the bullets on targets at range more easily, esp. at night where iron sights are difficult to use. Tracers have other benefits as well, which you could refer to as beneficial side effects, such as being able to light flammable materials on fire, and being useful for marking/directing fire at targets for other weapons.

Served as a section MG'er myself back in the 2000's, and used the MG3, and I can assure you it's meant to kill anything you can see and only suppress that which you cannot see - and as such it very much emplores your enemy to stay hidden. In other words it's a killing machine, one of the best, hence why it's been in use till now. Come into its line of fire within 300 m, and you're as good as dead if the gunner is a seasoned one. The thing spurts out 20 bullets a second, and deployed on its bipod it doesn't have any issues with muzzle climb (recoil goes straight back, and the gun vibrates, that's it), so it's easy to hold the target within the cone of fire.

Long story short, in real life the LMG or GPMG is effective at "suppressing" the enemy for a reason, because they know that if they venture out where it can see you, you're mostly likely soon to be leaving the realm of the living = it's meant primarily to kill, a lot, and very quickly, period.

Gonna need a source on that dawg

[Spitzer_DK]

Source on what? Have you ever actually handled an MG or been trained in its use and learned about its military history?

[Spitzer_DK]

Originally posted by benji-SFN-:

MG42 in this game is amazing, one of my favourite weapons of all time. I can play a round and dig in and get some amazing kill streaks at massive range with it (tap fire for those pixels moving in the distance at longer range) = Dink, dead. The thing with an MG is having a good spot with a good offensive team pushing that you can sit behind and pick the enemy team off and suppress. Its all about the prime spot with the MG its a totally different play style. On the flip side if your on the defending team you need that same recipe, that hole or window you can just rain hell from. You also need to learn to move if they realise where the hail of bullets is coming from, wait, locate the enemy and not just sit there spraying giving and your'e self away. As the MG you are not the front line you are the fear of death for the attackers that lets your team move in.


Filthy Camper achievement completed with MG42 :) only 6% of players have it. Only class i play in the game. Also helps having a full squad of friends on coms. Coms are key in this game.

I'm not saying that you can't do well with the MGs ingame, you definitely can, but the same is true for most of the weapons. What I'm saying is that the MGs shouldn't be artificially limited to be less effective than they really were/are in real life, hence give them the same conditions for spotting as the other weapons, i.e. the same zoom levels to emulate the ability of the human eye to focus.

[Pan_de]

aLL I know is when I play mp I dont ever use focus because spraying is super effective.

[alphajim49]

Nope. It's already deadly enough when used by good players, no need to add some zoom to make every MG even more laser zapper.