Skivver Whys?

[bbfloyd]

Almost every upgraded piece of equipment does everything the lower grade of equipment does, but the Advanced Skivver does NOTHING that the Basic Skivver does ???

Kinda weird IMHO.

[Sapphire Rose]

I also think it would be nice if either the Advanced or some sort of another upgrade to the Basic would allow for more than 10 items (also perhaps quicker speed) at a time to be made.

[Damoncord]

Part of me thinks it's gotta be something they overlooked.

[Guh~hey~hey~♫]

More importantly.

1 Fury scarf = 4 treads

1 Tread = 2 furs

1 Fur = 5 Worn furs

You get 1 worn fur per colorful lama killed...

Let's do the math: to make a single furry scarf you need to kill 5 x 2 x 4 = 40 Lamas !!!

That's aproximatively four times the entire population of colorful lamas at Portia.... (I didnt include the count of trees needed for the tree saps)

Now fun part: the comission asking 3 fury scarf actually ask you to decimate, 3 x 4, 12 times all the colorfull lamas on the map aka 120 of them.... Now I wonder what's exactly the size of these "scarf" that need the skin of 40 lamas per unit...

If they gonna somehow enhance the skivers, they should make these machines use more than 5 hairs per fur to make material....

but now that I think of it, it would make more sense if treads were made out of cotton or whool. Cant even begin to imagine how the hell could one make treads out of furs ?

[Damoncord]

There is also the normal fur drop item.

[Guh~hey~hey~♫]

Yeah sometimes you can drop a fur directly, once every 5-6 lamas if you re lucky.

That doesnt change the math enough to make sense in my book.

Also it's a game about crafting, materials needed to make stuff have to make sense somehow. You use fish and rice to make paella, not copper ore and wood.
Tread is made out of whool or cotton, not animal furs ....

[Flyrija]

Originally posted by Sakamoto:

Yeah sometimes you can drop a fur directly, once every 5-6 lamas if you re lucky.

That doesnt change the math enough to make sense in my book.

Also it's a game about crafting, materials needed to make stuff have to make sense somehow. You use fish and rice to make paella, not copper ore and wood.
Tread is made out of whool or cotton, not animal furs ....

You can also get fur as normal drop from the monsters in the collapsed wasteland.

[JVC]

The mechanics regarding furs and quality leather is broken. It takes way too much effort to gather stuff for a few pieces of fiber cloth or quality leather, compared to the value gained by e.g. selling small satchels.

If Carol's store at least sold quality leather, then it would be possible to simply throw money at the problem. Alas no such luck. At least she sells the fiber cloth used for Dee Dee stops and for waterproof cloth. Waterproof cloth is also extremely expensive in resources.

[Ihateeverybody]

Originally posted by Sakamoto:

Yeah sometimes you can drop a fur directly, once every 5-6 lamas if you re lucky.

That doesnt change the math enough to make sense in my book.

Also it's a game about crafting, materials needed to make stuff have to make sense somehow. You use fish and rice to make paella, not copper ore and wood.
Tread is made out of whool or cotton, not animal furs ....

I know very very very little about the art of weaving. I do know thread is/has been made from lots of different materials in different places. Plants, Animals, etc. Its the combination of the various things that make a thread of that material. I want to say combining the materials is Carding? I have been exposed to the concepts, I have no interest in the art. I think the games process is simplified but not necessarily incorrect (Not any more than cooking or smelting).

[deanbarrett1]

Most of the fabric based items make no sense, linen isn't really used for anything (other than gifting to carol), Sakamotos' example of furry scarfs, we all know the problems with delicate fur and quality leather, and yeah the advanced skiver is useless except for a couple of carpets and the waterproof cloth (which is only used for commisions you can easily ignore).
The only one you really need to get is Fibre cloth and that becomes pretty much unneeded in late game.

That whole side of the game needs a complete overhaul. I'm hopeful it's in the list of things to do.

The thing is many other basic mechanics (optimisation/balancing/quest pacing/some of the UI) still need work.
I fear though that as more and more players who know nothing about how Alpha stage game development works join the game and these discussions, and they keep demanding more and more from the devs like dialogue/sounds/more this/more that etc,etc,etc that the dev team are already starting to get overstretched and basic things like this will be missed or overlooked while they try to appease those who know nothing about how game development should progress. I've seen it happen before with Steam's Early Aceess as a game gets hyped by streamers and good reviews and too many people start to play it thinking it should be the "finished"article.

[Guh~hey~hey~♫]

Well the closest item we got from whool in the game would be "Colorfull fur" from the colorfull lamas.

We got cotton from planter boxes too.

Another one who could somehow make sense would be the "Linen" from planter boxes too.

But well if you could basically make some sort of tread out of anything, animal skins isnt the most practical and the 3 other alternatives I mentionned make way more sense... if it isnt needed in ridiculous quantity per unit...

[Damoncord]

I think y'all may be missing that the ingredients drop from more than one mob.

Llamas drop commonly worn, and furs

Panbats can drop worn and regular fur.

Bandirats can drop worn fur

Slurpee drops Fur, Delicate fur, and Blue Leather.

Illusion Bunnies can drop delicate fur

[Keiss]

I think they should approach the problem a different way, tbh. Let's say, in real life, I sheer an animal. The quality of work I do, and the kind of wool I am sheering can determine the final product I am making.

Wool that is composed of short fibers would not be used for woven fabrics or fabrics with a very smooth finish, like say... a shirt. They use long fiber wool for this.

The process of carding is used mostly on short fibered wool intended to be spun into thread for knitting and here, the quality of wool plays a huge role in this. That soft woolen sweater you have is probably belly wool or lambs wool.

The liner in your coat is probably the lowest quality wool because it's rough and won't likely be worn against the skin.




So with that explanation out of the way, I propose this system instead:

Animals drop "pelt" upon death. Some animals, like a llama, would drop more "pelt" than something like a panbat. Your skivver now has two options: fine wool, which is produced at say a 1:1 ratio (one pelt = 1 fine wool) and coarse wool, 1 pelt = 3 coarse wool. You can skip the steps about carding or spinning since that just seems unnecessary for this.

Coarse wool could then be processed into things requiring fur or worn fur, and fine wool would replace delicate fur. It also makes more sense from a resource perspective since, well, llamas have a ton of wool that doesn't require a lot of maintenance before storing or processing. Sheep's wool needs to be washed (and dried) first.

I would actually prefer a wool vs skin system, since I don't think you'd get good results sheering an animal pelt after it's been removed from the body.

I used to work on a wool farm back in high school, so I know a lot about sheep, llamas, and Alpacas and how various wools are used and processed.

I would not use regular llama wool to make a shirt and I wouldn't use alpaca wool to make a felted fabric. And honestly, you can make a lot of great fabric with natural fibers. Linen is made up of a plant called flax, and it's probably 99% of what we wear.

[Guh~hey~hey~♫]

Originally posted by Damoncord:

I think y'all may be missing that the ingredients drop from more than one mob.

Llamas drop commonly worn, and furs

Panbats can drop worn and regular fur.

Bandirats can drop worn fur

Slurpee drops Fur, Delicate fur, and Blue Leather.

Illusion Bunnies can drop delicate fur

The issue I was pointing is more about how many monsters you need to kill to craft a single scarf than from what kind of monster that material is coming from (Also that imho it would make more sense to make tread out of whool or cotton, but it's only mho as stated).

[Damoncord]

Originally posted by Sakamoto:

More importantly.

1 Fury scarf = 4 treads

1 Tread = 2 furs

1 Fur = 5 Worn furs

You get 1 worn fur per colorful lama killed...

I think this part is where you're blowing it out of proportion you jump straight to the most complex way of making it.

1 Scarf = 4 thread
4 threads = 8 furs

That can be as few as 8 Slurpees to get the furs, the other combine is to give you more options to use that REALLY COMMON worn fur.

[deanbarrett1]

Originally posted by Damoncord:

Originally posted by Sakamoto:

More importantly.

1 Fury scarf = 4 treads

1 Tread = 2 furs

1 Fur = 5 Worn furs

You get 1 worn fur per colorful lama killed...

I think this part is where you're blowing it out of proportion you jump straight to the most complex way of making it.

1 Scarf = 4 thread
4 threads = 8 furs

That can be as few as 8 Slurpees to get the furs, the other combine is to give you more options to use that REALLY COMMON worn fur.

Still doesn't explain why the fabric side of the game is mainly very unbalnced or why so many of them are pretty much useless, or why we have an advanced skiver that's more piontless than a basic skiver.