Increasing Squad Sizes

[Beans]

I know this has been talked about before but I wanted to list why I think squad sizes should be increased to 8 or 9 instead of the current 6.

Command chat/ Communication:
• It’s no surprise that as a squad leader and commander command chat is very congested at times and loud. Many people talk at once making it so you can’t hear what your squad member are saying. Increasing squad sizes would drastically decrease the number of people in command chat (less squad leaders). With the increase we’d be seeing something like 4-5 squads compared to the 6-9 we have now. This would make communication a lot better and less congested. Later I’ll go further on somethings that could be made to prevent tons of 2-3 man locked squads.

Roles/ Classes:
• With the current squad sizes only 5 out of the 8 roles are chosen in the load outs (this is excluding squad leader). Increasing squad size to let’s say 9 people (including squad leader) all the classes would be picked. This means a squad would have a medic, support, etc. which squads commonly are without but are very needed. What am trying to get at is increasing squad sizes would solve other problems.

• By increasing squad sizes this would also decrease the amount of Anti-Tank soldiers running around the field which I know many tankers have complained about as there’s sometimes 6-8 of them which gets very annoying and the ease of getting more rockets is quite easy.

• Going off of the last statement this would also decrease number of rarer firearms seen in WW2 which includes the STG44. The devs could also take a more realistic/ asymmetrical route for weaponry within squads. Making the German squads be able have more machine guns and the US less, which is realistic.

Class Restrictions/ Preventing 2 Man Squads:
• To prevent people from creating a squad with only a few people in it and keeping it locked I suggest that until a squad is filled up to 7 members (this is using a 9 man squad size) that squad members can only use the rifleman class. This would prevent small locked squads created for the sole purpose of cherry picking a specific classes. Instead people would have to use the rifleman until more people join or they are forced to join another squad.

• They could go even further with this by making it so if the Squad leader doesn’t have a certain amount of people in their squad that the timer to put down another Outpost will be increased or even to redeploy on it. This would be a very drastic counter-measure but would work to prevent these small locked squads.

Fire teams/ Splitting Up the Squad:

• This idea to me seems really cool. So let’s say the squad size is 9 alright. As the squad leader you could create fire teams within your squad. Fire teams would consist of up to 3 squad members that the squad leader can choose and assign a task to them through verbal communication. So like this fire team would go after a tank, this fire team of 3 members goes on the offense while the fire team consisting of the squad leader stays and
defends this house. I feel like this could create a lot of cool tactics and strategies and go further for hell let loose to be a different game.


Well this what I got to say. Feel free to leave any comments, suggestions, or feedback.

[Spy]

not good..

[=7CAV=SPC.Henson.K]

I would like to see a larger squad size. There aren't enough squad members to effectively fight as a squad. It takes 2 squads to do what a normal squad of 9-12 should be capable of doing.
As to the command channel, most of what I hear is, "I just killed a guy" or, "I just took down a garrison". The only chat that should be going on in this channel is instructions from the commander and requests for support from the SLs. Comms discipline needs to be enforced by the commander.

[Doyle]

Honestly this would be nice. There would be less people in squad chat destroying my ears as well. I love playing squad leader in litterally any game besides this game because of how the squad voip functions.

[Fosty]

Yeah larger squads would be good.

[Chef]

A game starting with six and running nearly 2 years changing now would be an issue for a few reasons.
1. We still have 1, 2 and 3 member locked sqauds
2. Comms in a larger squad will be...difficult
3. Controlling 8 or 9 players as opposed to 6 will also be an issue
That's just the beginning and the result may well be less participation.
Now some day when there are server mods and the owners can change things like squad size I would certainly give that server a roll to see how it works, but giving the pub matches larger squads has it's potential errors.

[Coucheese]

Originally posted by Chef:

A game starting with six and running nearly 2 years changing now would be an issue for a few reasons.
1. We still have 1, 2 and 3 member locked sqauds
2. Comms in a larger squad will be...difficult
3. Controlling 8 or 9 players as opposed to 6 will also be an issue
That's just the beginning and the result may well be less participation.
Now some day when there are server mods and the owners can change things like squad size I would certainly give that server a roll to see how it works, but giving the pub matches larger squads has it's potential errors.

All of these are non issues. If you actually squad lead in any game like Project reality and Squad you will see how possible it is.

[Sybanni]

Beans +1

[Mr. President]

Focusing on the effects of squad management is misguided. The real effect this has is reducing the amount OPs on the field which in turn (counterintuitively for some) INCREASES the potential volatility of encounters where OPs are wiped since they account for a greater proportion of the team now.

[TankGoodness]

yes it could be a good thing. I would like to see 2 medics in a squad and 2 AT
Though Chef has a point about Comms being noisier...then again, sometimes squads as they are now can be too quiet.

[Roninman]

Originally posted by Chef:

A game starting with six and running nearly 2 years changing now would be an issue for a few reasons.
1. We still have 1, 2 and 3 member locked sqauds
2. Comms in a larger squad will be...difficult
3. Controlling 8 or 9 players as opposed to 6 will also be an issue
That's just the beginning and the result may well be less participation.
Now some day when there are server mods and the owners can change things like squad size I would certainly give that server a roll to see how it works, but giving the pub matches larger squads has it's potential errors.

1. Preventing locked squads is up to server rules
2. No it wont be, played other games?
3- No it wont be, played other games?

Other games with similar gameplay have 8 man squads, issue aint controlling. Issue in THIS game is many players who are not willing to communicate or dont have mics

[[BLK] Telu]

I don't like the class restriction suggestion. Seem a crap idea for me.
For the commander/squad communication problem, i just nomitate someone officer in my squad. His duty is to answer to squad request if i don't answer. You should try to do that. That's fix communication problem for me. ;)

[Roninman]

Originally posted by FWS Telu:

I don't like the class restriction suggestion. Seem a crap idea for me.
For the commander/squad communication problem, i just nomitate someone officer in my squad. His duty is to answer to squad request if i don't answer. You should try to do that. That's fix communication problem for me. ;)

If you are SL you are responsible for communication within and outside your Squad. Shooting enemies comes second. Thats your role

[[BLK] Telu]

That's why i nominate an officer. In case where Squad and command chanel are speaking at the same time.

[FrankyFourFingers]

The only benefit in increasing squad size is taking stragglers who otherwise would have started leaderless squads because they dont want to lead.

There is no step in preventing them from starting smaller squads to unlock specialized classes.

[ElectroLite]

Solid suggestions.

You'll get arguments against this like controlling 8 people will be a lot harder than 5, but the fact is, those extra people will be unresponsive no matter squad size. I'd rather have a squad of 9 where 5 people are listening than a squad of six where 2 people are. With smaller squads you also end up with entire squads without an SL that are totally unresponsive.

Post Scriptum has a very good way of managing squads. (before people comment, no, I don't think HLL should become a copy of PS, but PS does have some much much more clever concepts that could be implemented in HLL in their own way.).

1) 9 man squads means max 6-7 SL's in the command chat. I've played games of HLL with 15+ Squads.

2) The SL needs 1 Radioman or 2 squad members to be able to place an outpost. This prevents rogue small squads and promotes teamwork.

3) A squad needs 4 players before anyone can pick a special class. Again, this prevents multiple rogue small squads and spamming special classes like AT.

4) Each squad can have I think 3-4 special classes. So most squads end up with and SL, Radioman, MG, AT, Marksman and the rest medics/riflemen.

5) A Squad must have an SL

There are some other benefits of this, like the removal of the WW2 proximity sensors that are OPs. As it stands, well placed Garrisons and OPs can act as an early warning system for enemy attacks, allowing defending teams to react faster and making the game more static. I personally, would love to see this gone.

The trouble is, these changes have a really wide impact on the game and that's what I think a lot of people don't realise and is one of the main issues HLL are having as a whole at the moment.

As Mr President correctly points out. Taking down 1 OP can put a serious dent in the enemies attack. In PS this makes SLs position their OPs a safer distance away, which means more running to get into the action and more frustration if you arrive and die. In PS they combat this slightly by allowing your teammates to res you. Also OPs must be destroyed with an explosive and don't just pop if the enemy accidentally gets close enough.

Imagine in HLL having to run further, die, have no medic to res you (because people currently don't play the role enough), then watching your OP vanish because some rogue enemy happened to walk past it. And since you were the only flanking squad, you lose the flank and have to start the whole thing again.

I agree with the suggestions, but HLL's biggest problem is they don't have the refined ecosystem and clear direction for the game that would allow for these changes without it having as much of a negative effect on game play as a positive.